Well David.....that little effort just about sums up how much importance
anyone reading your posts should place on their value, doesn't it?
You obviously subscribe to the belief that, when all else fails and things
aren't going your way, resort to childish, foul-mouthed abuse.
You can take your bat and ball and go home now.
--
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)
I *WORK* in the so-called "Information Age", David!
Every "Age" has an "Information Age".
The invention of the telegraph was going to be the end of letter-writing.
The invention of the telephone was going to kill Morse code and
letter-writing. The invention of Wireless was going to kill newspapers,
letter-writing and Morse code. The invention of Television was going to
kill wireless (radio), Morse code, newspapers and movies. The invention of
Facsimile transmission was going to kill Morse code and letter-writing.
The introduction of the Computer as a PC was going to kill television,
movie-going, faxes, radio, Morse code, family life as we knew it,
letter-writing and produce a "paperless office". The introduction of the
Internet was going to kill telephone conversations, faxes, letter-writing,
Morse code, newspapers, book-reading, reference-libraries, encyclopedias,
television, the "office", movies, video tapes and civilised life as we knew
it.
Amazing how all these things that were to be killed off down the years are
still with us!
(snip)
:it proves your opinions
(unsnip)
I'm glad you finally agree with me!
--
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)
> Tadaaaaaaa! Are you starting to get *reasonable*??
"Feels" not everything and it doesnt change my mind to play more often
because
one has to sacrifice ALL graphics to get that "feel". Im very happy with
the "feel"
of Papy's sims and I dont have to sacrifice ALL detail and I certainly
dont have to play it
in VGA(UGH!)
features like, Multi player and
Features, Utilities, whatever. The "box" advertised Multi-player. It
didnt give
it.(false advertising) Ive also read that in many cases they advertised
"wet weather", didnt give it.
(false advertising) Whats this hotlap crap? Must we load each replay
individualy to study our line
and technique? No update?! Unacceptable. Can you blame them,..yes.
Tadaaaaaaa! Are you starting to get *reasonable*??(grin)
take care,
-DG-
David Gary wrote>
I dont get as much "feel" from Papy games as i get from GP2.
GP2 is the best ever Racing Sim.
I think papy's graphics look dead, and dry.. But the sim is still good.
I prefer GP2 it is the best.
And what kind of a computer do you have if you must remove all the
graphics in SVGA??
The game does not look bad in vga either, it is much more diffuse but
you can still play it.
multiplayer does not mean that you MUST be in a Network.
2 player is Multiplayer, so it is not false advertising.
If Geoff Crammond left Microprose it is a reason why there is no Patch.
Crammond got all the copy rights to the code, so Microprose can do
nothing.
Frode Dufey
What I like about that statement is that you could say the same thing
for just about any newsgroup. It's the "big fish, little pond"
attitude of some readers and contributors that irritates me the most.
Other than that, even though we represent a microcosm among internet
users interested in reading and posting in r.a.s., there is a lot of
good information from the 0.000001% that frequent this newsgroup and I
for one am thankful for the information I receive (even if I have to
sift or filter through the "crap" posts).
I really don't think my perception of r.a.s. and my role within it or
any newsgroup will lead to world peace, but at least it will help when
I have a problem or resolution with my favorite racing sims! And
that is the best kind of microcosm...one that moves at 200mph!
Kyle Stevens
Robert....
I've been visiting this NG ever since I discovered it.
I would not even attempt to place a ratio on those posts (all....not just
related to GP2) that praise versus those that complain about a racing
sim/game.
However, I will say that those that flame FAR exceed those that praise!
Why? Because human nature being what it is, we are more likely to complain
about something than we are to praise something.
Example: You buy a VCR. It works well, was good value for money in your
opinion and does what it was designed to do. Do you write a letter to the
manufacturer praising the product? Do you contact your Consumer Affairs
Dept. and tell them what a good product this is? Do you take out space in
the media to tell everyone about the excellence of this VCR? Most likely
not.
But let's say that when you bought that VCR you expected it to include a
half-speed recording feature, or a LCD display instead of green lights, or
a child-proof cover over the tape slot, and you considered that you had
bought something that wasn't exactly what YOU expected, would you complain?
Sure you would, because although the VCR did its prime job.....recording
and playback.....YOU expected more.
---
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)
>> >awesome "sim". It has the best "feel" and graphics around.
>> Tadaaaaaaa! Are you starting to get *reasonable*??
>Ive said this in the past, its nothing new. I give credit where credit
>is due.
>A least someone does.
The proof? In a reply to S. Kota, you write:
"If you dont have a p200 or faster, dont think about running GP2 in SVGA with
any graphics on."
I don't understand you, Gary. Some of your complaints are right, but you
undermine your own credibility with this nonsense.
.....
Just compare "full detail" Indycar with "25% detail" GP2. I'm sure there's not
much difference.
The "feel", however.... After driving jumping-bumping GP2 for a while, Indycar
feels more like skating to be honest. Perhaps you should try a little more.
It does. You can alternate. Hardly what you would expect, but that's
advertising...
Only in the very beginning, if I'm right. There's nothing about wet weather on
my box.
The box claims just that. You should have read it. It is not a "bug", it's a
design choice.
I will...
JoH
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
When everything else failed, we can still become im-
mortal by making an enormous blunder....
John Kenneth Galbraith
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Jeez! Let me try again!
They may not have been a minority IN THIS NG but they WERE/ARE a minority
when it comes to the TOTAL SALES of the game.
--
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)
Anyone using statistics to predict or describe anything is a fool.
Statistics can be manipulated to say anything you want them to say,
usually its just a matter of asking the *right* questions and
*interpreting* the statistical answers.
d:~)
**Peter**
...
[statements that make more sense than the complete works of David Gary]
...
Even GP2! ;-D
JoH
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
When everything else failed, we can still become im-
mortal by making an enormous blunder....
John Kenneth Galbraith
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
: And what kind of a computer do you have if you must remove all the
: graphics in SVGA??
: The game does not look bad in vga either, it is much more diffuse but
: you can still play it.
:
This conversation has really gone on for a Looooooong time. Most of the
time nothing was really be said (just egos shadow boxing -- but that's
my opinion). However, we are now once again talking meat and potatoes.
I have a P5-166 (and I don't think I will have the bread to update any
time soon). In order for me to get a "usuable" frame rate I do need to
turn off most of the graphics. By usuable I mean that if I am in
traffic, I need the CPU occupancy to be at or under 100%. But then we
have a probelm. The last time 10 laps around the track, there wasn't
that much "traffic" so the occupancy is way below 100% and it is being
fairly consistant. Now racing (especially F1) is a rhythm thing. It
also involves precise steering, braking and throttle control. Now I am
in heavy traffic (hopefully passing backmarkers and chasing the
leaders), and the occupancy shoots up way over 100%. Well, you can say
goodbye to rhythm. You can forget the precise steering, braking and
throttle control. Of course rhythm is changed due to traffic, but the
rhythm of where to start your turn and braking, etc. has really been
changed by the elongation of time. This aspect of GP2 is by far my
biggest gripe with it. While it may look real, it doesn't react real.
You also say that one can still "play it" in VGA. Yeh, one can, but one
can't "simulate" on-the-edge racing. The good pilots are not racing the
few yards in front of them. They are driving the exit of the corner
before they ever start their braking for the entrance. I can't do that
in VGA. But, maybe that's my problem and not a problem with coding of
the simulation.
I bought a simulation not a game. I want to simulate racing a F1 car.
: multiplayer does not mean that you MUST be in a Network.
: 2 player is Multiplayer, so it is not false advertising.
And at what frame rate does one play multiplayer? What is the
peformance hit? Everything I mentioned above is only "multiplied" in
multiplayer. Maybe it was a typo on the box and advertising for this
sim. Yeh, that's the ticket, it was supposed to say "multiplier" not
"multiplayer".
: If Geoff Crammond left Microprose it is a reason why there is no Patch.
: Crammond got all the copy rights to the code, so Microprose can do
: nothing.
Fine, I don't care who is at fault. The program was not complete when it
was released, someone has to take ownership of this fact. It is either
Microprose or Geoff Crammond (it certainly isn't mine).
BTW: I love the realistic ability of the pit crew to totally rebuild my
car in the same amout of time it takes to fuel it and put on fresh
***! For a sim that "pretends" to simulate everything else (down to
minute peformance changes by changing a damper), that's a joke. No
excuse me, that's a bug! Speaking of bugs, the lousy effeciency of the
graphics is a bug also. Just because the code doesn't crash, just
because the code functions as written, does not mean it is not a bug. A
bug is a flaw in the code, and the graphics routine in GP2 is a flaw.
Sorry, this thread is contagious. It must contain some new viral
fungus-virus! ;-) Let's put it in quarantine!
--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./. [- < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
No, *we* are fools for listening to anything political leaders say and
believing them!!!
Especially if it is something based on statistics.
You show me someone who has acquired *true facts* and I'll show you
someone who is very good at manipulating figures.
By the way, you can say acquire the truth, or acquire facts, but acquire
true facts? bad grammar old boy as true and fact means the same thing?
A bit older than my teeth, but not quite as old as my hair and nails?
Old enough to know that anyone who has any integrity will base statements
on fact, and not on interpreted figures. (IMO politicians do NOT usually
have much integrity)
Definition of Statistics = " The collection, classification, and
INTERPRETATION of data"
Therefore, you may choose to interpret statistics any way you see fit,
that does not make them fact or truth.
**Peter**
0.1% of all people know that! :)
John
"There will be a rain-dance on friday, weather permitting."
-- George Carlin
DG,
For a guy that doesn't play GP2 that often you sure have a lot to say
about it. I find it all pretty amusing. But you really are being unfair to
those who might like the sim but decided not to try it because of your
statements. Come on, this isn't V-Karts or Whiplash. I too am upset with
Microprose and will not be giving them my hard earned money in the future.
But that does not change the sim GP2 is, as it stands.
The adverts inflate the game. MPS sloppily left remnants of an unfinished
program all over the box, the manuel, and in the menu screens. The
graphics are too hard to come by with consumer machines. MPS has negative
customer relations. ...Plus all the other complaints.
If I drove ICR2 and N2 while all this time refusing to drive GP2 because
of what I have read here, and then stumbled upon it at a friends house I
would be mighty upset with this group. We need to differentiate between
slowing MPS's tyranny and informing others like ourselves as to the
pleasure factor in the game. A lot of people slash the game because of
their experience with MPS. That is unfair only to those who might enjoy
it. Even more put the game down because of graphic performance. Sorry, I
for one, don't buy a driving sim for the graphics.
It is my opinion that GP2 is the most accurate driving sim, physically,
available at this time. I can't even play my other sims any more. They are
no fun for me. They feel like arcade games.
I can tell anyone who wishes to try GP2 that it only steps above the
others when the frame rate is above 16 while Occupancy is below 100% and
you are using no "F" keys and no SH or OL. It is quite stupid of MPS to
release a game with such massive self restrictions but, now that you know
that, you can make an intelligent choice. On most machines this mean low
graphics. I race at tracks that look like my dog drew them. But it feels
great!
I would never have written this if not for your attempt to frighten me
from it:
horribly unacceptable framerate. It's impossible even on a p200. If you
argue that fact you undermine your own credibility with that nonsense.<<<
Ummm... I have a wonderful time on my 486. Can't wait for the P though.
==========================
"You don't have to drink to have fun. But why take chances?"
(Chris Miller)
mark
Team sound chaser http://users.aol.com/wordwrap/chaser/chaser.htm
Papyrus is finished with Indycar racing. They WON'T(at this time)
be building another Indycar sim. The current focus is on Nascar, OLD
Formula One and an off road truck sim. The schism between the two
factions of Indycar racing and the inablility to license tracks like
Indianapolis have apparently squashed any fervor Papyrus had for
American Open Wheel racing.
Dave Henrie
Not Today! ThankYOU Pepsi Club.
