rec.autos.simulators

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

John Walla

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by John Walla » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00



You shouldn't mock, it's already been done. Complete AI reworks, a
whole load of carsets, a few tracks, game editors, magazines,
rewritten manuals, blah, waffle, yadda, and  you can also keep the
loan because it's all free.

Look on Michael Carver's site, look on Jan and Jed's site, look on
Marc Nelson's site. These guys do a LOT of work which you get free of
charge but you can mock their efforts and flame the hell out of them
whenever you want? How much more have you enjoyed these sims thanks to
what this "greatest concentration of sim-racing knowledge" has brought
you.....?

Cheers!
John

John Walla

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by John Walla » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00

On Wed, 10 Dec 1997 16:24:20 -0600, David Otterness


>Thanks a WHOLE lot alison.. freaking dork.. Stupid girl posts like twice
>a year and then comes in here and makes Dean lose his patience and
>leave.. THANKS A LOT

Let's see - ignorance, sexism, chauvinism and abuse. Heck, it's lucky
Alison isn't black, you could have gone for the full house of insults.

Take a look at Alison's website and you'll see just how much of a
"stupid girl" she is. If you ever line up alongside her in either a
sim or a real car, I've got 10 bucks on Alison....

John

Byron Forbe

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


> I applaud MS for listening to the critics of the game and quickly
> working on a patch that hopes to address many of the problems that have
> been found.  However, I still think the real point here is that the game
> should never have been released in it current state.

   I also think that many see Dean's leaving as a result of 1 post in
particular and some insulting ones in general. I think it is the result
of unbearable embarrassment.
Byron Forbe

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


> But don't you think that he's put up with a lot of ***lately.. He
> acknowledges problems with the game and the patch to fix them, but he
> continued to get flamed.. I personally woulda been out of here weeks
> ago.. But Dean had the nuts to stay and try to explain things to
> people...
> --
> Dave Otterness


    Maybe MS/Tri should get the support guys battle hardened in a good
flame group before throwing them to the wolves. Especially seeing they
are into the trendy practice of puting shit on the shelves for XMAS.
--
    The All-Mighty Lord HOSHUMUNGUS

WE, are BORG. YOU, will be ASSIMILATED (if your worthy). RESISTANCE, is
FUTILE.

Byron Forbe

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


> Alison--

> You did a hell of a job in your review oF CPR...I hope Mr. Lester's
> crybaby response doesn't deter you from telling it like it is in future.

> Keep up the great work!

> Bart Brown

    I second that. Maybe all women aren't the silly sausages I thought
they were! Hehehehehehehehehe!
Byron Forbe

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


> Hi John,

> >>Here's a posting from ras just yesterday that doesn't sound consistent
> with
> >>your experience ...

> >I read that, but Dean this guy was happy running CPR on a P60! Okay,
> >everyone has their point of view, but "CPR runs on a 60 and fine on a
> >90" isn't a point of view I would point to as being representative. I
> >personally tried the CPR demo on a P225MMX with 60Mhz 3dFX and found
> >it extremely disappointing. I can't even begin to imagine it on an
> >unaccelerated P60... <shudder>

> Please read my comments again, you may have misunderstood me.

> >"I run it on a 3dfx 200mhz FF system and it runs beautifully.

> >I also run on a Pentium 60 and Pentium 90 laptops. It runs slow (but runs)
> >on a 60 and runs fine on a 90.

> >The difference can be almost compared to the way quake runs normal and then
> >the GL version.

> >Note how many followers did Quake get before the advent of 3d cards?

> I am not happy running on a 60mhz, but in my rush to install this I forgot
> that a Minimum
> machine specification existed:)  I did only say that it ran...albiet slowly.

    Well GP2 would run on a 286. So what? Running CPR in p100 mode with
+ 30fps is just not CPR. You simply cannot drive properly, especially
if, like the majority, your accustomed to 640*480. The lower res options
are simply an underhanded excuse to sell to a larger unsuspecting
audience. Pitifil in my book!
Byron Forbe

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00

-snip-

   So how's the AI, etc, etc, etc on your perfectly configured system?
And isn't the game supposed to be compatable with all D3D cards. And
isn't MS the maker of D3D? And just another question? What about the
people not on the net? What a great reason to get on the net - so that
you can DL all the patches for the shithouse software all over the
place. Fabulous!

Scott B. Huste

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Scott B. Huste » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00

Randy,

Many good points.  I would also like to point out that its most likely
not in Dean's job description and duties that he HAD to be on RAS.  I
think he was here to help people and also gain insight into what
improvements could be made to the game.  If I were Dean... I would have
told many of you to bite me long before he finally gave up.  He may have
alot of responsibilities in creating/marketing the game, etc...  but I
doubt taking ABUSE ,(not criticism), Abuse from many of you was not one
of them.

I saw a few people who were critical of the game but were polite and
provided insight into what needed to be corrected. Kudos to you. But
many of you just said this game sucks, you blow,***microsoft....
blah blah blah.  My job requires me to deal with many people regarding
their finances and money. When someone approaches me like that I simply
respond... there are only two people here that are concerned with your
situation.... and one them is losing interest quickly.  My boss loves
that approach to calm the person(s) down.  

Everyone gets disappointed and ticked about things... but to continually
abuse and attack someone who has nothing to gain but help make the
product hes working on better makes no sense and just ruins it for all
those out there who needed help from Dean and wanted to place their
input.  After all... it is just a game. (SIM.. sorry guys ;)  ).

BTW.. I do not own or have the preview of CPR. So im not for or against
the product.  Just my .02

Scott B. Husted
http://www.racesimcentral.net/~sbhusted


> >> This seems to have backfired on them, as Dean immaturely cries foul and
> takes his ball and goes home. >>

> Yeah, DEAN is the immature one here...right.

> >> Dean, are you crazy? This can only do harm to Microsoft and sales of CPR.

> Oh, that's rich. Damned if you do and damned if you don't, right?

> >> Geez, if I were your boss, I'd fire you ! >>

> Why don't you send your resume to Microsoft and enclose a copy of your usenet
> posting as a sample.  I'm sure they'll hire you so that you can fire Dean.

> >> heh.  What happened to the old adage "the customer is always right" ?

> The bad customers killed it over the last 20 years.

> >> I think you were behind the 8-ball to
> begin with since there is a lot of anti-Microsoft sentiment out there. <<

> True, but if it were as powerful as some people think, Microsoft wouldn't be as
> successful as it is.  I work for one of Microsoft's competitors and so I know
> what it is to go up against them, but there's at least some respect there as
> well.

> >> but to come up with statement can do no good at all to yourself or your
> product.

> Dean probably figures he's got nothing to lose at this point, and I don't blame
> him.

> >> but I have noticed that often times you simply do not react to negative
> comments and purely try to paint a bright picture. >>

> He's a representative of the company that makes CPR.  Painting a bright picture
> for customers is part of his job.

> >> I think people would trust you better if sometimes you could come out and
> say "yeah, you're right, CPR can't do this, perhaps we made a mistake in
> releasing it too soon" etc, >>

> Oh, yeah, that would really defuse the bashers....

> >> instead of reacting to negative comments as personal attacks. >>

> Its amazing here how the victim has become the bad guy.  Dean's put himself out
> here time and time again and patiently dealt with people who were just
> downright abusive, and the one time he finally says "enough" and leaves, two
> people jump on his case and tell him that somehow HE is at fault for all of it.

> << you would be much more effective if you at least
> recognized the customer's viewpoint/opinion, no matter what it is.>>

> He did and does.

> >> By leaving the newsgroup in this manner, you are conceding that the
> whiners/complainers are right, and you and Microsoft can't hack it >>

> By leaving the newsgroup he's doing something probably well deserved...letting
> some of the abusive folks here eat static for awhile, as we all did with
> Microprose and GP2.  Lets now all enjoy the wonderful silence brought on by the
> Usenet flamers, who have once again demonstrated why so many peoples' eyes roll
> whenever someone mentions the word "newsgroup".

> Randy
> Randy Magruder
> Staff Writer
> Digital Sportspage
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


I'm sure everyone here will agree with you on this point, but
realistically, you can't blame them. Like it or not (I don't!),
Christmas is commercialized. It's all about money...

- Mike.

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


>Btw, I want to add that I think Alison's remarks about the steering
>were dead on and I applaud the effort she put into critiquing the
>center drift problem. I hope the null-zone fix in the patch fixes
>that.  Straight-wandering is one of the worst problems in this game.

But, just remember that *not everyone is having that problem*...
I know it's not a problem on my machine and the demo... Should
anyone have it? Absolutely not. But, again, MS for all its people
and all its money, can't possibly test the program on every possible
computer configuration...

They're working on it - that's all you can ask for at this point...

- Mike.

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00

{re: CPR crashing win95}

No one said that....

That's not practical and not worth it. Think about it... do you know
what she was doing during the install? Maybe she had other
programs running in the background? Maybe she had to stop
the installation for some reason and had to restart it... Maybe
she left her comptuer for some reason, the screen saver kicked
in, and for some crazy reason, that caused the problem. My point
is, it could have been a freak coincidence of two seemingly
unrelated events happening together - stuff that would not happen
in 99.99% of all CPR installations. She said herself that after the
installation, it ran fine, and only later when she restarted did it
crash... Do you know what she did between the time she stopped
running CPR and the time she re-started her computer? Only she
does, and she did not provide all that information...

So, MS could spend months trying to duplicate the problem and
never see it (no one else has complained about it........). Instead,
they chose to spend time and energy on THE PATCH that everyone's
been crying for...

I'm not a fan of MS by any stretch of the imagination, but it seems
to me that they can't do ANYTHING right for the people here simply
because they *are* MS... If this was ICR3 by Papy, with the exact
same problems, would the attitude here be different... I think so...

I don't think so... if one detail is left out, no matter how small,
that could be the defining detail. I've already given you 2 or 3 things
that could have happened that you, I, or Microsost has no way of
knowing until she tells them...

No it's not. It's biased. She seems to have something against
MS (and I'm not saying that's wrong), but to take it out on Dean
personally is not the way to get anything accomplished. Look
at her "other opinions" section of the review - NOT ONE positive
review! It's misleading at best, but closer to dishonest in my book.

She never gave him a chance... he posted his thoughts (very
promptly, I might add) and then people just blasted the guy
with insults and *** theories and whatnot for any
technical problem they've ever had...

- Mike.

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


Or unwilling...

Right - but you have absolutely no way of knowing what his thoughts
were. You shouldn't read into things like that. (But, on the other hand,
I agree that you shouldn't write things like that which are open to
interpretation - *especially* on Usenet!) :-)

It sure does - but we have no idea what that message is, so we
shouldn't speculate...

I'm not really disagreeing with you, but what you wrote were more
like accusations than questions...

- Mike.

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


>Not the intelligent, informative debate that Alison provided.

A "debate" implies two sides... Alison's review was totally
one sided... even in the "other voices" (or whatever it was
called) section, nearly everything was negative... not one of
her "other voices" had anything good to say about CPR... I
don't think that's truthful...

I took the time to check out her site... I think she's biased to
Papy's sim, I think she's got chips on her shoulders about
Microsoft and men, and I think she's a little***y... So what?
Well, for one thing, her little joke about Microsoft (which I
do find very funny - I've seen it before and passed it on
myself) just leads me to believe her review is prejudiced...

- Mike.

PS - In keeping with the thread topic, I totally *disagree* with
those who are blaming Alison for Dean's departure... his leaving
was by choice and the result of weeks and weeks of abuse...

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

XRaceTr

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by XRaceTr » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00


>> I don't blame you for leaving for a second.
> I do. The occasional flame

"Occasional"?? have you been reading this group for the past month?

Up to a point - but day after day after day of the same complaints
can be tiring... how many times did Dean answer the SAME
questions over and over and over because people didn't read the
posts from the day before? How many times did he read the SAME
complaints over and over and over because people just like to say
"me too"?

I don't like it that he left, and I don't think it was good PR to leave,
but he is, after all, a human being like the rest of us... he isn't the
big corporate monster everyone would like to believe he is...  he
isn't personally responsible for everything Microsoft does, yet
people took all their frustrations with MS, tech support, and
the weather in Seattle out on the poor guy...

All he is a normal guy and a race fan trying to do his job and bring
a little public comment into MS to try to improve the game to make
it better for *us* while at the same time trying to promote his
project and his company... who would do less?

Sheesh...
- Mike.

====================================================
 Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
 I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
====================================================

Scott B. Huste

CART Precision Racing review by Eagle Woman

by Scott B. Huste » Fri, 12 Dec 1997 04:00:00

Good Post XRaceTrak =)

Scott B. Husted
http://www.racesimcentral.net/~sbhusted



> {re: CPR crashing win95}
> >So it didn't happen?

> No one said that....

> >>I am not saying this didnt happen but how much time do
> >>you think they need to spend addressing ONE (1) issolated
> >>problem

> >As long as it takes.

> That's not practical and not worth it. Think about it... do you know
> what she was doing during the install? Maybe she had other
> programs running in the background? Maybe she had to stop
> the installation for some reason and had to restart it... Maybe
> she left her comptuer for some reason, the screen saver kicked
> in, and for some crazy reason, that caused the problem. My point
> is, it could have been a freak coincidence of two seemingly
> unrelated events happening together - stuff that would not happen
> in 99.99% of all CPR installations. She said herself that after the
> installation, it ran fine, and only later when she restarted did it
> crash... Do you know what she did between the time she stopped
> running CPR and the time she re-started her computer? Only she
> does, and she did not provide all that information...

> So, MS could spend months trying to duplicate the problem and
> never see it (no one else has complained about it........). Instead,
> they chose to spend time and energy on THE PATCH that everyone's
> been crying for...

> I'm not a fan of MS by any stretch of the imagination, but it seems
> to me that they can't do ANYTHING right for the people here simply
> because they *are* MS... If this was ICR3 by Papy, with the exact
> same problems, would the attitude here be different... I think so...

> > She had done nearly all the research that MS would need to
> > narrow down the problem.

> I don't think so... if one detail is left out, no matter how small,
> that could be the defining detail. I've already given you 2 or 3 things
> that could have happened that you, I, or Microsost has no way of
> knowing until she tells them...

> > She has it posted on her Web site. It's nice work.

> No it's not. It's biased. She seems to have something against
> MS (and I'm not saying that's wrong), but to take it out on Dean
> personally is not the way to get anything accomplished. Look
> at her "other opinions" section of the review - NOT ONE positive
> review! It's misleading at best, but closer to dishonest in my book.

> > Dean chose to not help her.

> She never gave him a chance... he posted his thoughts (very
> promptly, I might add) and then people just blasted the guy
> with insults and *** theories and whatnot for any
> technical problem they've ever had...

> - Mike.

> ====================================================
>  Mike Holthouse - Indianapolis, IN
>  I'm sick of spam!! To e-mail me, remove the "x"...
> ====================================================


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