rec.autos.simulators

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

John Walla

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by John Walla » Thu, 28 Oct 1999 04:00:00

On Tue, 26 Oct 1999 11:30:19 +0000, Barton Spencer Brown


>results. It's a process, designed to protect EVERYONE involved --
>remember McLaren's purported "launch control" software code of a few
>years ago?

This isn't meant to nit-pick at a long and good explanation, but I
just wanted to pick up on this one point that I remembered differently
- wasn't that Benetton's launch control software, principally Schumi's
(with Brawn & Byrne)?

Cheers!
John

Barton Spencer Brow

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Barton Spencer Brow » Thu, 28 Oct 1999 04:00:00


> - wasn't that Benetton's launch control software, principally Schumi's
> (with Brawn & Byrne)?

Most probably -- my memory ain't so good. McLaren must have done
*something* *** in the recent past (besides making pious
pontifications about a "fair fight" in Malaysia and then slipping the
greasy bird to Jo Bauer, I mean...). Somebody help me hear...

BB

Mike Well

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Mike Well » Thu, 28 Oct 1999 04:00:00



Bauer hasn't spoken or made any admission since Sepang, AFAIK. And Atlas is
pro-Ferrari.

It's Max who made the statement, favouring the training-wheel assisted
Maranello world champions. ;-)

-Mike Wells

Mini M

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Mini M » Thu, 28 Oct 1999 04:00:00




> > Here's more F1 merriment from AtlasF1 news service. By all means, draw
> > your own conclusions -- far be it from me to present my own opinion as
> > anything but pure banana oil:
> > ---------------------------------------------------
> > Bauer Admits Mistake [so much for the infallibility of the FIA's tech
> > people AND measuring equipment -- BB]
> > Saturday October 23rd, 1999

> Bauer hasn't spoken or made any admission since Sepang, AFAIK. And Atlas is
> pro-Ferrari.

I have heard that Bauer has ruled favourably to Mercedes teamed cars in
the past.   Would this have anything to do with it?  
John Walla

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by John Walla » Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:00:00

On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 08:50:48 +0000, Barton Spencer Brown


>Most probably -- my memory ain't so good. McLaren must have done
>*something* *** in the recent past (besides making pious
>pontifications about a "fair fight" in Malaysia and then slipping the
>greasy bird to Jo Bauer, I mean...).

Call me cynical, but I'd be surprised if anyone who could afford to be
"up to something" wasn't "up to something". Thou shalt not get caught
is the phrase that springs to mind.

Cotton bud? (Sorry, couldn't resist...) :-)

Cheers!
John

Barton Spencer Brow

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Barton Spencer Brow » Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Call me cynical, but I'd be surprised if anyone who could afford to be

John--

The phrase that most immediately popped into my noggin when all this
buzhwa came down was my favorite JFK quote: "Where there's smoke,
there's usually a smoke-making machine."

<<Call me cynical, but I'd be surprised if anyone who could afford to be
"up to something" wasn't "up to something">>

Hmmmm....well, that would have to include everyone in F1 with the
possible exceptions of Arrows and Minardi...

BB

Greg Cisk

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Greg Cisk » Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:00:00




> > I'm sorry, but if they are out of spec, they are illegal...

> OK, last time (really!): The tech steward Jo Bauer made an "opinion"

<Windbag reply deleted to save space>

Wow that was some epistle! However just because a Kangaroo Court
let Ferrari off does not make it legal (remember OJ). They never said
the barge boards were within spec, they said that their instruments were
not capable of an accurate measurement, and the barge boards were
within the 5mm error. I find this excuse totally absurd. However... I say
that is all behind us, and Mclaren and Ferrari will settle it in about 48
hours :-)

--

Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

John Walla

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by John Walla » Sat, 30 Oct 1999 04:00:00

On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 22:55:57 -0500, "Greg Cisko"


>Wow that was some epistle! However just because a Kangaroo Court
>let Ferrari off does not make it legal (remember OJ). They never said
>the barge boards were within spec, they said that their instruments were
>not capable of an accurate measurement, and the barge boards were
>within the 5mm error.

You can definitely understand Ron Dennis' frustration - the board,
which was out by 10mm and illegal, suddenly becomes in-spec, and the
blame placed on a machine which is incapable of measuring accurately
enough. A machine that is two years old, laser-caibrated and costing
millions of dollars.

Now in my desk at the office I keep a 10 year old clear plastic
JALCARGO ruler that I use every day, which has been used to open
envelopes, throw at people, flick off the desk when thinking etc. With
that ruler I can resolve a measurement to the nearest millimetre, and
that is when the measurement is relatively meaningless. You have to
think that even if I was going to use that ruler to disqualify a
world-famous team from a world-famous event on which they have spent
one hundred million dollars or so....I'd be pretty careful about my
measurements? Maybe measure a couple of times, check the calibration,
maybe spring out the old plastic ruler and just make a triple check?

Still, as you say that's history, and the FIA(t) have overruled and
the money train rolls on to Suzuka. I can guarantee that this will be
only the second Grand Prix I haven't watched in 10 years, and I'm
equally sure that the FIA won't give a damn. Still, it's my small
protest at such open flouting of their own rules, and of ridiculing
the sport for the love of money.

Cheers!
John

Greg Cisk

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Greg Cisk » Sat, 30 Oct 1999 04:00:00


Well that settles it. I would never think of not watching the race. So
I guess you are more *** about F1 than I am :-)

--

Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

Barton Spencer Brow

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Barton Spencer Brow » Sat, 30 Oct 1999 04:00:00


> Wow that was some epistle! However just because a Kangaroo Court
> let Ferrari off does not make it legal

Greg, do you suffer from some unfortunate learning disability, or is it
simply an emotional problem? There *are* treatments for both, and I hope
you'll look into getting some help for yourself. There is no "legal" or
"illegal" in the context of the rules of a private club -- you're trying
to apply democratic nation/state judicial concepts to a system that
simply does not operate that way. If you can't take the time to read the
pertinent documents and understand the difference, then please don't
waste *my* time or the NGs bandwidth with your pointless repitition of
entirely superfluous drivel, OK? Really, you need some professional counseling...

BB

david kar

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by david kar » Sat, 30 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Who was it that said sometimes a cigar is just a cigar?


> On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 22:55:57 -0500, "Greg Cisko"

> >Wow that was some epistle! However just because a Kangaroo Court
> >let Ferrari off does not make it legal (remember OJ). They never said
> >the barge boards were within spec, they said that their instruments were
> >not capable of an accurate measurement, and the barge boards were
> >within the 5mm error.

> You can definitely understand Ron Dennis' frustration - the board,
> which was out by 10mm and illegal, suddenly becomes in-spec, and the
> blame placed on a machine which is incapable of measuring accurately
> enough. A machine that is two years old, laser-caibrated and costing
> millions of dollars.

> Now in my desk at the office I keep a 10 year old clear plastic
> JALCARGO ruler that I use every day, which has been used to open
> envelopes, throw at people, flick off the desk when thinking etc. With
> that ruler I can resolve a measurement to the nearest millimetre, and
> that is when the measurement is relatively meaningless. You have to
> think that even if I was going to use that ruler to disqualify a
> world-famous team from a world-famous event on which they have spent
> one hundred million dollars or so....I'd be pretty careful about my
> measurements? Maybe measure a couple of times, check the calibration,
> maybe spring out the old plastic ruler and just make a triple check?

> Still, as you say that's history, and the FIA(t) have overruled and
> the money train rolls on to Suzuka. I can guarantee that this will be
> only the second Grand Prix I haven't watched in 10 years, and I'm
> equally sure that the FIA won't give a damn. Still, it's my small
> protest at such open flouting of their own rules, and of ridiculing
> the sport for the love of money.

> Cheers!
> John

Greg Cisk

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Greg Cisk » Sun, 31 Oct 1999 04:00:00




> > Wow that was some epistle! However just because a Kangaroo Court
> > let Ferrari off does not make it legal

> Greg, do you suffer from some unfortunate learning disability, or is it

Apparently.

Yes. My prozac did not kick in when I posted that.

Are you a lawyer???

counseling...

Noted & filed...

Dork.

--

Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.

cisko [AT] ix [DOT] netcom [DOT] com

Barton Spencer Brow

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Barton Spencer Brow » Sun, 31 Oct 1999 04:00:00


> Who was it that said sometimes a cigar is just a cigar?

Ahhh, Monica Lewinsky?

BB

Barton Spencer Brow

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by Barton Spencer Brow » Sun, 31 Oct 1999 04:00:00


> Dork.

Being labeled a "dork" by Greg Cisko is the philosophical equivalent of
winning the MIT Science Fair...thanks!

BB

John Walla

OT: Ferrari Disqualified!

by John Walla » Mon, 01 Nov 1999 03:00:00

On Fri, 29 Oct 1999 13:55:09 -0500, "Greg Cisko"


>Well that settles it. I would never think of not watching the race. So
>I guess you are more *** about F1 than I am :-)

Perhaps not - I cracked, and watched Mika kick butt. Nice to see
Ferrari get some of their own treatment dished out for a change,
although a sizable whiff that Michael wasn't all THAT committed to any
cause other than constructor's championship, and who can blame him.
Irv really should learn that opening one's mouth should be carefully
considered prior to doing so...

Cheers!
John


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