rec.autos.simulators

I don't know all the sims I will use with a wheel (F1 and GPL for sure), but
I would hate to have to use a joystick because my FF wheel doesn't work "too
well" with a future sim.

Also, can anyone make any recommendations as to what wheel I should get?  I
was thinking about the MS wheel, but it only has a game-port interface (I
prefer serial or USB).  Gamecenter said the FF effects were lame too.
Especially for $200.

Any comment (FF or non-FF wheels) are appreciated.  I really don't want to
spend more than $150 tops.

Thanks..

    Some wheels allow you to set them to 'return to center' even in non FF
software. The MS definitely in GPL and all other sims/racers I have tried
with the exception of N2 (which no FF wheel works with as far as I am
aware) - I don't know about other wheels.

    I would not recommend the TM Force GT under any circumstances as I only
managed to live with it for approx. 1/2 hour - others may not agree but
again personal choice plays a part.

    The current version of the MS wheel only connects via a gameport but I
understand that a USB version will be out later in the year (no idea when).
I have an SBLive soundcard and the results I have with the MS wheel
connected to this are better than the Force GT was via USB.

    I would also suggest that once you have an idea from which wheels you
will eventually choose you do a power search via Dejanews on this
newsgroup - I am sure you will dig up all sorts of comments on just about
every wheel out there.

    Best of luck.

   Steve-S

+-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------+

| And quickly he's subdued          |           Split_S3 on IRC           |
| Thru constant pained disgrace     |           Steve-S on TEN            |
| The young boy learns their rules  |   Unforgiven (-unfg-) on Warbirds   |
|                      Metallica    |           Dweebs of Death           |
+-----------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
|         Dale Earnhardt            |          Dale Earnhardt Jr          |
+-------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Jerry Morelock

Pros:
    -Great customer support (Tom the driver guy is awesome!!!)
    -Good for any game (Force or non-Force)
    -Excellent Force effects (smooth and informative)
    -Looks good (Love the red!)
    -Is highly configurable (Profiles, Force strength, and Centering Force)
    -Works on serial and USB
Cons:
    -Some people can't stand the pedals, but it is very easy to replace the
springs if you don't like them
    -Costs $180 at retail stores (way less online)

I haven't tried any other wheels, so I guess that this is a biased opinion,
but my experience has been painless and highly ***ive.  I takes a couple
hours to get used to it, but after that it all seems natural.

Best wishes,
Ryan

If you really want a new wheel for sims like Viper Racing or games
like NFSIII, then you should be considering a FF wheel.  If GPL is
more your speed, then a high-quality non-FF wheel is something you
should consider.  

Consider:  The MS Sidewinder FF wheel typically sells for $199.  If
you want to use it for Force Feedback-equipped games like NFSIII and
Viper Racing, then it may be a great value at that price point.  If
you want to get the most out of games like GPL, though, it's
definitely worth the cost to spend an extra $20 to get a TSW2.  

Nothing made of plastic can compare to the TSW2 pedals -- and you have
to step up to the ECCI wheel to find anything that's really *better*
than the TSW pedals.  The price of the basic TSW2 is $220; upgrades
will drive the price up, but for $220, you can have the best wheel for
GPL short of . . . a pricier, upgraded TSW2.

I know you've said your price point is $150, but since you can't get a
MS Sidewinder wheel in that price range, that pretty much leaves the
InterAct V4 FF wheel (currently retailing for $99), the ACT Labs RS
Force wheel ($139, I believe?), or a refurbished Saitek wheel ($99,
but most people wouldn't recommend it highly for GPL because of what
many consider to be short pedal travel).  Given all this, you might be
better off overall going with a non-FF wheel (the non-FF ACT Labs RS
has gotten rave reviews, for example), or saving a bit more so you can
move beyond the $150 price range.  

If you'd like to read some of my past reviews, including the
Thrustmaster NASCAR Pro, the TSW2, the Saitek R4 Force, and the PDPI
digital game port, check out The IRL Insider Sim site:

http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/sims/

Enjoy!

-- John Bodin
   Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
   http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/

Hi Tim,

Whether it was Gamecenter or whoever, the source of the info you
mentioned above is 0 for 2.

Most (?) of the FF wheels support some type of auto centering now.
With the Logitech, I have adjustable centering force in games that
have FF implemented, and in games that don't.  This is the kicker over
a non-FF wheel for me, I love adjusting the centering force to suit my
taste. (or mood :)

Also, I would say that the MS wheel has the best FF effects of all
that I tried - which are the Logitech, MS, Saitek, and InterAct V4.  I
have never have tried the Actlabs RS wheel, but I've heard mostly good
things about it.  The MS wheel had easily the strongest FF effects of
all, plus it had some jolts in Viper Racing that I noticed I don't get
with the Logitech.  If there's anything that the MS wheel is lacking,
it's neither quality of FF nor strength of FF.

After trying all of these, the Logitech was the clear winner overall,
for me.  I am extremely pleased with this wheel, and I would recommend
it.  You should be able to get it in your price range.  There's also a
nonFF version of the Logitech that seems to be decent, although I've
never touched one.

I suggest you do a search at Dejanews for this topic in RAS, as many
others and I have posted plenty of opinions about most of the FF
wheels in the past.  --Or if you have any other specific questions,
fire away.

Also, if you happen to remember the site you referred to above, I'd
love to take a look at it.

Good luck!

Brett
And for you automated email spammers out there,
here's the email addresses of the current board of
the Federal Communications Commission:

And let's help you send some spam to the USPS, too:

btw. Best pedals I've tested are Microsoft FF wheels pedals with moving
range of 5.5cm
TM F1RW(also known as Nascar Pro) has for example 2.4cm(brake) and
3.6cm(throttle) and
not even close as good as MS FF pedals.

Does anyone know if it is possible to buy MS pedals separately without the
wheel?
or can they be combined? TM wheel with MS pedals?

What costs the cheapest TSW _with_ split axis?(all others are next to
useless...
I know that cheapest models don't have split axis...)

Incidentally, isn't it about time we had FF pedals too. I'd like to be able
to feel my brakes.

M

The gameport is kind of lame, thouygh it's not as much of a problem
with digital-optical devices like Microsoft's (i.e., they have no
stutter anyway). But the USB connection on the Logitech is nice, and
it's a very high quality wheel overall (the best wheel I've owned
actually).

Joe