Grand Prix 2

MicroProse · released 1996 · discussed in 18,271 posts, 1994-2009 · overall tone positive

Posts per month

Timeline

• 1995-06-08 MicroProse press releases announced World Circuit 2 (Grand Prix 2) and an F1 management game. post
• 1995-06-13 MicroProse Europe said Grand Prix 2 would support only direct and modem link play, with no network play. post
• 1995-06-28 Spectrum HoloByte showed Geoff Crammond's World Circuit II, based on the 1994 F1 season, at E3, and screenshots appeared on the MicroProse website. post post
• 1995-07-26 MicroProse moved Grand Prix 2 from September to winter. It said the delay came from F1 licence talks with Fuji, which were now complete, and that Grand Prix 2 was now an official FIA product. post post
• 1995-09-10 A playable early Grand Prix 2 demo, Monza only and in VGA, was shown at ECTS in London, but it was not released publicly. post post post
• 1995-11-20 Grand Prix 2 was reported delayed to March 1996. MicroProse denied rumours of trouble and said Crammond was still tuning gameplay while the artwork was upgraded to SVGA. post post thread
• 1995-12-20 A statement from Geoff Crammond confirmed Grand Prix 2 had missed Christmas and should be finished early in the new year. post
• 1996-01-08 Grand Prix 2 was shown playable at the Autosport show, apparently close to finished. post post
• 1996-04-07 A post on the MicroProse message board claiming to be from Geoff Crammond said Grand Prix 2 had been cancelled. MicroProse confirmed it was a hoax. thread post
• 1996-04-15 MicroProse showed Grand Prix 2 at the spring ECTS in London and gave June as its target release. post post
• 1996-06-11 Reports confirmed that dynamic weather had been dropped from Grand Prix 2. thread post
• 1996-06-17 A pirated early alpha of Grand Prix 2, infected with the Burglar.1150 virus, circulated on warez sites. thread post
• 1996-07-06 Grand Prix 2 reached gold master status. thread post
• 1996-07-12 Grand Prix 2 went on sale early at Karstadt stores in Germany, ahead of other markets. thread post
• 1996-07-19 Grand Prix 2 went on general sale in the UK and most of Europe. Some shops started a day early. post post post
• 1996-07-23 Spectrum HoloByte launched Grand Prix 2 worldwide, with copies reaching US stores on July 24. thread post post
• 1996-08-20 Trevor Kellaway released GP2JAM, which let users repaint Grand Prix 2 cars. post post
• 1996-08-24 Jacques Villeneuve said he had learned Spa on a computer game, reported as Grand Prix 2, before taking pole at the Belgian GP. thread post post
• 1996-10-22 MicroProse tech support said there were no plans for a Grand Prix 2 update with wet weather, a 1996 season or network play. thread post
• 1997-04-08 MicroProse stated that there would be no network play update or expansion for Grand Prix 2. thread post
• 1997-10-10 Instant Access released a Paul Ricard demo of Perfect Grand Prix, its commercial track pack for Grand Prix 2. thread post
• 1997-10-29 MicroProse said it would withdraw Grand Prix 2 from sale on 31 December after its FOCA licence was not renewed. post
• 1998-01-10 Grand Prix 2 was withdrawn from sale after MicroProse's F1 licence expired at the end of 1997. post post
• 1998-06-11 MicroProse UK customer support stopped posting on the group after a row over its claim that GP2 editors were illegal. thread post

Key threads

• Spectrum HoloByte announces GP2 worldwide launch date 1996-07-12 · 25 posts
  Spectrum HoloByte/MicroProse support posted a press release setting the worldwide launch of Grand Prix 2 for July 23, 1996. Readers were skeptical given a year of delays, while the support representative Gabriel answered questions about shipping, regional availability and direct sales numbers.
• Anger over reports of no Grand Prix 2 update 1996-10-20 · 136 posts
  After a poster relayed MicroProse tech support saying there were no plans for a GP2 update with wet weather, a 1996 season or network play, a long and abusive argument followed. Critics said MicroProse had advertised features it did not deliver and gave poor support. Defenders, including John Wallace, said the box made no such promises and called GP2 an excellent sim, and conflicting reports of a planned IPX patch kept the dispute going.
• Geoff Crammond confirms work on Grand Prix 3 1998-03-07 · 110 posts
  A PC Format interview reported Geoff Crammond was working on GP3 as an evolution of GP2. The news reopened debate over GP2's slow-motion approach when the CPU is overloaded versus dropping frames. The thread then argued at length whether racing sims are 'just games' or genuine simulations.
• MicroProse rep calls GP2 editors illegal, sparking backlash 1998-06-06 · 55 posts
  A question about whether GP2 cars differ in performance drew Mark Rich of MicroProse Europe, who said they did and that third-party editors were illegal and could break the game. Regulars who had used GP2Edit and track editors extensively disputed this and challenged whether he spoke for the company. He confirmed he gave the official customer-services line, and the group argued that community add-ons had kept GP2 alive.
• Survey of legendary racing simulations 2000-04-18 · 54 posts
  Tim Wheatley surveyed readers for a planned history of landmark racing sims. Nominations included Revs, Indy 500, Accolade Grand Prix Circuit, F1GP, NASCAR Racing, ICR2, GP2 and GPL, along with Pitstop II, Hard Drivin' and Chequered Flag. Doug Milliken and others recalled 1960s model-board driving simulators.
• Grand Prix 2 complaints list and steering help debate 1996-07-30 · 53 posts
  Chris Longhurst posted a list of complaints about GP2's damage model, tunnel sound, the AI and steering help that could not be disabled with the keyboard. JEB argued that keyboard users should not criticise a sim built for wheels, which led to sharp exchanges. Others explained that steering help can be switched off by creating a custom controller configuration, and also discussed the missing weather and network play, and frame rates on modest PCs.
• 486/120 or Pentium upgrade for Papyrus sims, and GP2 speed fears 1996-01-06 · 42 posts
  A user asked whether an AMD 486/120 or a Pentium 75/100 would better run ICR II and NASCAR; most recommended a Pentium for its PCI bus and upgrade path. Rick Genter of Papyrus confirmed ICR II's graphics engine was Pentium-optimised and said a GP2 demo he saw ran at 140-150% processor occupancy in VGA on a P90. This prompted extrapolated fears about GP2 performance, which others criticised as based on an old show demo and possibly biased; Genter said his observation was personal.
• Pirated early GP2 build circulates with a virus 1996-06-17 · 40 posts
  Posters reported that a 21-disk pirated version of Grand Prix 2 had appeared on warez sites, and most condemned downloading it ahead of the retail release. Investigation by readers showed it was an old alpha build dated around December 1995, VGA-only and carrying the Burglar.1150 virus. A few users still begged for the download location and were mocked.
• Fake Geoff Crammond post claims GP2 cancelled 1996-04-07 · 38 posts
  A message on the MicroProse message board, apparently from Geoff Crammond, claimed that GP2 was being rewritten or dropped because of financial and AI problems. It alarmed readers until it was shown to be a hoax, and the poster later apologised as an 'Imposter Geoff Crammond'. Spectrum HoloByte/MicroProse support manager Gabriel Turk confirmed the posts were bogus. Readers then questioned why UK magazines had already reviewed a game that was still in development.
• Grand Prix 3 to be unveiled at ECTS 1999-08-12 · 38 posts
  An ECTS show preview reported that Hasbro Interactive would unveil Geoff Crammond's Grand Prix 3 at the show. Sceptics predicted huge system requirements, no multiplayer and no patches as with GP2, while others defended GP2's graphics and longevity. Posters debated GP2's 'canned spins' and its 486 system requirements, and hoped GP3 would add online racing like GPL's.
• MicroProse rep says no network play or GP3 update 1997-04-08 · 36 posts
  MicroProse's Mark Rich posted that Grand Prix 2's 3D engine could not support network play and that no such update had ever been promised. The reply drew a flood of abuse and complaints about poor customer support and frame rates. Some pointed out that their boxes advertised multiplayer or network play, while others noted this meant link and modem play, and several vowed not to buy a GP3.
• Juan Pablo Montoya plays GPL and GP2 2000-04-06 · 35 posts
  A reporter offered to put sim questions to CART champion Juan Pablo Montoya. Jan Verschueren then posted a published fan Q&A in which Montoya named GP2 and Grand Prix Legends as his favourite games, which delighted readers. A later magazine interview said he had used CART Precision Racing to learn tracks. The planned interview did not happen because of schedule changes.
• Why GP2 graphics performance is poor 1996-07-19 · 34 posts
  Users asked why GP2 slowed down in heavy scenes when Quake ran smoothly. John Wallace noted even a Pentium Pro 200 could not hold 25 fps at Monaco and criticised the lack of VESA 2 linear framebuffer support. Imre Olajos found that setting the target frame rate below the estimate avoided slowdowns, and others explained GP2 slows game time on overload while ICR2 drops frames.
• How online racing sims should handle physics and latency 1998-02-13 · 31 posts
  Christer Andersson proposed ideas for future online sim architecture. Former Papyrus developer Jim Sokoloff explained that physics needs higher rates than graphics and should run on a fixed timebase decoupled from frame rate, that each client in Grand Prix Legends runs its own physics, and discussed extrapolation and cheating. Doug Milliken described how Atari's Hard Drivin' separated physics and graphics processors.
• MicroProse denies Grand Prix 3 plans, fans dispute it 1998-05-27 · 23 posts
  Asked about Grand Prix 3, Mark Rich of MicroProse Europe stated that neither Geoff Crammond nor MicroProse had plans for a GP2 sequel and that MicroProse remained Crammond's exclusive publisher. Posters cited a PC Format interview in which Crammond discussed a new game and attacked MicroProse's support for GP1 and GP2. A spoof post in Crammond's name added confusion, and the matter stayed unresolved.
• GP2 goes on sale early in German Karstadt stores 1996-07-12 · 21 posts
  A German poster reported that Grand Prix 2 was on sale at Karstadt stores under a special deal, ahead of other markets. Others were skeptical, but several Germans confirmed buying a German-language limited edition with a mouse pad. Americans complained about waiting longer.
• Grand Prix 2 delayed to March 1996 1995-11-20 · 20 posts
  A magazine report that Grand Prix 2's release had slipped to March 1996 prompted speculation, including rumours of a dispute or cancellation. Quentin Chaney of MicroProse posted that Geoff Crammond was still developing the game, tweaking gameplay while artists upgraded artwork to SVGA, and that it would be released in the coming year. Others noted adverts and pre-orders already running.
• Jacques Villeneuve used Grand Prix 2 to learn Spa 1996-08-23 · 20 posts
  Posters reported TV commentators and newspapers saying Jacques Villeneuve had learned the Spa circuit on a computer game before the 1996 Belgian GP, which was presumed to be GP2. He reportedly qualified only 18th in the game, which amused the group. Some joked that MicroProse had paid for the mention.
• CPR patch verdict turns into GP2 versus F1RS argument 1998-01-15 · 119 posts
  Asked whether the CART Precision Racing patch fixed the AI, several replied it did not and they had deleted the game. The thread turned into a long, heated argument between Greg Cisko, who said F1RS made GP2 obsolete, and Randy Magruder, John Wallace and Richard Walker, who preferred aspects of GP2's driving feel and menus. Later posts covered Microsoft's statements about further CPR support.
• Can any PC run Grand Prix 2 at full detail? 1997-04-21 · 106 posts
  A user asked whether any CPU could run Grand Prix 2 in SVGA at full detail and 25 fps. MicroProse's Mark Rich said no current processor could and that 16–17 fps was acceptable to most, which provoked hostile replies about GP2's engine, missing 3D support and MicroProse's support. Users compared overclocked Pentiums, K6 and Pentium Pro results, and the long thread moved into calls to boycott MicroProse and arguments with David Gary.
• Long flame war over Geoff Crammond and Grand Prix 2 1997-02-12 · 90 posts
  A question about whether Geoff Crammond had ever posted on the group led to a long, heated fight over whether GP2 was an unfinished 'beta'. Critics led by David Gary cited frame rates and missing weather and multiplayer, while defenders praised its physics, AI and track modelling. Side arguments compared F1 with CART and NASCAR passing, and posts became increasingly personal.
• Comparing Grand Prix 2 and F1 Racing Simulation 1998-01-19 · 61 posts
  A fan asked how GP2 and F1 Racing Simulation compared. One poster rated GP2 better for physics, sound, menus and speed sensation, which F1RS fans disputed. Debate then focused on F1RS's inaccurate tracks such as Suzuka, Hungaroring and Montreal, with Bruce Kennewell arguing track accuracy did not matter and others disagreeing.
• Does GP3 still have GP2's canned spins? 2000-07-02 · 61 posts
  Morgan Wooten asked whether GP3 kept GP2's 'canned' spins, and Ed Solheim said it seemed so from his Goodwood test drive. Some defended GP2's spins as genuine physics, while others such as Jan Verschueren cited power cutting out at about 180 degrees and slides that could not be stopped. Gregor Veble suggested GP2 may have modelled yaw inertia more realistically than other sims, which makes spins hard to catch.
• GPL steering linearity and Ackermann geometry 1998-04-12 · 58 posts
  Charles Mak praised GPL's physics but asked for GP2-style speed-sensitive steering. A long discussion followed on linear versus non-linear steering settings with different wheels, why steering feels heavier at speed, and Ackermann geometry, explained by Jim Sokoloff, Matthew Knutsen and Doug Milliken. A side quarrel involved Bart Brown and an anonymous critic.
• Powerslides, understeer and tyre temperatures in F1RS 1998-01-28 · 55 posts
  A follow-up on F1RS's handling turned into whether modern F1 cars powerslide, with posters citing Schumacher and Alesi. The thread then discussed using tyre temperatures and camber for setup in F1RS and GP2, with Richard Walker quoting Carroll Smith that even temperatures are not always optimal. Later posts covered the 1998 F1 rule changes.
• Debate over GP2 cockpit view and visible front wheels 1995-11-08 · 51 posts
  Discussion of the Grand Prix 2 cockpit view, which hid the front wheels and showed an animated steering wheel, split into F1GP and IndyCar camps. Some argued unseen wheels give better perspective, while others said they make judging curbs hard; a PC Zone interview was cited in which Geoff Crammond praised Papyrus's IndyCar Racing. Jim Sokoloff and Rick Genter of Papyrus explained that keys such as 'A' could not be remapped in NASCAR and ICR II because they were hard-coded, and the thread drifted into F1-versus-IndyCar racing arguments and memories of EA's Ferrari F1.
• Grand Prix 2 frame rates and processor occupancy 1997-12-13 · 48 posts
  A K6-200 owner asked what GP2 frame rate to expect, and a poster claiming a 25.6 fps estimate with all detail was called a liar. The thread clarified that the in-game estimate is unreliable and that GP2 keeps the set frame rate per simulated second, slowing the simulation when occupancy exceeds 100%. Later posts debated whether GP2's graphics engine was good given it used no 3D acceleration.
• Debate over whether GP3 is just GP2 again 1999-09-06 · 44 posts
  Some argued the Grand Prix 3 screenshots looked no better than GP2 and that it reused the old engine, while others said the software-mode shots were impressive and hardware support was promised. Karl Zosel claimed GP2 had been a rip-off, sparking a hostile exchange with insults. Others recalled that GP2's physics had been revolutionary and that its SVGA mode was reportedly a late addition.
• IndyCar versus F1 handling, and which car is faster 1996-10-20 · 41 posts
  A player asked why cars corner faster in GP2 than in ICR2 on road courses. The answer that F1 cars are lighter with more downforce turned into a long argument over whether an F1 car or an IndyCar would be faster on an oval such as Michigan. Some posts were insulting, but most agreed that IndyCars are faster on ovals and F1 cars are faster on road courses.
• PC Gamer's GP2 review sparks debate over F1GP physics and gravity 1996-01-25 · 41 posts
  Fraser Mun summarised PC Gamer's early review of Grand Prix 2, including claims about graphics and frame rates on a P90. Readers were sceptical of a first magazine review, and a question about whether F1GP modelled gravity turned into a long physics argument over mass, inertia, weight and friction. Fans of the Papyrus sims and of Crammond's games traded jibes about missing features such as clutch, stalling and cars rolling on hills.
• Sharing GP2 log:on CPU and video speed scores 1996-07-25 · 40 posts
  Players posted CPU and video scores from GP2's log:on option for many systems. Matrox Millennium and ET6000 cards scored highest, while Cirrus Logic, ATI and some other cards scored very poorly. John Wallace attributed GP2's weak use of fast cards to its lack of linear framebuffer support.
• Do F1 drivers like Montoya learn tracks with sims? 2001-04-02 · 38 posts
  Lutrell wondered which sim Juan Pablo Montoya used to learn Brazil, noting Villeneuve reportedly learned Spa with a sim. Posters cited an interview where Montoya said he used CART Precision Racing and favoured Grand Prix 2, and a track author said a driver used his GP2 Phillip Island track before winning a real championship. Dave Henrie's half-joking conspiracy theory that Verstappen hit Montoya deliberately was widely rejected.
• Was PC Gamer's 95% Grand Prix 2 review overrated 1997-01-31 · 38 posts
  Posters accused PC Gamer of overrating GP2 and other games to please advertisers, while others defended GP2's performance on modest PCs. PC Gamer editor Dan Bennett replied that he reviewed the final boxed version, had listed the lack of network play as a negative, and had not run into the problems some described.
• GP2 difficulty, graphics settings and UK availability 1996-07-17 · 38 posts
  UK players discussed receiving GP2 by mail order and found it much harder than GP1, with AI cars far ahead even at amateur level. Others explained that automatic detail sets graphics once rather than adjusting during play, and complained the manual omitted graphics options. Some noted the box and CD were dated 1995, suggesting they were printed long before the game was finished.
• Grand Prix 2 top speeds at Hockenheim and driving aids 1996-07-29 · 37 posts
  Players compared top speeds and lap times at Hockenheim in GP2, with most reporting around 330 km/h and higher figures only in a slipstream. John Wallace reported that a lead tester confirmed all cars share Williams-level performance, and CompuServe hotlap records were cited. The discussion broadened into whether driving aids such as the racing line and steering help count as assistance, and whether real F1 drivers prefer oversteer or understeer.
• ICR2 handling versus GP2 expectations, then F1 vs IndyCar 1996-06-28 · 37 posts
  A poster who claimed real single-seater experience called ICR2's handling laughable and hoped GP2 would model power oversteer better, prompting replies that he simply could not drive it. A beta tester described GP2's throttle help and the need to feather the throttle. The thread drifted into a long off-topic argument comparing F1 and IndyCar drivers such as Hill, Mansell and Villeneuve.
• Grand Prix 2 rediscovered on modern hardware 1999-08-03 · 37 posts
  Several posters reinstalled Grand Prix 2 and found it ran well and felt more alive on fast late-1990s PCs, calling it the best modern F1 sim with updated car and track sets. Tips covered running it under Windows 98 and sound card setup. Some noted that even a Pentium III struggled with full detail at the Monaco start.
• Fears that Grand Prix 3 will disappoint 1999-09-06 · 36 posts
  After ECTS reports that GP3 was 60% complete, still lacked 3D acceleration and reused GP2 code, posters worried it would be a letdown with GP2's 'canned spins' and processor occupancy slowdowns. One ECTS visitor said it looked like GP2 with a facelift, while defenders argued that physics should come first and Geoff Crammond had always delivered. Some said they would not buy it without force feedback, hardware acceleration or a Linux version.
• Community bug and wish list for GP2 1996-07-25 · 36 posts
  Users compiled GP2 bugs and wishes to send to MicroProse, including fuel strategy confusion, aggressive auto-braking, unrealistic damage and quick repairs, the lack of a quick restart, keyboard remapping, replay saving, VESA 2.0 support, weather and network multiplayer. Some items turned out to be explained in the manual.
• What did Crammond do in four years since GP2? 2000-07-27 · 35 posts
  Posters debated why GP3 took four years, suggesting Crammond took a long break after GP2 or worked mostly alone in assembler, with Hasbro adding staff late for 3D support. Jeff Vincent pointed out that Papyrus had a 3D version of IndyCar Racing II working before GP2 was even released. A side discussion covered GPL's lack of tyre wear modelling.

Busiest threads

• Anger over reports of no Grand Prix 2 update (65 posts about it)
• Can any PC run Grand Prix 2 at full detail? (57 posts about it)
• Geoff Crammond confirms work on Grand Prix 3 (56 posts about it)
• CPR patch verdict turns into GP2 versus F1RS argument (52 posts about it)
• Long flame war over Geoff Crammond and Grand Prix 2 (42 posts about it)
• MGPRS2 versus GP2 popularity argument (30 posts about it)
• Grand Prix 2 frame rates and processor occupancy (27 posts about it)
• F1RS or GP2: another sim war (27 posts about it)
• Is Grand Prix 2 the best driving simulation (26 posts about it)
• Comparing Grand Prix 2 and F1 Racing Simulation (26 posts about it)
• Does GP3 still have GP2's canned spins? (25 posts about it)
• Lack of good modern F1 sims: GP2 versus MGPRS2 (24 posts about it)
• Why GP2 graphics performance is poor (23 posts about it)
• Debate over whether GP3 is just GP2 again (23 posts about it)
• Will iRacing ever make a PC sim? Plus Crammond debate (22 posts about it)

Sentiment by year

Each post that discussed the sim was rated from −2 (very negative) to +2 (very positive).

Who talked about it most

John Wallace · 371 Michael E. Carver · 333 Jo Helsen · 277 ymenard · 266 Greg Cisko · 245 P Gagg · 172 Richard Walker · 172 David Gary · 111 John' Joao Sil · 98 Byron Forbes · 97 Bruce Kennewell · 87 Steve Ferguson · 74 Jo · 73 Dave Bowers · 64 Dave Hawnt · 62 Phillip McNelley · 59 Chris Bloom · 59 Christer Andersson · 57 Stephan Schu · 56 GraDee · 55

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