NASCAR Racing 2

Papyrus · released 1996 · discussed in 19,840 posts, 1995-2011 · overall tone mixed

Posts per month

Timeline

• 1996-05-09 Sierra listed NASCAR Racing 2 for fall 1996, and Rick Genter confirmed it was in development. post post
• 1996-05-17 At E3, Papyrus announced NASCAR Racing 2 for November 1996 with 8-player IPX play. It also announced a NASCAR PlayStation version. post post
• 1996-05-17 Papyrus and NASCAR announced the NASCAR Racing League online service, which NASCAR sanctioned as its 13th division. post post
• 1996-05-30 Papyrus producer Adam Levesque outlined NASCAR Racing 2's features, including a spotter, a crew chief and race weekends. thread
• 1996-06-15 Papyrus confirmed that NASCAR Racing 2 would be a DOS game, while the NASCAR Racing League front end would need Windows 95. thread post
• 1996-09-23 Papyrus released the NASCAR Racing 2 demo with Atlanta and Watkins Glen. thread post post
• 1996-10-04 Papyrus announced Rendition Verite support for IndyCar Racing II and NASCAR Racing 2. thread post
• 1996-11-12 Papyrus announced that NASCAR Racing 2 would miss its Thanksgiving release because of multiplayer problems. thread post
• 1996-11-20 The NASCAR Racing League barred people with access to unfair setup information, aimed at IVGA staff, from sanctioned events. IVGA then ended support for its FASTLAP and HOTLAP software. thread post post
• 1996-11-25 NASCAR Racing 2 went gold. thread post
• 1996-12-02 Sierra announced and began shipping NASCAR Racing 2, with copies in US stores from December 4. thread post post
• 1996-12-04 Buyers found that the NASCAR Racing League, renamed NASCAR Racing Online, would run only on the TEN service at about $30 a month. thread post post
• 1996-12-19 Sierra released an automatic update fixing a NASCAR Racing 2 install bug that broke Internet Explorer 3.0. post post
• 1997-03-19 Jim Sokoloff confirmed that a post in his name claiming the NASCAR Racing 2 patch was cancelled was a forgery. Readers traced it to Richard Manning, and his ISP closed his account. thread post
• 1997-04-24 Sierra released the NASCAR Racing 2 v1.02 patch, which added saving races, fixed the AI pit stops and allowed 39-player multiplayer. thread post post
• 1997-05-13 A second NASCAR Racing 2 patch (v1.03) appeared on Sierra's BBS, fixing the steering lurch and the Charlotte green border. post post
• 1997-05-16 David Noonan released his IndyCar Racing II to NASCAR Racing 2 track converter. His plan to charge for the full version split the group. post thread
• 1997-05-28 Papyrus announced a Busch Grand National add-on for NASCAR Racing 2 for the fall, with new tracks and cars but no separate physics. thread post post
• 1997-07-04 TEN said a late-July launch of NASCAR Racing Online was unlikely. Subscribers who had been paying since December complained. thread post
• 1997-08-13 Papyrus's Bull Run and Red Rock fantasy tracks for NASCAR Racing 2 appeared on a magazine demo disc, and Papyrus detailed the Grand National Series Expansion Pack. thread post
• 1997-08-18 Sierra and The Pits posted updated fantasy tracks. Jim Sokoloff, by then a former Papyrus programmer, explained that a 3dfx port of NASCAR Racing 2 was not cost-effective. thread thread
• 1997-10-15 Papyrus's NASCAR Racing 2 Grand National Series Expansion Pack went gold and reached US stores that week. post post post
• 1997-11-12 NASCAR Racing Online Series went live on TEN, with more than 300 users online on the first nights. thread post post
• 1997-12-22 Papyrus announced that the 3dfx version of NASCAR Racing 2 would be released in early 1998 with NROS support. thread post
• 1998-03-17 A beta 3dfx patch for NASCAR Racing 2 was released, and Papyrus confirmed it as official. thread post post
• 1999-09-01 TEN renamed itself pogo.com. On 7 September it announced that its pay-for-play service would close on 14 October, ending the NASCAR Racing Online Series. post post post

Key threads

• NASCAR Racing 2 ships in early December 1996 1996-12-01 · 31 posts
  A poster insisted that NASCAR Racing 2 would not be out until December 18, while others cited Sierra's press release saying it would ship on December 3. Sierra's Jerry Bowerman confirmed it was shipping, and users soon reported buying copies in stores on December 4 and 5 and praised the game and paint kit.
• Delay of the NASCAR Racing 2 3Dfx patch 1998-01-20 · 172 posts
  A poster asked why Papyrus's promised 3Dfx patch for NASCAR Racing 2 was taking so long. Joe McGinn quoted a December Papyrus email promising a release date, and others said 3Dfx had done the port with Sierra holding it back. The thread grew into a 172-post argument about Papyrus's communication, Rendition versus 3Dfx and patch quality.
• Papyrus announces Busch Grand National add-on for NASCAR 2 1997-05-28 · 137 posts
  Papyrus producer Matt Marsala announced a fall add-on for NASCAR Racing 2 based on the Busch Grand National series, with 10–13 tracks, up to 30 drivers and a Busch calendar. He confirmed that the engine could not support separate physics for Grand National cars, so the pack would add only tracks, cars and a calendar. Many welcomed the short tracks, but Barton Brown and others attacked Papyrus over unfixed AI and patch problems, and the long thread descended into bickering.
• Papyrus responds over the late NASCAR 2 3Dfx patch 1998-02-02 · 116 posts
  Joe McGinn demanded to know where the NASCAR Racing 2 3Dfx patch promised for early 1998 was. Papyrus's Adam Levesque explained the no-win situation over release dates and gave a status update, which was widely welcomed. Former Papyrus staff Jim Sokoloff and Steven Traver explained why patches carry support costs, while the thread became heated over Nosferatu's abusive posts.
• Debate over selling an ICR2-to-NASCAR 2 track converter 1997-05-13 · 100 posts
  David Noonan's plan to charge for his IndyCar Racing II to NASCAR 2 track converter split the group. Some called for a boycott and claimed it infringed Papyrus's or track owners' rights, while others argued he was selling only his own code and deserved payment; Noonan said he had received abusive e-mails. Jim Sokoloff pointed out that software licences typically forbid reverse engineering, and the long thread degenerated into arguments about what makes someone an artist.
• Fantasy tracks posted; Sokoloff explains no 3Dfx NASCAR 2 1997-08-18 · 76 posts
  The Pits posted Papyrus-approved updated versions of the fantasy tracks, adding 4-bit MIPs for 16 MB Rendition systems. The thread turned to why NASCAR 2 had no 3Dfx version: former Papyrus programmer Jim Sokoloff estimated a port at about $150,000 and said it was not profitable to do in-house or contract out. He also revealed that the Rendition engine came from ICR2 and that anti-aliasing had been removed to meet the box's system requirements, and confirmed that he had left Papyrus to pursue other interests.
• IVGA head says Papyrus asked him to sit out the NRL 1996-11-18 · 73 posts
  Don Wilshere posted that Papyrus had asked IVGA staff not to take part in the NASCAR Racing League because their fast-lap software captured members' setups, and he questioned why beta testers could race. Adam Levesque defended the beta testers. Tony Johnson and others laid out the evidence, opinions split on whether banning anyone was fair, and the thread later drifted into NASCAR 2's lack of arcade mode in multiplayer.
• Papyrus future projects and NASCAR 3 wish lists 1996-12-18 · 63 posts
  Users asked Papyrus about future sims. Jim Sokoloff said he was working on NASCAR 3 and invited wish lists, and hinted that Sierra's ownership would mean more openness about upcoming projects, while magazines had mentioned a 1960s Grand Prix sim. Requests included sprint cars, trucks, IRL tracks and more setup options, and Jim also gave advice on curing push and loose handling.
• Calls for a hacked Daytona track for NASCAR Racing 2 1996-12-09 · 58 posts
  After Daytona was left out of NASCAR Racing 2, some urged hackers to make the track. Others explained that Sega held the exclusive licence and that earlier hacks had been stopped with cease-and-desist letters. Papyrus's Jim Sokoloff said that if Papyrus had the rights, the track would be on the CD, explained the Daytona USA billboard and theme-park time trial exhibit, and noted that Sega had paid millions for the name.
• What the Rendition Verite 3D chip means for racing sims 1996-09-27 · 57 posts
  Users asked about the Rendition 3D chip on cards from Creative Labs, Intergraph and Sierra, and Eric Busch explained Verite versus 3Dfx Voodoo and Direct3D support. David Sparks reported that Papyrus had announced Verite support for IndyCar Racing II and NASCAR Racing 2. The thread was sidetracked by heated arguments over VHS versus Beta and OS/2 versus Windows 95.
• NASCAR Racing 2 has no save-race option 1996-12-08 · 57 posts
  Players were upset that NASCAR Racing 2 lacked the ability to save a race or race weekend, which made full-length races impractical for many. Some argued that its absence was more realistic or prevented cheating in offline leagues. Adam Levesque stated it was left out purely for lack of time, and Jim Sokoloff explained that a proper save-and-restore was not trivial and that NASCAR 1's save had really been a red-flag restart.
• NASCAR 2 feature details spark sequel-versus-patch debate 1996-05-29 · 57 posts
  David Sparks summarised NASCAR 2 details from Papyrus's Adam Levesque, including a spotter and crew chief, real-time AI qualifying over two days, and an engine based on ICR2. Terje Wold Johansen argued that it was an upgrade sold as a sequel, with the same 2.5D engine and physics, and predicted GP2 would surpass it, which drew hostile replies. Charlie Heath of Papyrus asked for replays of the rare 'teleport' bug, and players shared stories of cars jumping through walls.
• Forged Sokoloff post falsely cancels NASCAR 2 patch and NRO 1997-03-17 · 56 posts
  A forged post in Jim Sokoloff's name claimed Papyrus had cancelled the NASCAR Racing 2 patch and delayed NASCAR Racing Online until NASCAR 3. Readers quickly traced the headers to Richard Manning, and Sokoloff confirmed it was a forgery and that the patch had not been cancelled. Many posters complained to Manning's ISP, which disabled his Netcom account, and Manning later returned with threats and insults.
• Rick Genter's departure; Richard Manning flames Sokoloff 1997-03-15 · 44 posts
  Asked about former Papyrus regulars, Jim Sokoloff said Rick Genter had left to found the startup 5D Games with other ex-Papyrus staff, and that Ed Martin was still at Papyrus preparing the NASCAR Racing Online launch. Richard Manning responded with profane abuse of Sokoloff over the NRO delay, and the group piled on him, with killfile announcements and complaints to his ISP.
• NASCAR Racing 2 to stay DOS while NRL front end needs Win95 1996-06-15 · 42 posts
  A user asked whether NASCAR 2 would require Windows 95. Papyrus producer Ed Martin confirmed NASCAR Racing 2 would be a DOS game, but the NASCAR Racing League online front end would be Windows 95, using its built-in TCP/IP; he also noted that DirectX still cost frame rate compared with DOS. Some Windows 3.1 and OS/2 users objected, while others urged them to upgrade, and one holdout reported upgrading happily. Rick Genter added that Win95 and DOS performance were roughly equal at 640x480 depending on drivers.
• Papyrus admits NASCAR 2 limits; ICR2 Win95 goes gold 1996-05-30 · 40 posts
  Adam Levesque of Papyrus confirmed that NASCAR 2 would keep the curved pit roads because there was no time to rewrite the track tools. This led to angry complaints about rushed annual releases and the overdue ICR2 patch, with defenders insulting critics. Levesque defended the team and called the online service revolutionary. Charlie Heath said Papyrus had prototyped force feedback with Exos a year earlier. Rick Genter announced that the ICR2 Windows 95 and Macintosh versions had gone gold and that a DOS 1.0.1 patch would go online.
• Why NASCAR 2 has no Daytona: copyright and add-on tracks 1997-02-25 · 38 posts
  Eric Busch posted a joke 'translation' of Jim Sokoloff's repeated explanation of why Daytona is not in NASCAR Racing 2, sparking a long debate on track licensing and fan-made tracks. Sokoloff explained that distributing modified Papyrus track files infringes Papyrus's copyright, which it must defend, while a fully original track only raises issues with the real track's owner; tools that modify files already on the user's disk were acceptable. Most posters defended Sokoloff, though the thread ended with a user posting a hacked Daytona track as a binary.
• NASCAR 2 producer Adam Levesque outlines new features 1996-05-30 · 31 posts
  Papyrus producer Adam Levesque posted NASCAR Racing 2's planned features, including a spotter and crew chief, a new interface and race weekend structure. He said the physics would be largely unchanged from NASCAR 1. Readers asked about inside/outside spotter calls, new tracks, Hawaii's corrected physics, paint kits, and AI that crowds the player in corners. Levesque later confirmed that NASCAR 2 used the ICR2 engine and its VLB support.
• Does CPU speed affect car speed in NASCAR 2? 1997-09-13 · 30 posts
  A NASCAR 1 player moving to N2 asked about quieter engine sound and whether CPU speed affects car speed. He found that a speech slider above 50% reduces other sounds. Jim Sokoloff explained that joystick sampling is interrupt-driven and that physics runs at a fixed rate on all machines, so only frame rate affects the driver; he also discussed calibration ranges, and attributed one user's big speed gain after a CPU upgrade to recalibrating.
• Why sims with 3D physics lack mid-race saves 2000-08-27 · 30 posts
  Posters asked whether any sim with full 3D physics had offered a mid-race save. Some argued saving a six-degree-of-freedom state was hard, while programmers said it should be straightforward. Papyrus's Charlie Heath explained that complexity lies less in the physics than in AI states, pacing lines and other subsystems, recalled that N2's save took considerable work and had a tyre-temperature bug, and noted N1 restarted saved races under caution.
• NASCAR Racing 2 online league to run on TEN 1996-12-04 · 30 posts
  Buyers discovered from a flyer in the NASCAR Racing 2 box that the NASCAR Racing League (renamed NRO) would run only on the TEN online service at about $30 per month. Many objected to the cost, the credit card requirement and the over-18 rule, and Hawaii beta testers worried their promised credit hours would be lost. David Sparks explained that TEN used Concentric's low-latency ATM backbone.
• Papyrus confirms NASCAR Racing 2 delayed past Thanksgiving 1996-11-12 · 30 posts
  Producer Adam Levesque announced that NASCAR Racing 2 would miss its Thanksgiving target because of multiplayer problems. Several people claimed to have bought it already, and Adam repeatedly and emphatically said it had not shipped, suggesting they had seen the Mac version of NASCAR 1. After release, later posts noted small bugs such as cars appearing to 'inhale'.
• First NASCAR Racing 2 screenshots and driver editing 1996-08-23 · 29 posts
  New NASCAR Racing 2 screenshots impressed carset maker Tony Johnson of IWCCCARS, and others urged him to keep making carsets. Papyrus's Adam Levesque described driver bio, team and career pages and a hi-res paint kit, but said licensed drivers might not be editable, which worried users. He clarified that users could create new drivers from a pool, and noted that Papyrus games never carried alcohol or tobacco sponsors.
• Pirated NASCAR 2 Indy track drives Papyrus's Charlie Heath away 1997-05-28 · 28 posts
  A user posted a link to an Indianapolis track for NASCAR 2, and Papyrus's Charlie Heath said he would leave the newsgroup for a few weeks because blatant copyright violations obliged him to report them to legal. Most posters condemned the poster, and the uploader later said it was a converter requiring the user's own INDY.DAT. The thread also contained a separate discussion of whether a Matrox Mystique or a Rendition card was better for the Papyrus sims.
• Is Papyrus finished after EA's NASCAR deal? 1997-06-24 · 27 posts
  A poster argued that EA's NASCAR licence, staff departures and a low E3 profile signalled the end of Papyrus, NASCAR 3, NASCAR Racing Online and Grand Prix Legends. Jim Sokoloff said EA's licence was not exclusive and its first game was for the PlayStation, and Papyrus's Adam Levesque said Papyrus remained committed to NASCAR, would expand into other series and had not given up on CART. Others welcomed competition, and Sokoloff said Ed Martin had moved on to other work.
• First reports from NASCAR Racing Online Series on TEN 1997-11-13 · 25 posts
  A user asked why no one had reviewed the newly launched NASCAR Racing Online Series. Racers replied enthusiastically that it was smooth with 20-car fields and far better than Kali or Hawaii given a good connection, with a Rendition version said to be coming. A few objected to TEN's monthly fees.
• Tony Stewart credits NASCAR Racing 2 for learning Watkins Glen 1999-08-16 · 25 posts
  Alison Hine reported that Tony Stewart said on TV that he had learned Watkins Glen, his first race there, by playing NASCAR Racing 2. Others added that Dale Earnhardt Jr raced N2 online on TEN as DaleJr3, along with other drivers and crew members, and that F3000 drivers used GP2 tracks. Some noted Stewart was a talented driver before any sim.
• Ed Martin explains NRL car sets and sponsorship plans 1996-06-25 · 24 posts
  Ed Martin outlined how the NASCAR Racing League would work with NASCAR Racing 2: individual car files, NRL-sanctioned car sets for all online racing, and paying sponsors to help offset network costs. Users could still use custom paint schemes offline and in IPX play, Hoosier tires would be dropped, and the NRL would offer pickup races, user-created series and official NRL series. Readers questioned the restrictions, especially for league administrators wanting consistent cars.
• NASCAR Racing League statement on the IVGA setup controversy 1996-11-12 · 24 posts
  Papyrus's Ed Martin posted an official NRL clarification about the IVGA, whose fast-lap software had captured members' car setups. He stated that anyone with access to information giving an unfair advantage would not be allowed to compete in sanctioned NRL events. IVGA head Don Wilshere disputed the account, and many members asked to be removed from the IVGA.
• Sokoloff explains NASCAR 2's curved pit roads and walls 1997-03-09 · 23 posts
  Asked why NASCAR Racing 2 forces pit roads onto the racing surface's arc and puts walls at road-course chicanes, Papyrus's Jim Sokoloff said it was a limitation of the 'abysmal' track tools and the AI, and the walls were there to prevent corner-cutting. He discussed evolutionary rather than revolutionary sim development and revealed that nearly every surface, even painted lines, has its own grip value. Others suggested alternatives such as black flags for cutting.
• Frustration over NASCAR 2 patch, then release of v1.02 1997-04-10 · 22 posts
  Users complained about waiting for the NASCAR Racing 2 patch and the AI caution-lap bugs, prompting the usual arguments between critics and defenders. On April 24 a poster announced that Sierra had released patches updating N2 to version 1.02. Early impressions praised the new save-game feature but reported a steering 'lurch' and an installation problem with a missing file.
• NASCAR Racing Online delays anger TEN subscribers 1997-07-04 · 22 posts
  Don Wilsher posted a TEN update suggesting that NASCAR Racing Online was slipping towards 1998, and subscribers who had paid TEN since December demanded refunds or talked of a class action. Jim Sokoloff said the time-consuming work was being done by Papyrus staff, who were converting N2's multiplayer into a pure client-server system with servers running on Solaris and making it reliable and cheat-resistant. Others noted that TEN had never promised a firm date.
• First reactions to the NASCAR Racing 2 demo 1996-09-23 · 20 posts
  Players reacted to the NASCAR Racing 2 demo, praising the spotter and graphics but complaining about the narrow field of view through the windscreen. Papyrus's Adam Levesque said the view was deliberately realistic but still being tweaked. He also said a completely new and more realistic physics engine was a main priority for Papyrus going forward.
• TEN becomes pogo.com, raising fears for NROS 1999-09-02 · 20 posts
  A poster found TEN's site renamed pogo.com with no racing listed and asked whether the NASCAR Racing Online Series was ending. ymenard relayed a TEN statement, and posters debated whether NASCAR Racing 3's free TCP/IP play would make a paid service unviable. A technical debate followed on how many online drivers a dedicated server and DSL or cable connection could support.
• Are sims harder to drive than real race cars? 1998-06-12 · 91 posts
  A poster argued that sims make cars harder to control than real ones and that the genre should balance realism and accessibility, praising TOCA and NASCAR 2's arcade mode. Others replied that real race cars are hard, that sims lack g-forces and fear, and that poor default setups make sims seem harder. The long thread debated whether TOCA counts as a sim and drifted into defining 'game' versus 'simulator'.
• NASCAR 3 wishlist and a look at NASCAR Manager 1997-07-02 · 70 posts
  Users listed features they wanted in NASCAR 3, including engine starting and stalling, a clutch, tyre failures, double-file restarts, time-accelerated cautions, funds and classic-era cars. Eric Busch relayed his E3 coverage of Sierra's NASCAR Manager team-management game, due that winter. Jim Sokoloff explained that the AI distinguishes a pace lap from caution pacing, and that the fuel pressure gauge does not indicate fuel level.
• Debate over the missing save-race feature in NASCAR 2 1996-12-09 · 64 posts
  Users argued at length that the lack of a save-race option in NASCAR Racing 2 was a major flaw for people without four hours to spare, while others suggested using pause. Beta tester David Sparks said the testers' wish lists focused on other priorities and that the feature was never implemented rather than removed. Jim Sokoloff explained how arcade mode's catch-up AI works.
• Does a faster PC or VGA mode make you faster? 1997-07-20 · 59 posts
  Don Wilsher claimed that running NASCAR in VGA instead of SVGA was a speed secret and demanded that Papyrus level the playing field between fast and slow PCs. Jim Sokoloff explained that higher frame rates let a good driver go faster and that the field cannot be perfectly levelled, and Eric Busch and many others agreed that frame rate, not resolution, was what mattered. Most posters rejected the idea of slowing down fast machines.
• NASCAR 2 wheelspin and Grand Prix Legends' visible arms 1997-11-18 · 58 posts
  A user asked how to disable wheelspin in NASCAR 2 for standing-start online races, and others explained the readme and throttle technique. The thread turned to whether the animated driver's arms in Grand Prix Legends and the rumoured NASCAR 3 were useful, with Eric Busch, who had played GPL at Papyrus, saying they convey how the car is handling. Many wanted an option to turn them off.
• Will Rendition cards work on NRO, and do they help? 1997-05-01 · 51 posts
  A question about whether Rendition-accelerated NASCAR 2 would run on TEN for NASCAR Racing Online turned into a debate over whether higher frame rates give an online advantage. Most agreed that frame rate matters but can be gained by reducing detail, and someone suggested renaming the executable to get past TEN's launcher. Papyrus's Charlie Heath explained that physics and joystick input run at a fixed rate regardless of display frame rate, but a slower display gives the driver less information.

Busiest threads

• Delay of the NASCAR Racing 2 3Dfx patch (68 posts about it)
• Papyrus announces Busch Grand National add-on for NASCAR 2 (42 posts about it)
• Fantasy tracks posted; Sokoloff explains no 3Dfx NASCAR 2 (37 posts about it)
• Debate over the missing save-race feature in NASCAR 2 (31 posts about it)
• Calls for a hacked Daytona track for NASCAR Racing 2 (29 posts about it)
• NASCAR Racing 2 install breaks Internet Explorer 3 (25 posts about it)
• NASCAR Racing 2 has no save-race option (24 posts about it)
• Disappointment with the NASCAR 2 3Dfx patch (24 posts about it)
• Requests for an anti-aliasing patch for NASCAR 2 Rendition (23 posts about it)
• NASCAR 2 3Dfx patch delayed by texture memory (22 posts about it)
• Debate over selling an ICR2-to-NASCAR 2 track converter (20 posts about it)
• Eric Busch's hands-on report of Grand Prix Legends (20 posts about it)
• Disputed screenshots of the NASCAR 2 3Dfx patch (20 posts about it)
• Microsoft force feedback wheel mounting and NASCAR 2 support (20 posts about it)
• False sightings of NASCAR Racing 2 in shops (19 posts about it)

Sentiment by year

Each post that discussed the sim was rated from −2 (very negative) to +2 (very positive).

Who talked about it most

Michael E. Carver · 635 ymenard · 442 Eric Busch · 310 Jim Sokolo · 298 Dave Henrie · 235 David Spark · 188 Greg Cisko · 186 John Wallace · 136 Don Wilshe · 123 Jeff Vincent · 116 Don Burnette · 98 Tom Hansen · 98 Nigel Nichols · 97 Michael Peters · 97 Larry · 92 Robert · 85 ccorpor · 85 Joe McGinn · 84 Ed Martin · 81 Scott B. Husted · 74

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