rec.autos.simulators

Mike

If I were to look at FF, I'd at least consider the Act Labs wheel /
shifter!

I have an MS FF usb and drive without the FORCE button pressed.

I thought it was maybe just me but when even Greger Huttu informs you he
drives GPL with his FF off,then maybe i am normal after all.

I always thought the MS FF was a good place to start though,they are cheap
enough these days.

Good luck

Morgan

www.SimBin.com
For all your setups!

So GPL support FF? I have just moved the lawn around this track in Africa
for an hour or two but I felt no force. Do I have to download something?
I have a MS FF usb on W2k.

Jone.

I started thinking about how the forces felt compared to real life (I have
turned some hot laps in some hot cars at some real tracks (aka Fast Track
Driving school)) and they are still just too phoney. Take NASCAR 4, these
real cars have power steering. Most of the 'feel' in one of these cars comes
through the ***(seat-of-the-pants) and not necessarily through the
steering column.

After I decided that it felt so phoney, and that I was fighting it too much
I gave up and went non FF all the way. Having owned 3 non FF and 1 FF wheel
at this point I decided I was tired of buying wheels that had to have to be
rebuilt every 6 months to a year (of moderate-to-heavy use) I went with a
Thomas. Seeing as how they warranty everyting in their units but the pots
(which are easy to replace and not that expensive).

I now recommend Thomas for everyone, I know they cost, but are well worth it
once you feel their action and consider all you will ever have to do to keep
it working is replace the pots on occasion. They are by far the smoothest
units 'readily' available to us here in the US. I got the TSW 2 Cup model +
Split Axis ($458 shipped) and bang my head for not buying it to start with
knowing now how much more $$ than that amount I wasted on my prior 4 wheels.
(Thrustmaster T2 (dead), LWFF (in bottom of closet), V3 (sub while waiting
for Thomas), and Thrustamster Pro Digital (used it a day, gave it to my
nephew))

If the TSW is too much $$ for ya, get a Logi Momo (and get used to the1 inch
pedal travel) and turn off FF, you should be set.

MadDAWG

You do have the v1.2 patch, right? If not, go to www.papy.com and get
it. And make sure you set the core.ini file as explained in its readme.

--
Sceptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which
deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense -- Carl Sagan

The GPL Scrapyard returns (slowly): http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com

<snip>

I have a MS FF (USB), and drive it with FF on most of the time, but GPL
is (as per usual) different. I keep the FORCE button set, but don't
enable it in GPL. THat way I get a centring force, but don't get the
spikes that tend to wreck things otherwise. Sounds a bit odd, but it's
really comfortable.

--
Sceptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which
deep insights can be winnowed from deep nonsense -- Carl Sagan

The GPL Scrapyard returns (slowly): http://www.hillclimbfan.f2s.com

www.thomas-superhweel.com

Yes, seat-of-the-pants and palm-of-the-hands are definaelty 2 different
feelings (unless you drive with your hands under your butt). The feeling one
wants in a sim is of the G-forces, since the most a NASCAR racer would feel
through the steering wheel is the bumps in the track and some resistance to
turn at higher speeds. The difference may appear in open wheel, where
something could actually hit one of your exposed front wheels and turn the
wheel in you hands.

Do you really think that $100k race cars have production power steering
pumps, that you will feel everylittle thing that affects the car? No, they
are heavy duty steering units that could probably be used on a stretched
limo. The ones I have experienced felt smooth with slight resistance to
turn. The 'feedback', as I said, is transmitted through the suspension into
the chassis where the seat is mounted.

Not looking to start an argument, but what happens in a race car at speed is
NOT felt through the hands. At high speed you really don't feel anything but
G-forces (and their effects: bottoming out), you are simply holding on
really.

Say you're driving down the road in your family sedan, does cornering
particularly fast feel like it is going to pull the wheel out of your hands?
How about if you hit a pot hole on the right side, is it going to generate
enough force to even make you strengthen your grip? No. It doesn't in a
stock car either. Like I said, the current FF is trying to account for real
forces with unreal effects IMHO.

Would you mind telling me where you saw that mod for instally a larger
diameter wheel?  

Thanks
Raymond
ACT LABS
www.act-labs.com

Well implemented and tuned FFB is both informative and
immersive. Poorly implemented or tuned FFB is both annoying
and slows you down.  I like it, but then I use an Aura Interactor
cushion so I can feel the rumble as well.

Even if a game has an excellent FFB implementation - if you
don't set latency, strength and dampening correctly you can
find yourself being thrown all over the road.  If you tune it to
"tell you things" rather than take over the car, then it's great.

IMHO a FFB wheel which is known to work well with FFB
switched off is the best option.  Then you can choose on a
per-game basis.  I've heard excellent things about the Logi
Momo, and my "original" Logitech FFB wheel has lasted 4
years and only gone through one potentiometer.

iksteh