N2 Wheelspin??

I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into each other. Any thoughts?

use less trottle :) if your light with it it wont spin. if you push it to the fire wall it most certainly will spin al over. ive heard that if you use abutton for your throttle it wont spin. but who wants to do that. just practice with that foot. SS > I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any > reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing > possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at > the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into > each other. Any thoughts?

You didn't turn it on and you can't turn it off. They are talking about field size not being the default. Some tracks can handle more cars at the expense of tighter pit stalls. Once you become familar and comfortable with this feature of wheelspin, you can add more cars.

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> Yeah, I've been wondering the same thing too. Just can't seem to get > a decent start. > From the NASCAR2 readme.txt: > "With the introduction of the wheelspin feature, it is possible to > increase the field sizes and use the wheelspin to exit the pits. This > is not the default because it takes a while for people to feel > comfortable using this feature." > The question is, if wheelspin isn't the default, how the heck did I > manage to turn it on, and even more importantly, how the heck do I > turn it off again! > CharlesC > >I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any > >reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing > >possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at > >the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into > >each other. Any thoughts?

Yeah, I've been wondering the same thing too. Just can't seem to get a decent start. From the NASCAR2 readme.txt: "With the introduction of the wheelspin feature, it is possible to increase the field sizes and use the wheelspin to exit the pits. This is not the default because it takes a while for people to feel comfortable using this feature." The question is, if wheelspin isn't the default, how the heck did I manage to turn it on, and even more importantly, how the heck do I turn it off again! CharlesC >I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any >reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing >possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at >the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into >each other. Any thoughts?

bottom of page 6 ;; single press smooth double push wheelspin

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>use less trottle :) if your light with it it wont spin. if you push it >to the fire wall it most certainly will spin al over. ive heard that if >you use abutton for your throttle it wont spin. >but who wants to do that. just practice with that foot. >SS >> I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any >> reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing >> possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at >> the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into >> each other. Any thoughts?

I've checked everywhere in the manual, but I was unable to find any reference to turning on and off wheelspin in N2. Is such a thing possible? Those NRO pickup races with no pace lap are a real pain at the start with cars fishtailing all over the place and banging into each other. Any thoughts? Not to seem like a smart aleck, but don't touch the wheel until the car stops stops spinning. Seems like everyone wants to get to the bottom of the track as fast as possible... Works for me! -- Robert Johnson ICQ# 1655618 Chieftian On TEN

i also hope they have a option to turn OFF the dumb steering wheel and hands that will be on the screen. if your racing with a sim, with your own hands and a steering wheel or even a joystick, you dont want to see another pair of hands and steering wheel on the screen. if you were sitting in a real sim (so a car was all around you) and had the steering wheel in your hand while driving this sim, i dont think any one would want to see a steering wheel with hands on it out the window ahead of them. sure hope they get ride of this. nascar3 is going to have to be real good to beat nascar 2 with 3dfx support (when it comes out) ss

I hope that the wheelspin feature is looked at for Nascar3. We must have it so as we can turn around after a spin out and getting out of the pits, but at the same time we need to be able to get better "off the mark" acceration without wheel spin. It could be done with the addition of a neutral gear as follows......... gear in neutral, rev engine, select first gear = wheel spin or select first gear, hit the gas = minimal wheel spin- max acceleration. -- NOTE: Remove the "remove" from E-mail address to reply. Nigel of Lakewood Motorsports (Memeber of the Nascar Offline Racing Series) Nascar Coruba & Coke Chevy Hamilton New Zealand

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> I hope that the wheelspin feature is looked at for Nascar3. > We must have it so as we can turn around after a spin out and > getting out of the pits, but at the same time we need to be > able to get better "off the mark" acceration without wheel > spin. > It could be done with the addition of a neutral gear as > follows......... > gear in neutral, rev engine, select first gear = wheel spin > or > select first gear, hit the gas = minimal wheel spin- max > acceleration. > -- > NOTE: Remove the "remove" from E-mail address to reply. > Nigel of Lakewood Motorsports > (Memeber of the Nascar Offline Racing Series) > Nascar Coruba & Coke Chevy > Hamilton > New Zealand

Two other options you've overlooked. Practice standing starts offline alot. Learn your throttle. or Screw standing starts and race like the real Nascar boys. Right now the standing starts are used (but not mandated) because alot of people don't know to deal with a pace lap or yellows for that matter. mykey

how can people not be doing pace laps or not even know what they are? this is a sim right :) play it like its the real thing!!! ss

I don't think we need rain in N3, (although they ran in the rain in practice and qualifying at Sukuka). It would be nice to have a windsheilf that gets progressivly dirty, or sun glare, some of the things NASCAR drivers have to contend with on a regular basis. With computer getting faster all the time, and 3dfx cards, etc, I don't see why any of this wouldn't be possible (I believe sun glare was excluded from NASCAR 2 because the hardware wasn't quite up to par for handeling it when the game was released.) Later, John

Well I'm not sure how it will look in N3, but Grand Prix Legends looks pretty damn cool with the arms in the***pit. -- Eric T. Busch [link lost in import] >Perhaps those at Papyrus are trying to appeal to the amputee >population, though I'm not quite sure how these people will go about >playing the game. Joystick in the mouth? >"Now you too can have arms thanks to Nascar Racing 3!!!" >I rather wish they would spend their time programming worthwhile >features.

Actually the arms are pretty worthwhile, as they give you a good visual indication of how the car is handling. GPL would be very difficult to control with out this kind of feedback. -- Eric T. Busch http://ebusch.akorn.net >I rather wish they would spend their time programming worthwhile >features.

Perhaps those at Papyrus are trying to appeal to the amputee population, though I'm not quite sure how these people will go about playing the game. Joystick in the mouth? "Now you too can have arms thanks to Nascar Racing 3!!!" I rather wish they would spend their time programming worthwhile features. -Blight

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> I would like the next version of NASCAR allow you to climb from your > car and go rip the ARMS OFF the guy who just stuffed you into the > wall. Now that would be cool, especially in those pick up races. > >Perhaps those at Papyrus are trying to appeal to the amputee > >population, though I'm not quite sure how these people will go about > >playing the game. Joystick in the mouth? > >"Now you too can have arms thanks to Nascar Racing 3!!!" > >I rather wish they would spend their time programming worthwhile > >features. > >-Blight > >>i also hope they have a option to turn OFF the dumb steering wheel and > >>hands that will be on the screen. if your racing with a sim, with your > >>own hands and a steering wheel or even a joystick, you dont want to see > >>another pair of hands and steering wheel on the screen. > >>if you were sitting in a real sim (so a car was all around you) and had > >>the steering wheel in your hand while driving this sim, i dont think any > >>one would want to see a steering wheel with hands on it out the window > >>ahead of them. > >>sure hope they get rid of this. > >>nascar3 is going to have to be real good to beat nascar 2 with 3dfx > >>support (when it comes out) > >>ss

I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those hands etc, how about adding: * A tow truck that doesn't have a cloaking device * A More realistic Pit Row, no wonder the stops are slow, my crew have to get their tools beamed over from those rigs! * Wrecks that do not atomize themselves..but remain on the track until somebody cleans up the mess, and a couple of wrecker-trucks stopping in the general area with a few corner workers would be grand... * More realistic sound effects (i.e random noises when engine or parts of the car break, like knocking noises, hissing, scraping.., some diff noise would be great..) * More realistic breakdowns; flat tires without wearing them out, leaks and other technicalities that can be fixed....race stoppage because of rain:)), chips in the windscreen All details, really:)) Can't complain!!! Matt -- ------------------------------ Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen (http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk "Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" -Cale Yarborough Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/ Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! -------------------------------

I would like the next version of NASCAR allow you to climb from your car and go rip the ARMS OFF the guy who just stuffed you into the wall. Now that would be cool, especially in those pick up races.

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>Perhaps those at Papyrus are trying to appeal to the amputee >population, though I'm not quite sure how these people will go about >playing the game. Joystick in the mouth? >"Now you too can have arms thanks to Nascar Racing 3!!!" >I rather wish they would spend their time programming worthwhile >features. >-Blight >>i also hope they have a option to turn OFF the dumb steering wheel and >>hands that will be on the screen. if your racing with a sim, with your >>own hands and a steering wheel or even a joystick, you dont want to see >>another pair of hands and steering wheel on the screen. >>if you were sitting in a real sim (so a car was all around you) and had >>the steering wheel in your hand while driving this sim, i dont think any >>one would want to see a steering wheel with hands on it out the window >>ahead of them. >>sure hope they get ride of this. >>nascar3 is going to have to be real good to beat nascar 2 with 3dfx >>support (when it comes out) >>ss

Would you really want to sit through this event taking place? I think most people would agree that sometimes sitting through the pace laps and yellows are long enough. I can't imagine sitting at my computer, waiting for the game to clean up the race track. I think the best part of it being a simulation is that you can lessen some of the less glamorous parts of racing. race stoppage because of again, do you want to be sitting there waiting for simulated rain to stop falling? Do we get doppler with this? I think more realism is great, but i think Papy's attention is better spent on AI. Jason Hamlett Hamlett 0n Ten

> Actually the arms are pretty worthwhile, as they give you a good visual > indication of how the car is handling. GPL would be very difficult to > control with out this kind of feedback. I'd rather have good sound and force feedback, at least it should be possible to switch between the virtual and the 2D***pit. What I saw on the preview video on the BGN track pack CD actually didn't look as bad as I was expecting... l8r ronny -- |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

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> > * Wrecks that do not atomize themselves..but remain on the track until > > somebody cleans up the mess, and a couple of wrecker-trucks stopping in > > the general area with a few corner workers would be grand... > Would you really want to sit through this event taking place? I think > most people would agree that sometimes sitting through the pace laps and > yellows are long enough. I can't imagine sitting at my computer, waiting > for the game to clean up the race track. I think the best part of it > being a simulation is that you can lessen some of the less glamorous > parts of racing. > race stoppage because of > > rain:)), chips in the windscreen > again, do you want to be sitting there waiting for simulated rain to > stop falling? Do we get doppler with this? > I think more realism is great, but i think Papy's attention is better > spent on AI. > Jason Hamlett > Hamlett 0n Ten

My idea was this: If you want realism, you can get it. Of course there should be an option to switch it off:)) I would find it no more naff to end the race because of rain, wait for wrecks to clean up etc, than having "something let go in my engine" after 250 laps...but I still run with that option on. And it happened to me today, and I still play N2, because it's pretty realistic... Best, Matt -- ------------------------------ Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen (http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk) "Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" -Cale Yarborough Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/) Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! -------------------------------

>Actually the arms are pretty worthwhile, as they give you a good visual >indication of how the car is handling. GPL would be very difficult to >control with out this kind of feedback. I'm sorry, but I don't understand how any kind of frame-grabbing 'feature' like arms and an onscreen steering wheel could help you understand how your car is handling. Unless you can get some real seat of the pants feedback, then visual is all you have; don't slow it down with fluff, especially a visual depiction of what you're doing with your control device. MW

Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of a mix of this input and the car's response to this input. With it you can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to date. It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it, I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation. I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds made up that they are going to hate the arms. Like you, I couldn't imagine how they could add anything to the game. But after playing GPL, I can't imagine playing without them. Give it a chance, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised... -- Eric T. Busch http://ebusch.akorn.net

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>Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of >a mix of this input and the car's response to this input. With it you >can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to >date. It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it, >I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation. >I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds >made up that they are going to hate the arms. Like you, I couldn't >imagine how they could add anything to the game. But after playing GPL, >I can't imagine playing without them. Give it a chance, I think you'll >be pleasantly surprised...

<Inside Papyrus joke> Hypothetically speaking </Inside Papyrus joke> Let's say that 80% of the future GPL buyers don't have a steering wheel. They will find this feature very very interesting. Papyrus is aiming very big for GPL. This was a fact why some projects at papy were let down (N2 Manager, etc..). They want GPL to be their Queen piece in the simracing chess game against the other company. I am "pro-Pay hands" and I know it will be a great feature for the game. Some say "I don't want to see 4 hands". Like if you will not buy it for that. <g>. We are maybe the best customers for Papyrus but not the mass critic. Do you really think that the 500 000 (+ the full installation copys) people that buyed Nascar1 had a wheel for playing ?? If I had a joystick or racing with my keyboard, I would be very happy about this feature. SODA had a "preview" of those hand, and even if they weren't not great I liked them. Btw Eric, you really played GPL ?? you lucky SOB ! ! ! ! ;-) With great respect, May the downforce be with you, Good race at the Brickyard, (-o-) Fran?ois Mnard, "ymenard" on NROS Team member, Zombie Entreprise Sponsored by AWPSS, http://www.awpss.com/ SimRacing director, AWPSS Official PR, AWPSS Director, The SimRacing Hall-of-Fame Co-director, Light-Speed - *Excuse me for my poor English(I'm French speaking) * -

you have some very good points here. how can we send them to the makers of nascar 3? ss I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those hands etc, how about adding: * A tow truck that doesn't have a cloaking device * A More realistic Pit Row, no wonder the stops are slow, my crew have to get their tools beamed over from those rigs! * Wrecks that do not atomize themselves..but remain on the track until somebody cleans up the mess, and a couple of wrecker-trucks stopping in the general area with a few corner workers would be grand... * More realistic sound effects (i.e random noises when engine or parts of the car break, like knocking noises, hissing, scraping.., some diff noise would be great..) * More realistic breakdowns; flat tires without wearing them out, leaks and other technicalities that can be fixed....race stoppage because of rain:)), chips in the windscreen All details, really:)) Can't complain!!! Matt

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> Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of > a mix of this input and the car's response to this input. With it you > can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to > date. It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it, > I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation. > I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds > made up that they are going to hate the arms. Like you, I couldn't > imagine how they could add anything to the game. But after playing GPL, > I can't imagine playing without them. Give it a chance, I think you'll > be pleasantly surprised...

Nevertheless, they should just make it optional. I was glad that I could turn off headpanning in CART-PR...as long as I played it. l8er ronny -- |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

>Let's say that 80% of the future GPL buyers don't have a steering wheel. >They will find this feature very very interesting. I ask again, what's so "interesting" about watching a representation of your hands? Is anyone so brain dead that they need a computer screen to tell them their hand is over to the left? Do you watch your hands while you drive a real car? That's exactly right and here's my open statement to Papyrus. "I won't buy anything that purports to be a "simulator" that has onscreen hands. I already have Test Drive II" So there. You know, all this rationalization reminds me of the hoopla that went on when it was "learned" that N2 wasn't going to have a "speedometer" (as if any Winston Cup car ever did). Papyrus made the correct move then, with a one-key 'off' switch that's saved in your prefrences. If common sense prevails, that's what will happen here. MW

i hope that is what happens here (with n3) You know, all this rationalization reminds me of the hoopla that went on when it was "learned" that N2 wasn't going to have a "speedometer" (as if any Winston Cup car ever did). Papyrus made the correct move then, with a one-key 'off' switch that's saved in your prefrences. If common sense prevails, that's what will happen here.

% I don't think we need rain in N3, (although they ran in the rain in % practice and qualifying at Sukuka). It would be nice to have a % windsheilf that gets progressivly dirty, or sun glare, some of the % things NASCAR drivers have to contend with on a regular basis. With % computer getting faster all the time, and 3dfx cards, etc, I don't see % why any of this wouldn't be possible (I believe sun glare was excluded % from NASCAR 2 because the hardware wasn't quite up to par for % handeling it when the game was released.) Let's see.... Falcon 3.0 (circa 1991) did a find job of modeling sunglare in the***pit as well as the view (well that is once they got the bug worked out that had the sun on the wrong horizion for the day of time). I think it was just one of the things that made the cutting room floor in order to get the product out. -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

<snip discussion on N3 wants/don't wants> % > % >I think more realism is great, but i think Papy's attention is better % >spent on AI. % After racing on NROS, the AI will never be realistic enough for me. While I can't argue your point. Papyrus could make great strides in AI. Their AI engine is pretty good and could be improved by adding a couple more instruction sets. To see what I mean, go to the CCG NASCAR2 AI Project's site and try the Michigan or C***te AI enhancements. You will also need the driver skills numbers from my ftp site. This combination of Papyrus's AI engine, CCG AI files, and competitive driver skills really shows off the possibilities of AI in a simulation. While it may not be NROS, it is the second best thing (and I don't hesitate to say not a distant second either). As a matter of fact, I think this combination is the best AI I've seen in a racing sim to date. Of course you do understand that this is In My Humble Opinion. ;-) CCG NASCAR2 AI Project: [link lost in import] Driver Skill Numbers: ftp://ftp.teleport.com/users/mcarver/AutoSim/ccg_ai10.zip -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

% Its not just a visual representation of your input, instead its more of % a mix of this input and the car's response to this input. With it you % can 'feel' how the car is reacting much better than in any other sim to % date. It just 'feels right', but until you've sat down and played it, % I'm not sure I ever accurately describe the sensation. % I sincerely hope that people don't go into this game with their minds % made up that they are going to hate the arms. Like you, I couldn't % imagine how they could add anything to the game. But after playing GPL, % I can't imagine playing without them. Give it a chance, I think you'll % be pleasantly surprised... Eric, I believe you. Well, I believe that it worked for you. It might even work for me. But being the old skeptical fart I am, I still want the option to turn it off. Give me a proper implementation of force feedback for my own arms and wheels. Why do I say this? In my opinion, in order for the wheel/arms on the screen to give me feedback about how the car is reacting or handling, it must react differently than my own hands and wheel. If the on screen visual simply mirrors my own input, I don't need it. If it is mirroring another input entirely, I am not really sure I want to see it. When I'm driving in a real car, I don't watch my hands, I watch the road/dash/other cars. I do however, drive by the seat of my pants. Maybe what we really need is a 3D on screen sphincter! <G> -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

So people are adamant about not wanting to see arms in the***pit that add to the racing experience, yet they want animated tow trucks, pit crews, and cleanup crews, all of which would add absolutely nothing to the game? I sorry, but I just don't get it... -- Eric T. Busch [link lost in import] >I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those >hands etc, how about adding: <snip>

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> So people are adamant about not wanting to see arms in the***pit that > add to the racing experience, yet they want animated tow trucks, pit > crews, and cleanup crews, all of which would add absolutely nothing to > the game? I sorry, but I just don't get it... > -- > Eric T. Busch > [link lost in import]

I don't mind the arms, but I hope they are not as long as the ones in the screenshots for GP Legends. The arms look way too long in length.

yeah, now that would be a case in which I wouldn't mind seeing my own hand and the one in the sim.... kinda like having someone agreeing with me... ;) friendly support is always nice ! > Hey, I'm willing to take a chance on the arms in the***pit, as long as > they write code to allow you to flip drivers off as they cut in front of ya > in the turns <g> > -- > Don Burnette -- Handy^Man IVGA 4924 ~~pulling for #8 in 1998 ! :)~~ ICQ 3551448 GOoooo #3 !! C_Watkins on TEN gabrdc

I got a use for the arms... Let's say an AI car cuts you off earlier in the race. After a while you catch up to them again, there should be a punch key so you show the AI how you really feel! Maybe the AI could learn about your short fuse and squirm to the other side of the***pit as you drive by! :) Later, John

well. i never say any preveiw movie on the cd. it goes through some other movies, like the expansion pack and some flying one. but then it comes to "coming next christmas....nascar3!!!!!!. but no movie for it at all :( how did you get so lucky? ss

There are a few short in-game clips (2-3 sec each) of GPL between Reno Air Racer and the N3 teaser on the BGN CD (from 1:40-2:30). Included are a couple of quick views of the***pit, however my observations were based on my experiences after playing the game during my visit to Papyrus a little over a week ago. -- Eric T. Busch [link lost in import] >well. i never say any preveiw movie on the cd. it goes through some >other movies, like the expansion pack and some flying one. but then it >comes to "coming next christmas....nascar3!!!!!!. but no movie for it >at all :( >how did you get so lucky?

ahhh, i thought he saw a preview movie of nascar 3. too bad. ss

Hey, I'm willing to take a chance on the arms in the***pit, as long as they write code to allow you to flip drivers off as they cut in front of ya in the turns <g> -- Don Burnette Music City Racing Dburn on Ten > So people are adamant about not wanting to see arms in the***pit that > add to the racing experience, yet they want animated tow trucks, pit > crews, and cleanup crews, all of which would add absolutely nothing to > the game? I sorry, but I just don't get it... > -- > Eric T. Busch > [link lost in import] > >I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those > >hands etc, how about adding: <snip>

Think about it - anyone that has actually _seen_ Grand Prix Legends has stated that the hands are not a problem at all, and actually add to the experience. That's even the people that initially hated the idea. I personally like the idea, and even if I didn't it wouldn't bother me too much since I rarely spend anytime looking at the dash anyway. I'm sure if it appears in GPL and everyone hates it, the arms will be removed for N3 (or at least an option to switch them off. So show me the Winston cup car that doesn't have arms or a steering wheel inside it....? Give it a chance - don't say you don't like it until you know you don't. Cheers! John

>So people are adamant about not wanting to see arms in the***pit that >add to the racing experience, yet they want animated tow trucks, pit >crews, and cleanup crews, all of which would add absolutely nothing to >the game? I sorry, but I just don't get it... The distinction is that all the above events occur while you're not trying to drive. As long as there are going to be caution laps, why not have something interesting to look at? Remember, the real solution is "<Alt_A>" - Arms on/off MW

I don't necessarily "don't want hands in the sim", but I would like to have the option to turn them off if I decide I don't want them. Papy is, afterall, writing the sim for us, not themselves. I'd personally like to see: 0) A voodoo patch of NR2 1) a bigger color palette for painting 2) the ability for leagues to run their own carsets on NROS 3) drivers able to use their own cars in NROS league races 4) ability to spectate an NROS race - while it's underway 5) Ability to save a replay as an .avi file. 6) A female spotter voice. And let her tell you what she's gonna do to/for you if you win (yum). -- /*===================================================*/ John Simmons (Redneck Techno-Biker) http://www.paddedwall.org/john If you want to send me email, go the URL above and click "Send Me Mail" in the Contents frame. /*===================================================*/ Some helpful email addresses for spammers: Current board of the FCC: USPS: Miscellaneous: /*===================================================*/

That's exactly my point. Why should Papy take time away from programming real features that effect gameplay just to make the pace laps a bit less boring? I'm strongly against any extra fluff that is put into a game just for the sake of looks. That's why I vowed to never buy another EA Sports game until they decide to take the time and actually use some AI and make their games playable. They look beautiful, but that wears thin VERY fast... For example, take the intro video for N2. How many people watch that every time they start N2? I watched it once when I first got the game, and even then I didn't watch it in its entirety. I realize something like this isn't really taking away features (they have a separate video and art department to do these kind of things), but I just don't see the point in doing it in the first place. I guess with today's games you have to jazz them up and make them look good, otherwise people will just glance over them. Again, I don't get it... -- Eric T. Busch http://ebusch.akorn.net

Well, no, you watch the road, and in the games, you watch others... Your hands and arms are still in your spherical vision, but you're concentrating on the road not on your arms, just like it will be in GPL, just like in normal driving. I certinaly would like to see an OPTION to choose between, however I will not write of the product because of it. Do you place your steering wheel right in front of your monitor?? So that it's in the exact place the steering missing from the***pit is?? I don't, the monitor is on a wall stand, 30 degrees to my right/the desk. Here here!! Anyone remember the***pit view in the Sega coin-o Virtua Racing?? That had hands and I quite liked that, I suppose it does sepend on whether you believe *you're* driving the simulated car. Or whether you are controlling the simulated *driver* in the simulated car.... Thanks, Jon Guest :-) http://www.mercury.force9.co.uk/nascar2/ "Although this world is a crazy ride, You just take your seat and just hold on tight"

% So people are adamant about not wanting to see arms in the***pit that % add to the racing experience, yet they want animated tow trucks, pit % crews, and cleanup crews, all of which would add absolutely nothing to % the game? I sorry, but I just don't get it... Eric, we're just jealous because you've seen the future and we're stuck in the past! <G> % > % >I admire Papyrus for their work, but instead of spending time on those % >hands etc, how about adding: <snip> -- **************************** Michael E. Carver ************************* Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town. =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Remember, the real solution is "<Alt_A>" - Arms on/off MW hehe, i like that!! ss

Here here!! Anyone remember the***pit view in the Sega coin-o Virtua Racing?? That had hands and I quite liked that, I suppose it does sepend on whether you believe *you're* driving the simulated car. Or whether you are controlling the simulated *driver* in the simulated car.... very interesting way to look at it!! ss

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> That's exactly my point. Why should Papy take time away from > programming real features that effect gameplay just to make the pace > laps a bit less boring? I'm strongly against any extra fluff that is > put into a game just for the sake of looks. That's why I vowed to never > buy another EA Sports game until they decide to take the time and > actually use some AI and make their games playable. They look > beautiful, but that wears thin VERY fast...

Well, that's my point, too! But for me virtual arms and steering wheels are just that, extra fluff. It's really a matter of subjective likes and dislikes, so Papy should just make it an option and everyone's happy. I hope, it didn't bother you too much that I disagree, like one of the guys was suggesting?! 8^) l8er ronny -- |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

On Mon, 24 Nov 1997 17:55:04 -0500, Nanker Pheldge >I don't mind the arms, but I hope they are not as long as the ones in >the screenshots for GP Legends. The arms look way too long in length. I just took a look at the Demo of GPL ,and the length of the arms would be prototypically correct. Back in the 60s,they drove in very reclined positon that caused you to drive with you arms fully extended. Joel Willstein

One feature I want is better Car management in N2. I have a problem with the number of cars in the screen you can choose from. Another thing is more than 39 cars on certain tracks. No pit wall at taladega and many other track corrections. The ability to move cameras on the replay. Maybe an option to set up cameras before the race. Better sounds, smoke effects, more damage to the car. Right now I think the damage is a little light when you brush the wall. Tire marks on the sides of cars so you know to watch out for certain unstable drivers. AI incidental contact wrecks. I would rather have a flag man actually waving the flags from the stand instead of in the car. Have more flags too that they have in the race. Black flag numbers should be hung from the stand. The blue-yellow. Maybe add injurys. Out for so many races during a championship season. Drivers would be alot more cautious on NRO. Injuries to other drivers too during season. Better graphical analysis of cars performance. More setup options. Definite ability to watch NRO races. Might as well have a director position. Others watch as the director chooses cameras for certain action. Have a bunch of tv screens with all the angles and the director chooses the one shot he wants to display on one big screen. For future use in NRO history. That's all for now, John Flowers

Comments and FLAMES are welcome!! By e-mail & newsgroup! boy oh boy, some ones a little testy.... steve..hehe :)

About all of this ARM's thing, my Father is an ex-race car driver from the NEW JERSEY area(Wall Stadium, and other surrounding tracks), and he said that HAVING your hands shown in the SIM would be VERY benificial to the driver, and he could NEVER understand WHY they weren't in NASCAR1 and NASCAR2, and ICR2!?!?!?!? So, from an REAL RACERS point of View, it IS better to have the Hands in the GAME, they WILL halp you(if you know HOW to sense what is going on) with the handling of your car!!! BTW, my dad raced against Geoff Bodine(and the other Bodine's(whom he hated and still does), Harry Gant, Ray EveringHam and others!!! Comments and FLAMES are welcome!! By e-mail & newsgroup! Thanks, Tom Wardell Starting Line-Up http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2171/index.html

On Thu, 04 Dec 1997 11:33:34 +0100, "Matthew B.Knutsen" >Well, here's from another real racer too... >I cannot think of what hands onna wheel would have done to improve >driveability in either of the mentioned games. Okay, consider realism. Around Loews at Monaco is one of the few times a driver actually crosses over his arms, although there are plenty of times when you have a lot of lock applied. At those times in any other sim you can still look down and check your gauges. You can't do this in a single seater***pit because your (you guessed it!) ARMS are in the way. I'd guess it should be an option that people can turn off if they really hate it, but I would ask people to remember that the only people complaining about this are those that HAVEN'T seen it in action. The people who have and who have posted here either never mentioned it as a problem or described it as a definite plus. At least give it a chance to actually be ***before you decide that it is! Cheers! John

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> I'd guess it should be an option that people can turn off if they > really hate it, but I would ask people to remember that the only > people complaining about this are those that HAVEN'T seen it in > action. The people who have and who have posted here either never > mentioned it as a problem or described it as a definite plus. > At least give it a chance to actually be ***before you decide that > it is!

I definitely will try it, but I have to demand the toggle NOW, don't I? l8er ronny -- |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

> About all of this ARM's thing, my Father is an ex-race car driver from > the NEW JERSEY area(Wall Stadium, and other surrounding tracks), and > he said that HAVING your hands shown in the SIM would be VERY > benificial to the driver, and he could NEVER understand WHY they > weren't in NASCAR1 and NASCAR2, and ICR2!?!?!?!? So, from an REAL (snip, snip) Well, here's from another real racer too... I cannot think of what hands onna wheel would have done to improve driveability in either of the mentioned games. When racing, both in sim, and real life, you don't watch your arms!! Your eyes are scanning up the road, all over the place, flashing past the gauges from time to time... I remember when I first drove a car (bouncing an Escort along the road at the age of 11) I would even watch my arms when I shifted..I wonder why I stopped doing that:) So here's how I figure it: The arms on-screen are turning the wheel, giving lots of lock, and still the car won't turn properly. AHA! push! How come I didn't think of that when my T2 was at full lock at the same time....? Seriously, I can (with some goodwill added) see that keyboard and joystick users would like the feature, but, as mentioned here several times, *it must be an option*. And, how realistic will it be anyway? Going through La Source and other tight hairpins in those cars, the drivers surely had to change their grip a bit about? The cars had a fair bit of lock back then... It would be exciting indeed to hear the argument *for* the hands, by a driver....? All the Best, Looking forward to the release!! Matt -- ------------------------------ Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen (http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk) "Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" -Cale Yarborough Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/) Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! -------------------------------

I may not be a real race car driver, but I do race solo2 and solo1 in a t-bird SC, any way if you have time to look at your hands you aren't going fast enough. Denny M

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>snip >I definitely will try it, but I have to demand the toggle NOW, don't I? >l8er >ronny >-- > |\ _,,,---,,_ I want to die like my Grandfather, > ZZZzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ in his sleep. > |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' Not like the people in his car, > '---''(_/--' `-'\_) screaming their heads off!

> I may not be a real race car driver, but I do race solo2 and solo1 in a > t-bird SC, any way if you have time to look at your hands you aren't going > fast enough. > Denny M I'd say you were a real race car driver!:) Solo looks like lotsa fun! Matt -- ------------------------------ Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen (http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk) "Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" -Cale Yarborough Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/) Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! -------------------------------

Solo is great fun, just grab your daily driver and 15 or 20 dollars for the day and go have fun, you get to meet a nice bunch of people and have a good time in the process. Its like going to the local amu***t park and driving the rollar coaster. Denny M >> I may not be a real race car driver, but I do race solo2 and solo1 in a >> t-bird SC, any way if you have time to look at your hands you aren't going

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>> fast enough. >> Denny M >I'd say you were a real race car driver!:) Solo looks like lotsa fun! >Matt >-- >------------------------------ >Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen >(http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk >"Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" >-Cale Yarborough >Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/ >Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! >-------------------------------

I agree, I never raced Solo's (Ive raced GT-1, spec racers, and s2000) and I think Solo's are great for those who dont have the money, time, or desire to go "real" racing. It gives anyone a chance to learn how to drive a car to its fullest. (Anyone need a driver for SCCA ??? ;) ). If you have that desire, give it a try... Ill bet you will love it !!! Scott B. Husted [link lost in import: /~sbhusted]

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> Solo is great fun, just grab your daily driver and 15 or 20 dollars for the > day and go have fun, you get to meet a nice bunch of people and have a good > time in the process. Its like going to the local amu***t park and driving > the rollar coaster. > Denny M > >> I may not be a real race car driver, but I do race solo2 and solo1 in a > >> t-bird SC, any way if you have time to look at your hands you aren't > going > >> fast enough. > >> Denny M > >I'd say you were a real race car driver!:) Solo looks like lotsa fun! > >Matt > >-- > >------------------------------ > >Matthew Birger Patrick Knutsen > >(http://sofus.hiof.no/~matthebk > >"Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw" > >-Cale Yarborough > >Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut/ > >Please Remove "NoSpam" from my E-mail adress when replying! > >-------------------------------

you mssed 2 bigs ones in my book Oil and debree on the track the you may hit and cause trouble Provisional system simular to winston cup