rec.autos.simulators

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

Chris H

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Chris H » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 09:57:11

Mark, wish I had your signature line.  As for the serious question, when one
installs on a system which isn't connected to the Internet, the toll free
number (regional, around the world) is shown.

I don't work for anyone.  I'm disabled and on permanent Social Security
Disability.    I've also run everything from DOS 1.0 until today.  I posted
a link to a very good explanation of what goes into the activation count
earlier:  http://www.racesimcentral.net/

- Chris H.


jlohma

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by jlohma » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 09:58:57

I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't
buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thats another
subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you go out
and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is the finacial
one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwise why
should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software.
Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which is what
this tread started out being).

Gutt

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Gutt » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 12:26:57

Hmm interesting, but what happends when GPL 2 comes out and it needs XP?




> > Do you really think we can make or break MS...too late I think. I'd like
> to
> > hear your plan however :)

> Well, after reading this article below I have made up my mind. I'm going
> back to Win98, I'm going to install Win98Lite by Shane Brooks to gut out
IE,
> I'm going to use Opera as my web browser and I'm going to use Agent for
news
> and email. This is as far as I'm ever going with Microsft softare for the
> forseeable future.

> http://www.racesimcentral.net/#demandslist

> "Second, we do not recommend consumers use any Microsoft products, for a
> variety of reasons including its history on privacy and security. Creating
> something called an "import privacy rule" for IE6 constitutes an implied
> endor***t very remote from our estimation of the company and its
products.
> Regrettably, the products we recommend for people to protect their privacy
> online are not made by Microsoft. Other web browsers have consistently
> provided better cookie management features and less privacy-invasive
> defaults. It is very sad that the largest software manufacturer has done
so
> little for privacy, and is willfully continuing that trailership
position."

Don Burnett

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Don Burnett » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 12:49:30

I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01

Don Burnette


> Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0.
> --
> Chris H.







> > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything they
> > > sell -
> > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your computer
> > than
> > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt
> > piracy
> > > > would be any problem.

> > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that Norton
> > Ghost
> > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say
that
> XP
> > > gives far more bng for the buck.

> > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!?  Wow.  It can't even deal
with
> > NTFS partitions!  I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once.

> > Milhouse

> > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS *** whining in a
> > > newsgroup
> > > > any day.

> > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are some
> > > modern day Robin Hood's or what?

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:05:40

Actually, my guess is that they are being packet-written, and his Win98
doesn't have the UDF driver installed.

Packet-Written CD's (except in certain circumstances where some software
burners can 'close' them for use on other machines) are not a normal format
and need help.

-Larry


> As I said, I really probably know less about CD-ROMs/CD-R/CD-RW than
anyone,
> but dug out some information for you.  A good starting point is
> http://www.aumha.org/a/xpcd.htm which discusses file systems and a pretty
> good unveiling of the Windows XP built-in CD burner system (in item 2).
> There are also a couple other interesting links on that page.

> Without knowing the specific CD-ROMs involved on your XP or Win98 systems
or
> the specific media you're using, some of this is just a shot in the dark.

> (1)  Some CD-ROMs are partial to one brand or other CDs, and it depends on
> whether a CD-R or CD-RW is used in some cases.
> (2)  Shell recording creates Mode 2 multisession discs in a standard
> ISO-9660/Joliet format. Some older players can't handle mode 2 -- and some
> can't handle multisession discs. The combination needs an up to date
> reader - though up to date in this context really means something that's
no
> older than a few years.
> (3)  The recorded discs do read okay on Windows XP, correct?  Shell
> recording is also just terminally broken with some recorders, and an
> unreadable disc is one of the symptoms.
> (4)  Media quality can play a part in something like this as well. There's
a
> lot of cheap stuff floating around (some of it under well known brand
> names), so one of the standard suggestions is to try different media --
> preferably good quality, not the 100 blanks for $9.99 things that
sometimes
> show up at the box stores.
> (5)  The approach of testing a different program also may work, like Nero
> has a free, 30-day trial version available to see if the writing software
is
> the program.  Be sure to clear the enable tab for shell recording in the
> recorder's properties, though.
> (6)  You can try going into the recording page and set the speed down to a
> manual level - one within the CD-RW speed of the drive.  If you're using
> CD-RW media, the built-in software sees it as CD-R and will record at CD-R
> speed (usually twice as fast) if left to make the decision.
> (7)  If you're using multi-session Mode 2 CDRs that haven't been closed,
> then that may be why the Win98 system cannot read the disks although there
> are very few CD-ROMs now which can't handle multi-session such as certain
> early NECs up to about 1995.
> (8)  Burning compatible CDs and using them from one system to the next is
> described as being an "art," getting the disk where the laser will fully
> burn out a pit, without thinning down the background too much, coupled
with
> the setting in the reader for the reflected intensity switches between
being
> recognized as 0 or 1.  Computer CD-ROMs need to be officially multi-read
to
> be able to read CD-RW media, no matter the other file format
considerations,
> along with problems with some readers and "80-minute" disks.
> (9)  Without knowing the equipment you're using, there also seems to be a
> common laser frequency issue below 4-speed and even up to 8-speed on some
> drives.
> (10)  Some CD-R media (the "specials") have very thin top paint layer
which
> are intended to be labeled, that don't reflect adequately.

> And thanks to your asking the question, I know have an "inkling" of a
little
> bit of information about CD-R/RW functions.
> --
> Chris H.



> > P.S. I do have one techie question for you that maybe you can answer for
> me.
> > Why when I burn files to cdrom in XP are they not readable on a Win98
> > system? This is using drag and drop method of burning in XP and not 3rd
> > party software.

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:07:02

Actually, I was talking about the linked story where Microsoft admitted that
they collected user data 'by accident', and wasn't quite sure where all of
it ended up.

-Larry


> I believe, unless something changed, the personal
> information/preferences/etc. data doesn't go any farther than the user's
own
> hard drive.  Quite similar to the download/install file accessed when you
go
> to Windows Update and ask it to check for something new.  This was the
> direction it was headed back in October-November anyway, unless I totally
> misunderstood.

> The way it was explained to me was like, say, a bank account.  The account
> information is kept on the user hard drive, when you contact the bank, the
> bank requests permission to access the info on your hard drive and you
> either grant or deny it.  Without the user entering their own password to
> access the bank system, the bank won't even know who you are and where to
> check for the information.

> The Remote Assistance in XP is similar.  You have a problem, e-mail or
> Messenger a request to someone with XP for help.  They contact you as
> instructed in the message, and you authorize access.  If you don't want
them
> there, or at any time during the assistance the person starts heading in a
> direction you don't want, you can immediately kill the authorization and
> they're gone.  The user, who sees on their own screen what is happening,
> controls the situation, even being able to set a time limit for
> authorization in the initial assistance request.

> - Chris H.



> > It's frightening that Microsoft doesn't even know what they, themselves,
> are
> > doing with the data they collect!

> > Man, I can't wait to see the bloopers that crop up with .NET.  It will
be
> > epic, truly epic.

> > -Larry

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:09:00

Most places won't take back opened software, but anyway...

Phillips did a SMART thing when they notified these stupid record companies
that they can NOT use the Compact Disc-Digital Audio certification/insignia
on their defective CD's.

There are standard behind that symbol, and these defective CD's do not meet
that standard.

I say, way to go Phillips!

-Larry


> People aren't exactly returning XP, though...

> And I don't think Philips made any.  Rather, they said - as they hold lots
> of copyrights/patents on the CD standard - that any such CD cannot be
> actually called a compact disc.  Kinda pointless, yes.  But it's kinda
like
> the old SNK NES games.

> Milhouse



> > You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected
> music
> > CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being
able
> to
> > play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them.
> Shops
> > had a very high percentage returned so Philips listen to the consumer
and
> > wuthdrew these CDs. I wonder if MS will do the same with this
activation?

> > --

> > Steve Levett



> > > Richard,

> > > You _really_ think there's a choice in this matter, don't you ?

> > > There are _some_ choices, but not full choices.

> > > I have a reason for running XP.  I still have that reason, and I will
> > > continue to run XP.

> > > That, however, (the last time I checked), doesn't take away my right
to
> > > point out technical glitches and other complaints.

> > > -Larry







> > > > > > If you don't like it, then don't run the software.  It's
perfectly
> > > > > > simple.

> > > > > What, people aren't allowed to voice their opinion's about bad
> > > technology
> > > > > any more, Richard?

> > > > Of course they are, but it is silly to moan about Microsoft's
products
> > but
> > > > keep buying them!!!

> > > > That's almost as daft as people who complain about EA, then buy all
> > their
> > > F1
> > > > titles... ;-)

> > > > --
> > > > Richard.

> > > > "It's been a hard day's night, and I been working like a dog."

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:10:24

What about all those people who buy OEM machines, and get screwed out of
their real OS CD's, and only get restoration CD's.

Another fine Microsoft idea :(

-Larry


> I believe that's where we need to boot with the CD and enter using Safe
Mode
> without Internet enabled.  I haven't had to do that, but I believe it'll
let
> you copy personal data files off to another partition or hard drive.

> - Chris H.



> > I think the problem there is that it kicks in too soon, before services
> even
> > launch.  That's why I was unable to re-activate by internet because the
> NIC
> > card drivers never had a chance to re-install themselves.

> > At a minimum, MS should at least get you to the Desktop, and permit you
to
> > COPY files to another medium.  At least that way your data isn't held
> > hostage.  That really pissed me off more than anything else.

> > Oh, well :)

> > -Larry

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:11:06

5.01?  There's been an update?

Gotta go look :)

-Larry


> I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01

> Don Burnette



> > Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0.
> > --
> > Chris H.







> > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything
they
> > > > sell -
> > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your
computer
> > > than
> > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly doubt
> > > piracy
> > > > > would be any problem.

> > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that
Norton
> > > Ghost
> > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say
> that
> > XP
> > > > gives far more bng for the buck.

> > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!?  Wow.  It can't even deal
> with
> > > NTFS partitions!  I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once.

> > > Milhouse

> > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS *** whining in a
> > > > newsgroup
> > > > > any day.

> > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are
some
> > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what?

The Other Larr

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by The Other Larr » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:14:10

I'm sorry, but HOGWASH!

Since when did one give up their rights to comment on a product and it's
problems because they decided to buy it?

I never have understood this philosophy.  Not at all...

-Larry


Eldre

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Eldre » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:17:24



>You know, this whole activation thing reminds me of the copy protected music
>CDs that came out recently. There was such an uproar about not being able to
>play these CDs on different CD players and not being able to mp3 them.

Which was a dumb argument by the manufacturers.  I can run a line from my
stereo to my computer sound card.  Once that's connected, I can make an mp3 of
ANYTHING I run through the stereo.  TV programs, cassette tapes, albums, etc.
You simply CAN'T prevent people from making any audio signal an mp3 file, if
they have the right equipment...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Eldre

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Eldre » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:17:24


>It seems to have been dropped now though, *** gave it another think,
>but then again, the only 2 CD's released so far that I know of was
>Natalie Imbruglia (who ?) and Westlife (yippe, since I don't own a
>regular stereo, I'll never play their CD by accident should anyone leave
>one around here for some strange and obscure reason, thx ***,
>actually I'd like to see more CD's with this copy protection when I
>think about it, ........:-)

You missed the CDs by Michael Jackson and Incubus.  We occasionally get reports
from Sony about our students sharing mp3's from those 2 artists.  Yep, the
copy-protected CDs really kept people from making their mp3's...
Bravo, Sony!
<g>

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Eldre

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Eldre » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:17:24



>> Eldred, you are missing the point here: Chris doesn't care. Bill said it
>is
>> good, thus it is good. You're just a regular user (a technically
>sophisticated
>> one with networking skills etc.) but you're not supposed to act like you
>own the
>> pc. Just buy a Dell/Compaq/Gateway and leave it at that. Smile, be happy.
>Chris
>> is - because he doesn't own a copy that requires activation repeatedly.

>I have to agree with Chris, if you don't like the "features" of XP, don't
>buy it (although don't even think about buying a new computer, thats another
>subject though). All the moaning and complaining means nothing if you go out
>and buy it. The only message that Microsoft will listen to is the finacial
>one, if XP flops then that is a message they will listen to. Otherwise why
>should they care if your happy? You keep buying there software.
>Although, it is nice to hear of the problems to inform people (which is what
>this tread started out being).

I *don't* plan to buy it, as I've stated in another message.  However, my dad
wants a new computer, which I *know* will come with XP.  I'm SERIOUSLY
considering re-formatting the damn thing when he gets it, and installing
win98se...<g>
So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang OS, is that
an implicit approval of said OS installed therein?

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank - under construction...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Asbj?rn Bj?rnst

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Asbj?rn Bj?rnst » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 14:44:32


> So if you buy a new computer which is loaded with the new whiz-bang
> OS, is that an implicit approval of said OS installed therein?

Won't it display this EULA thing and ask if you accept?

I seem to remember a bunch of linux fans bying laptops (Which is
pretty har to get without an os, with a desktop system you can always
build it yourself.) refusing the license and trying to get their money
back for the software which they could prove they didn't use. Don't
think it worked, though.
--
  -asbjxrn

Chris H

OT - My first problem with Windows XP Product Activation

by Chris H » Wed, 30 Jan 2002 15:03:34

Free download for registered owners from www.powerquest.com .
--
Chris H.



> 5.01?  There's been an update?

> Gotta go look :)

> -Larry



> > I can vouch for DriveImage 5.01

> > Don Burnette



> > > Ghost 7.0 works fine with XP on NTFS, and so does DriveImage 5.0.
> > > --
> > > Chris H.







> > > > > > If MS didn't feel like overcharging for anything and everything
> they
> > > > > sell -
> > > > > > you could spend more on the software you're putting on your
> computer
> > > > than
> > > > > > the computer itself with Microsoft products alone - I highly
doubt
> > > > piracy
> > > > > > would be any problem.

> > > > > I don't consider MS pricing overpriced at all. Considering that
> Norton
> > > > Ghost
> > > > > 2002 costs $119.00 CAD and XP Home cost me $139.00 CAD I would say
> > that
> > > XP
> > > > > gives far more bng for the buck.

> > > > Ghost costs that much for absolute CRAP!?!?  Wow.  It can't even
deal
> > with
> > > > NTFS partitions!  I think I got it packaged with a motherboard once.

> > > > Milhouse

> > > > > > And I'll take my friends over some 100% anti-MS *** whining in
a
> > > > > newsgroup
> > > > > > any day.

> > > > > At least I don't steal from Microsoft! You think your friends are
> some
> > > > > modern day Robin Hood's or what?


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