rec.autos.simulators

You knew it was going to happen, and so did I. It happens almost every year.
Three times last year alone. When you support an activity that you know will
result in the death of someone, then it's not a tragedy. It's simply
disgusting.

I keep hearing the phrase, "Death is a part of auto racing, and these
drivers understand that but want to do it anyway." Bullshit. It isn't a part
of all types of auto racing. Just NASCAR. Formula 1 hasn't had a driver die
since 1994. Before that it was 1982. NASCAR is about beer and crashes.
Safety is a science in F1, and their record proves it. They have the top
experts in the world in charge of the safety of it's drivers. NASCAR is a
joke and the modern equivalent of the galdiator races.

If you support NASCAR, then you support the INEVITABLE death of it's
drivers. How the hell are you then sad when one dies? Turns my stomach when
I read or see the melodramatic tributes to a fan favorite. I LOVE F1, but if
the drivers were dying I'd say close it down right now. I have said on this
newsgroup before that I didn't think the F1 drivers of the '60's as modeled
in GPL were brave, heroic or "real" drivers because they raced knowing death
was a real possibility. I think they were simply foolish people who didn't
value their lives very much.

There is NO reason why drivers have to die in NASCAR. It's simply a POORLY
run, bush league type of auto racing with fans that apparently don't TRULY
care about the safety of it's drivers. It's an embarrassment. Drivers still
have the choice of wearing open-faced helmets? Drivers have the choice to
wear a neck brace that obviously could have saved the lives of previous dead
drivers?

If F1 can have such a tremendous safety record, then there is NO excuse for
NASCAR's terrible one. It's THAT simple.

Shut it down or just count the races until the next dead driver is pulled
from his car. Then the people who are in charge of NASCAR, and it's fans can
once again pay tribute to them.

Pathetic.

David G Fisher

David G Fisher

http://www.speedvision.com/pub/articles/racing/08inews/010219a.html

Cheers,

Steve B.

That's about the most BS I've read in awhile. A couple of things, you can't
compare F1 and Nascar. Two totally different types of racing. Race marshal
Paolo Ghislimberti was killed by flying debris after a collision in the
Italian Grand Prix at Monza last year. And your comment about 60's drivers
being foolish is just unbelievable. Nascar is not about beer and crashes.
It's about tight racing and going the full distance. F1 is starting to look
like a parade lap and the only passing done in the pits. I like all forms of
racing, F1, Nascar, Cart, even IRL. I think you should of put a little more
thought in your post.
Anthony Brooks

Did you scream that babbling in 1994 when Senna and Ratzenberger both died
the same weekend, when Wendlinger got a severe crash at Monaco, when
Barrichello had a death-defying crash from the lack of safety in Imola's
track configuration, etc..?

Racing is dangerous.  People have, are and will continue to be killed or
severely injured.  Deal with it, or stop watching it.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- May the Downforce be with you...
-- http://www.ymenard.com/
-- People think it must be fun to be a genius, but they don't realise how
hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world.

I guess *** ***s are brave too, because they certainly put their lives
at high risk in order to enjoy their hobby.

How about drunken bicyclists?

http://www.racesimcentral.net/***.com/news/r/010220/16/science-health-bikes-dc

David G Fisher

Four dead in NASCAR in the past season + one race this year.

NASCAR is a badly run auto racing series. F1 is light years ahead of it.

David G Fisher

--
Philip D'Amato

00 ZX-6R
00 S4

<snip>

From now on I'll just continue to call it a ***form of auto racing that
has far more in common with the WWF than anything else.

49 year old drivers?  Artificial close racing? Dead bodies? Beer, beer, and
more beer.

David G Fisher

If thousands of people get together to start watching people die while in
the middle of having sex, then yes, I'd probably be strongly in favor of an
event like that being shut down.

David G Fisher

And yes, I'm a race fan too. But I'm a race fan of racing which is done by
people who tend to evolve over time, and who think that doing something
(anything at all) at it's absolute highest level is something to strive for
at all times.

David G Fisher

sure, david. but just set the clock back a few years.... i dunno, say 1994.
that year, there were 0 winston cup series deaths, and 2 F1 deaths in *one
weekend*. looking at that data set, you'd have to be crying for the
shuttering of F1.

F1 has been lucky lately. nascar quite unlucky (at least), and may indeed
have reached a point at which changes need to be made. but you have to
remember all the diffferences in the series. just the number of races, laps,
and drivers alone makes direct comparisons impossible. (i wonder how many F1
seasons worth of driver-miles are contained in the first 1/3rd of the nascar
schedule?)

auto racing is inherently dangerous.
surely, it should be no more dangerous than it has to be, but you have to
recall NASCAR's excellent safety record up until the past 2 years. were they
lucky? yes, probably. should they be making changes and moving faster?
almost surely it's easy to say that now. but "badly run bush league" is
pretty harsh.

F1 has been quite lucky as of late, but you shouldn't delude yourself that
it's much more than that. do they have some excellent safety devices and
track modifications? yes, in part due to senna's death, they do now. but
they are hardly immune from the dangers of the sport. some would argue that
driving without a roof over one's head is simply asking for trouble a la
greg moore, making F1 even less rational than a stock-type series. whatever.
the point is that these kinds of risks are inherent to all forms of the
sport, and your beloved F1 is anything but insulated from these risks.
almost any F1 crash carries the possibility of a driver's head making direct
contact, for example.

we can only hope that DE's death has a similar effect on nascar's safety
efforts that senna's seemed to inspire in his series. but with your
attitiude i'd say you're probably better off giving up motorsports
altogether... you're bound to be disgusted again, unfortunately.

Formula 1 : 18 year old drivers (how high is their car insurance?), cars
with traction control running single file, dead bodies, and wine, cheese,
and champagne.

Actually, I follow F1 too.  There's something about those Ferraris.  Come to
think of it, my company is sponsoring Sauber now, maybe I'll head out to
Indy this year...

--
Philip D'Amato

00 ZX-6R
00 S4

(here's a hint- sometimes, people who enjoy F1 also enjoy beer, too. no,
really!)

what on earth does what you've written have to do with anything?

thankfully, no one will be taking your call for anything to be shut down
seriously.... your logical flaws and sheer, obvious bias drown out any
possible point you might try to make.