rec.autos.simulators

> >ROFLMAO!!

> *plonk*

> >Hogwash. Under common law all businesses have the legal right to protect
> >their assets and the rest of their customers from the actions of
customers
> >that are behaveing in a manner that is designed to damage those assets
and
> >decrease the pleasure of the remainder of the customers. For instance: a
> >green fee permit for a golf course does not give the right to damage the
> >greens or interfer with the enjoyment of the course by other golfers even
if
> >those prohibitions are not explicitly printed  on the green fee ticket.

> >Your argument regarding the legalities of the situation would be laughed
out
> >of court.

> >Dav-Erb

> And what about the people being banned unfairly? They do have a case
> and would win if they could prove it in court.

> Vintook

> "B. Hilton" <dcibra...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:34409625.0108250313.69c75ae5@posting.google.com...
> > From: dcibra...@yahoo.com (B. Hilton)
> > Newsgroups: rec.autos.sport.nascar
> > Subject: Nascar 4 Racing (PAPY) BANNED ME FROM RACING ONLINE!!!
> > NNTP-Posting-Host: 164.89.253.3
> > Message-ID: <34409625.0108250304.56d51...@posting.google.com>

> > The people at Papy Racing has now been banning people TOTALLY from
> > racing online... if you are caught intentionally wrecking somone, they
> > will ban your cd key which will not allow you to play online AT ALL.
> > The offline version AI is so terrible... the online version is the
> > only thing worth a crap to play.

> > Anyways, I was pleading my case on the papy webpage Nascar 4
> > Forum...and they banned me from there calmly stating the facts as to
> > what they call "wrecking".

> > here's their rules:
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Guidelines For Reporting NASCAR? Racing 4
> > Multiplayer Intentional Wrecking*

> > *Please read this entire document thoroughly before you consider
> > reporting an incident of intentional wrecking.

> > In an effort to give the NASCAR? Racing 4 multiplayer user an avenue
> > to report incidents of intentional wrecking, we will take reports if
> > all guidelines are met that are outlined in this document. You will
> > need to make sure that your report is of intentional wrecking and NOT
> > the result of incidents related to accidents caused by warp, unskilled
> > drivers, or plain old "racing incidents".

> > Because we only have a small amount of time to devote to reviewing
> > these reports, if we end up getting flooded with reports that are not
> > incidents of intentional wrecking, we will be forced to discontinue
> > this line of communication. So, please make sure that your report is
> > legitimate. If it is determined that a report is not legitimate, we
> > will no longer accept reports from that individual.
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> > Well makes sense to me (even though I ALWAYS thought banning people to
> > race their game online was not good business practice and bad
> > morally).
> > So I emailed papy to ask why I was banned since I have NEVER IN MY
> > LIFE in a multiplayer game intentionally gone after to wreck someone.
> > Ya see, in this game they have built in a nice Ratings feature...
> > where the better driver you are.. you have a higher ranking 0-10 and
> > LPI (laps per incident).  My ratings were VERY high for both... which
> > that should have triggered them into knowing I am not a wrecker.

> > Anyways, they responded, very rudely I might add (i still have the
> > emails)... and at least they were kind enough to send me the replay
> > from which they banned me from.

> > As I go home and watch the replay (which I still have if ANYONE WANTS
> > TO VIEW IT)... I am TOTALLY AMAZED for 2 reasons
> > #1 - I have a majorly damaged car trying to just complete some laps
> > and in the replay it shows me racing about 5 or 6 laps... and the
> > field is spread out and goes by me about 2 different times... every
> > car that passes me I give them TONS of room to pass making no contact.
> > #2 - (here's the good part) - THERE WASN'T EVEN A WRECK!!!!!!!

> > here's what they call me a wrecker from:
> > As I come off of turn 2 (at Lowe's Speedway) I drift up high... lookin
> > in my rear view mirrow I see the leaders coming fast up behind me
> > (since I am off pace)... so I do the smart think (i thought) since the
> > racing line is up near the wall down the backstretch... I quickly dove
> > to the bottom apron on the straightstretch to let the lead cars pass
> > me... what happen was either my reaction time was too slow and/or the
> > leaders were flying cause unfortunately as I was going low to let them
> > pass, the leader dives low to dodge me... basically we end up in the
> > same area trying to get out of the way of each other.
> > So what happens... well, I dive down and his car hits mine in the left
> > rear which spins me out into the inside wall... what happened to him
> > you ask.. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING he kept racing without any damage to his
> > car!!!

> > Ok so at this point... I have a damaged race car with more damage
> > (haha)... as people continue to drop out of the race and with only a
> > few laps left (and since the rating system is setup like it is) I had
> > to complete a few more laps to help my score.  So I kept going... and
> > continue to let the cars pass me with tons of room over and over
> > again.  Towards the end of the replay... I have to hit the apron on
> > turn 4 dodging a wrecked car stopped in the racing groove... when
> > coming off of the apron... i shoot up high obviously, and brush the
> > wall coming off of 4, which in return bouces me off a lil which the
> > frontstretch at lowes is fairly narrow and makes a close call with
> > another car...but yet again NO CONTACT IS MADE and no wreck occured.
> > Ironically this car that I came close to again was the same car as
> > before (which they claim I wrecked) so from that they ASSUMED I was
> > out to wreck him intentionally.

> > With my ratings and laps per incident so high, I would be an idiot to
> > go wrecking people screwing up my numbers that I had worked so hard to
> > get... but they don't see it that way I guess.

> > Now, the ONLY WAY I can get back to race online is to go out and buy a
> > new game which is totally ridiculous in my opinion.   See, my thinking
> > is NO ONE should be banned from using a part of the game that is the
> > best part... they design a rating system to keep the good drivers away
> > from the wreckers... only problem is it doesn't work as they thought
> > it would... so instead of fixing it again (they already redid it once
> > in the first patch), they start banning people totally from racing
> > online, for good.

> > I suggested just simply resetting those "so-called" wreckers back to
> > the rating of 0 and have them start all over again, and if they were
> > still a good driver, they woud build their rating back up.  They
> > responded again rudely against that.

> > I have all the emails they have sent along with the replay if any of
> > you with Nascar 4 is interested in viewing it.  I have no problem
> > showing anyone, because simply I am not a wrecker and in the replay,
> > although there being close calls, there was NO WRECK.

> > I am just baffled by all of this... and because of this, it concerns
> > me that others online may become banned eventually for something papy
> > may see as an "intentional wreck" but is simply not the case.

> > Wanta hear something else bad... well I am (or should I say was) in
> > this racing league... and was getting very serious and competitive
> > about it... so since the Nascar 4 games eats up a system (i had a
> > pentium 3 500 w/ 128mb ram and 20gb hard drive) I decided to buy a new
> > computer now instead of waiting on down the road(AMD 1.4ghz, 256mb
> > ram, 64mb geforce 2 video card) and a new Nascar Pro 2 racing wheel
> > and pedals from thrustmaster.  Bascially I would not have had to buy a
> > new computer if I wasn't into racing online in the league so much...
> > but now that I am banned... well you get what I'm saying.  :(

> > I have been a MAJOR Papy fan since the Nascar Racing 1 days,
> > purchasing every nascar racing game and expansion pack all the way up
> > through Nascar 4.  Now, I might have to go for an EA Sports Nascar
> > game just to race online.

> > If ANYONE would like to see the replay they sent me of the "wreck the
> > never happened" and/or the emails from Papy's manager... please email
> > me at dcibra...@yahoo.com and I would be happy to send them to you. :)

> > Anyone wanta comment on this...or banning in general?
> > email papy's manager at online....@papy.com

> > thanks for your time!

> > BH
> > Dodgefan!

> --
> Biz

> "Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand
> alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and
> the....." - Ash

> > > NO! Papy is of the view that if you intentionally wreck others, you
> don't
> > > get to play. If you are just a crappy driver you will not get banned.

> > I dunno.  I suck pretty bad.  (That's why I rarely play onine ...)  But
> > when I wreck (usually totally by accident because I overdrove the car)
> > it certainly LOOKS intentional.  (And the other computer users can't see
> > the "OOPS" or "OH DAMN" look on my face!)

> I doubt you have a case.  You are racing on their servers and using their
> service.  They have the right to serve who they wish so long as they don't
> descrimate based on religion, race, sex or *** orientation.

> Mind you, I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV.

> > Even if that were the case, bad judgement is still not the same as
> > intentionally wrecking.  Maybe he waited too long to move to the low
> > line, and as I recall his description of the front stretch incident,
> > that is a typical scenario of events when you make a mistake.  Without
> > seeing the replay, we can't make a valid call on it one way or the
> > other.