rec.autos.simulators

by **Ken Lee** » Fri, 09 May 1997 04:00:00

> Gentlemen:
> I own a business and the first thing I have to remember in
business
> is that advertising is the key, as well as repeat business. All we
have
> to do is boycott the company MICROPROSE and use as much negative word
of
> mouth advertising and information passing to each and every person we
talk
> to, and believe me in time MICROPROSE will start to feel the pinch.
No
> company is too good to blatantly lie to the buying public about the
> requirements to make a product work properly and it not deliver and
then
> do absolutely nothing about it and THEN expect to snowball the public
into
> thinking it has the best simulation on the market
> It isn't by a long shot when it will not do what was promised.
Truth
> in advertising laws are there to protect the consumers and the buying
> public from such behavior by a manufacturer. Perhaps if some
inventive
> attorney decided to legally put some heat on these clowns and make
them
> SHOW us that the game will perform as promised on the "required"
computer
> setup on the outside of the box, with no tweaks or internal
"gamesmanship"
> by their people, but get an off the shelf computer with the
information
> panel's settings and build requirements, and run it as we as consumers
> would.
> At that point, perhaps whiz-kid Geoff could at that point finish
what
> he started and do his job as expected by the buying public, get off
his
> lazy a** and come out with a patch that makes the thing work as THEY
> promised it would in the first place.
> Negative publicity holds a very strong place in the eyes of the
> comsumers anymore. I will not buy another MICROPROSE

product-------ever!

- Show quoted text -

On the other hand, has anyone made a better product?
No, it appears not.

Do we still play GP2, in spite of its faults?
Yes, the majority of us do.

If, and I know it's a big if, GP3 came along and was, like GP2, the best
F1 sim available, would it sell?
You bet it would.

Do you think Microprose and Geoff Crammond really care to listen to a
tiny bunch of whiners and moaners in an insignificantly small group like
this? Or do they listen to the accountants who tell them that the game
is still selling in its thousands and making big profits?

Is it time to realise that all the complaining on this newsgroup is a
complete waste of time?

The post by L T Memory on this subject is refreshing in that it isn't
offensive and doesn't abuse anyone. There are a number of people who
could learn something here! It's the nature of this NG that you are free
to say exactly what you think, but to fill this NG with abuse hurled at
the likes of Mark Rich, Geoff Crammond and Microprose is hardly the way
to be taken seriously, however valid the argument. I can't be the only
one who skips to the next post when the same repetitive, unconstructive
nonsense appears.

Ken

by **David Gar** » Fri, 09 May 1997 04:00:00

> Anyone using statistics to predict or describe anything is a fool.

Every important political leader of every country is a fool then.
Not to mention almost every self made millioniare who has made his money
from investments. I think we know who the fool is.

So this statement justifies not using statistics to aquire true facts?
How old are you Peter?

-DG-

by **Jn1414** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

I have to remember in business > is that advertising is the key, as well
as repeat business. All we have > to do is boycott the company
MICROPROSE and use as much negative word of > mouth advertising and
information passing to each and every person we talk > to, and believe me
in time MICROPROSE will start to feel the pinch. No > company is too
good to blatantly lie to the buying public about the > requirements to
make a product work properly and it not deliver and then > do absolutely
nothing about it and THEN expect to snowball the public into > thinking
it has the best simulation on the market > It isn't by a long shot
when it will not do what was promised. Truth > in advertising laws are
there to protect the consumers and the buying > public from such behavior
by a manufacturer. Perhaps if some inventive > attorney decided to
legally put some heat on these clowns and make them > SHOW us that the
game will perform as promised on the "required" computer > setup on the
outside of the box, with no tweaks or internal "gamesmanship" > by their
people, but get an off the shelf computer with the information > panel's
settings and build requirements, and run it as we as consumers > would. >
At that point, perhaps whiz-kid Geoff could at that point finish what
promised it would in the first place. > Negative publicity holds a
very strong place in the eyes of the > comsumers anymore. I will not buy
another MICROPROSE product-------ever! > I am disappointed that such a
thing can happen and then the representative > literally writes a
commentary in this newsgroup that you have to do this > and do that and
compromise here and give a little bit there. NO DICE pal > ----- I
didn't buy this game to listen to some two-bit public relations > man
ramble about how great a defective product is. If I want that I will >
go to your REAL EQUIVALENT -- and go to a USED CAR LOT ---- at least
when > you buy one of those the secnery and the mirrors and everything
else HAS > all the details and with much better quality than your product
----AND > -------- you can buy extended service policies that will REPAIR
DEFECTIVE > ASPECTS OF THE PRODUCT I JUST BOUGHT!!!!!!!!!!! > If
MICROPROSE is too busy spending money on the next generation of a >
simulator to fix the present one , then let the BAS***DS eat the next >
generation of the simulation ----- when layoffs and reduced revenue
start > showing up on their doorstep then maybe they will have learned the
most > important lesson of business that they don't seem to grasp at this
time > ------ the most important customer is the one who ALREADY OWNS
YOUR > PRODUCT--- and is happy with it!!!!! >

On the other hand, has anyone made a better product? No, it appears not.

Do we still play GP2, in spite of its faults? Yes, the majority of us do.

If, and I know it's a big if, GP3 came along and was, like GP2, the best
F1 sim available, would it sell? You bet it would.

Do you think Microprose and Geoff Crammond really care to listen to a
tiny bunch of whiners and moaners in an insignificantly small group like
this? Or do they listen to the accountants who tell them that the game is
still selling in its thousands and making big profits?

Is it time to realise that all the complaining on this newsgroup is a
complete waste of time?

The post by L T Memory on this subject is refreshing in that it isn't
offensive and doesn't abuse anyone. There are a number of people who
could learn something here! It's the nature of this NG that you are free
to say exactly what you think, but to fill this NG with abuse hurled at
the likes of Mark Rich, Geoff Crammond and Microprose is hardly the way
to be taken seriously, however valid the argument. I can't be the only
one who skips to the next post when the same repetitive, unconstructive
nonsense appears.

Ken

<

It is exactly the sentiment expressed here that helps keep big business
companies who care nothing about their customers (Micropose and $ierra
come to mind) in business. The internet has grown tremendously the last
couple of years and quite a few people (myself included) will not purchase
a software product based upon a corrupt *** company's propaganda, but
rather the opinions of those who have purchased the product and know the
facts. Thankfully this view of yours becomes much less of a factor every
day as more people get on the internet and information becomes more
accessable to the masses. I look forward to the day when the big money
game companies have to come groveling back to the people who put the food
on their table and make things right or find themselves on the street
pennyless.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------

Jason Nichols

Commissioner

SportSim Football League

http://www.racesimcentral.net/

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

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>Thankfully this view of yours becomes much less of a factor every
>day as more people get on the internet and information becomes more
>accessable to the masses.

(Sigh!) I've said it here before and I'll say it again.
As a retailer of computer entertainment software, our experience over the
past 4 years has shown the following (approximate) statistics from our
customer database:
1. Less than 8% of all customers are "dedicated" racing simulation
addicts.
2. Less than half of ALL CUSTOMERS (50%) subscribe to an ISP.
3. Of those that use the Internet, the majority have never visited a
newsgroup.
4. Of those that use the news facility, less than 10% subscribe to any
particular group.

Therefore, if you seriously think that a major business is going to place
serious consideration on what generalised criticisms are posted in RAS (by
that I mean generalisations such as "GP2 is a load of crap!" or "Why didn't
we get what we paid for?!") then you are living in dreamland.

---
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)

Jn141414 <jn141...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970509011400.VAA18...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...

> >Subject: Re: EXCELLENT questions for Microprose.... From: Ken Lees
> <Ken.L...@BTInternet.com> Date: Thu, 08 May 1997 21:30:30 +0100
> Message-ID: <VA.000000b9.010fc...@k.lees>

> LT Memory wrote: > Gentlemen: > I own a business and the first
thing
> I have to remember in business > is that advertising is the key, as well
> as repeat business. All we have > to do is boycott the company
> MICROPROSE and use as much negative word of > mouth advertising and
> information passing to each and every person we talk > to, and believe
me
> in time MICROPROSE will start to feel the pinch. No > company is too
> good to blatantly lie to the buying public about the > requirements to
> make a product work properly and it not deliver and then > do absolutely
> nothing about it and THEN expect to snowball the public into > thinking
> it has the best simulation on the market > It isn't by a long shot
> when it will not do what was promised. Truth > in advertising laws are
> there to protect the consumers and the buying > public from such behavior
> by a manufacturer. Perhaps if some inventive > attorney decided to
> legally put some heat on these clowns and make them > SHOW us that the
> game will perform as promised on the "required" computer > setup on the
> outside of the box, with no tweaks or internal "gamesmanship" > by their
> people, but get an off the shelf computer with the information > panel's
> settings and build requirements, and run it as we as consumers > would. >
> At that point, perhaps whiz-kid Geoff could at that point finish
what
> > he started and do his job as expected by the buying public, get off
his
> > lazy a** and come out with a patch that makes the thing work as THEY >
> promised it would in the first place. > Negative publicity holds a
> very strong place in the eyes of the > comsumers anymore. I will not buy
> another MICROPROSE product-------ever! > I am disappointed that such a
> thing can happen and then the representative > literally writes a
> commentary in this newsgroup that you have to do this > and do that and
> compromise here and give a little bit there. NO DICE pal > ----- I
> didn't buy this game to listen to some two-bit public relations > man
> ramble about how great a defective product is. If I want that I will >
> go to your REAL EQUIVALENT -- and go to a USED CAR LOT ---- at least
> when > you buy one of those the secnery and the mirrors and everything
> else HAS > all the details and with much better quality than your
product
> ----AND > -------- you can buy extended service policies that will REPAIR
> DEFECTIVE > ASPECTS OF THE PRODUCT I JUST BOUGHT!!!!!!!!!!! > If
> MICROPROSE is too busy spending money on the next generation of a >
> simulator to fix the present one , then let the BAS***DS eat the next >
> generation of the simulation ----- when layoffs and reduced revenue
> start > showing up on their doorstep then maybe they will have learned
the
> most > important lesson of business that they don't seem to grasp at
this
> time > ------ the most important customer is the one who ALREADY OWNS
> YOUR > PRODUCT--- and is happy with it!!!!! >

> On the other hand, has anyone made a better product? No, it appears not.

> Do we still play GP2, in spite of its faults? Yes, the majority of us do.

> If, and I know it's a big if, GP3 came along and was, like GP2, the best
> F1 sim available, would it sell? You bet it would.

> Do you think Microprose and Geoff Crammond really care to listen to a
> tiny bunch of whiners and moaners in an insignificantly small group like
> this? Or do they listen to the accountants who tell them that the game
is
> still selling in its thousands and making big profits?

> Is it time to realise that all the complaining on this newsgroup is a
> complete waste of time?

> The post by L T Memory on this subject is refreshing in that it isn't
> offensive and doesn't abuse anyone. There are a number of people who
> could learn something here! It's the nature of this NG that you are free
> to say exactly what you think, but to fill this NG with abuse hurled at
> the likes of Mark Rich, Geoff Crammond and Microprose is hardly the way
> to be taken seriously, however valid the argument. I can't be the only
> one who skips to the next post when the same repetitive, unconstructive
> nonsense appears.

> Ken

> <

> It is exactly the sentiment expressed here that helps keep big business
> companies who care nothing about their customers (Micropose and $ierra
> come to mind) in business. The internet has grown tremendously the last
> couple of years and quite a few people (myself included) will not
purchase
> a software product based upon a corrupt gaming company's propaganda, but
> rather the opinions of those who have purchased the product and know the
> facts. Thankfully this view of yours becomes much less of a factor every
> day as more people get on the internet and information becomes more
> accessable to the masses. I look forward to the day when the big money
> game companies have to come groveling back to the people who put the food
> on their table and make things right or find themselves on the street
> pennyless.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

> -----------------------

> Jason Nichols

> Commissioner

> SportSim Football League

> http://members.aol.com/jn141414/ssfl.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

> ------------------------

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<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">>Thankfully this view of =
yours becomes much less of a factor every >day as more people get =
on the internet and information becomes more >accessable to the =
masses.   (Sigh!) I've said it here =
before and I'll say it again. As a retailer of computer entertainment software, our =
experience over the past 4 years has shown the following (approximate) =
statistics from our customer database: 1.  Less than 8% of all =
customers are "dedicated" racing simulation addicts. 2. =
 Less than half of ALL CUSTOMERS (50%) subscribe to an ISP. 3. =
 Of those that use the Internet, the majority have never visited a =
newsgroup. 4.  Of those that use the news facility, less than =
10% subscribe to any particular group. Therefore, if you =
seriously think that a major business is going to place serious =
consideration on what generalised criticisms are posted in RAS (by that =
I mean generalisations such as "GP2 is a load of crap!" or =
"Why didn't we get what we paid for?!") then you are living in =
dreamland. --- Bruce. "But that was then....and this =
is now!" (Guess who!) Jn141414 <jn141...@aol.com> =
wrote in article <19970509011400.VAA18...@ladder01.news.aol.com<fo=
nt color=3D"#000000">>... > >Subject: Re: EXCELLENT =
questions for Microprose.... From: Ken Lees > <Ken.L...@BTInternet.com> Date: Thu, 08 May 1997 21:30:30 +0100 > =
Message-ID: <VA.000000b9.010fc...@k.lees> > > LT Memory wrote:  > =
Gentlemen: >      I own a business and the =
first thing > I have to remember in  business > is that =
advertising is the key, as well > as repeat business.  All we =
 have > to do is boycott the company > MICROPROSE and use =
as much negative word  of > mouth advertising and > =
information passing to each and every person we  talk > to, and =
believe me > in time MICROPROSE will start to feel the pinch. =
  No > company is too > good to blatantly lie to the =
buying public about the > requirements to > make a product work =
properly and it not deliver and  then > do absolutely > =
nothing about it and THEN expect to snowball the public  into > =
thinking > it has the best simulation on the market > = ...

read more »

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

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Then in that case your morals are as rock-bottom as (supposedly) those
about whom you are whining.
--
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)

writes:

> >If, and I know it's a big if, GP3 came along and was, like GP2, the best
> >F1 sim available, would it sell?
> >You bet it would.

> Of course it will sell and as always, it will include bugs in it and
> there will once again be a growing number of people that will be
> dissapointed.

> I personally, as stated before, will not spend money on GP3. I will
> play it, but Microprose will not get a cent from me.

> >Do you think Microprose and Geoff Crammond really care to listen to a
> >tiny bunch of whiners and moaners in an insignificantly small group like
> >this? Or do they listen to the accountants who tell them that the game
> >is still selling in its thousands and making big profits?

> A company not listening to complaints - abusive or not - from its
> customers will be in trouble sooner or later.

> >Is it time to realise that all the complaining on this newsgroup is a
> >complete waste of time?

> So we should all kiss their ass in awe that they take the time to
> produce software for all of us?

> I'm sorry, but their products have problems, some minor, some not
> so minor and quite frankly their attitude to not even bother fixing
> them is bad, bad customer service. And because of that, I'm sorry, I
> will continue complaining wherever I can.

> I don't see complaining about their products in this newsgroup
> a waste of time, it's a fact that their repsentatives read the
> newsgroups. Now, to get them to *do* something, that's something
> else.

> >Ken

> -TPP

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<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">>I personally, as stated =
before, will not spend money on GP3. I will >play it, but =
Microprose will not get a cent from me. Then in that case your morals are as rock-bottom =
as (supposedly) those about whom you are whining. -- =
 Bruce. "But that was then....and this is =
now!" (Guess who!) Tero =

color=3D"#000000">> wrote in article <>... > In <> Ken Lees <> >F1 sim =
available, would it sell? > >You bet it would. > > =
Of course it will sell and as always, it will include bugs in it =
and > there will once again be a growing number of people that =
will be > dissapointed. > > I personally, as stated =
before, will not spend money on GP3. I will > play it, but =
Microprose will not get a cent from me. > > >Do you =
think Microprose and Geoff Crammond really care to listen to a > =
>tiny bunch of whiners and moaners in an insignificantly small group =
like > >this? Or do they listen to the accountants who tell =
them that the game > >is still selling in its thousands and =
making big profits? > > A company not listening to =
complaints - abusive or not - from its > customers will be in =
trouble sooner or later. > > >Is it time to realise that =
all the complaining on this newsgroup is a > >complete waste =
of time? > > So we should all kiss their ass in awe that =
they take the time to > produce software for all of us? > =
 > I'm sorry, but their products have problems, some minor, some =
not > so minor and quite frankly their attitude to not even bother =
fixing > them is bad, bad customer service. And because of that, =
I'm sorry, I > will continue complaining wherever I can. > =
 > I don't see complaining about their products in this =
newsgroup > a waste of time, it's a fact that their repsentatives =
read the > newsgroups. Now, to get them to *do* something, that's =
something > else. > > >Ken > > =
				-TPP > 
</f=
ont></body></html>
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by **David Gar** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

> Gentlemen:
> I own a business and the first thing I have to remember in business
> is that advertising is the key, as well as repeat business. All we have
> to do is boycott the company MICROPROSE and use as much negative word of
> mouth advertising and information passing to each and every person we talk
> to, and believe me in time MICROPROSE will start to feel the pinch. ....

Very well put L.T.
Some of these guys dont realise how important "word of mouth" is. Its
been
around ever since "language" was created and DOES have an impact on
one's
knowledge, skill, or product. So when something as vast as the internet
comes around in our day of technology, this "word of mouth" gets around
very quickly and by many. Before I make a buying decision I will pop
into
the net to find out what people are saying about the product and its led
me to make some very wise buying decisions. It also has saved me from
making some very bad ones. When people defend the companies that donot
seem to care about the quality of their products after they are sold
then
these guys are only being a scar in 'competent Quality's' back. IMO,
they are
also embarrasing themselves and usually go on the top of my "moron"
list.

The bottom line is: The internet is a way of communicating to ensure
quality,
integrity and prosperity. It will streamline the future of quality.

Microprose better wake up and change their ideas about quality.

I for one will be sure to feel free to grab GP3 off of some warez site
because I will consider it an "update."

Think about how you handle your customers Microprose. I didnt think
'ole Mark Rich would show back up in here. Little man went back into
hiding.
I'm not suprised, he represents Microprose.

-David Gary-

by **David Gar** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

Evidently GP2 is the only sim sitting on your desktop.

Speak for yourself only please. Just because one still plays the game
doesnt
mean hes happy with it. I try to eat healthy, but Im not happy with it.

Not to me and not as many copies as GP2. Speak up for quality man, not
excuses!

I could care less if Geoff Crammond is listening or not. I want the
people who
are thinking about buying his future so-called "masterpieces" to listen
up and
know what to expect.

Your opinion and not a very intelligent one at that.

I will agree with you here. However a little sarcasm doesnt hurt since
being
to much of a "nice guy" is sometimes boring.

The blind man can't see the rock being thrown at him until
it hits him square between the eyes and then he sees...red.

-David Gary-

by **David Gar** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

> I will consider GP3 to be the bug patch that never came.

> If you take that as immoral, then so be it.

Ill be sure to leave you that warez site.

-DG-

by **Tero Paanan** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

Please, do not post in HTML.

I will consider GP3 to be the bug patch that never came.

If you take that as immoral, then so be it.

How very nice of you, btw, to pick up the easiest and most obvious
snippets of my article to "counter"-whine about.

-TPP

by **ga..** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

Hi Bruce,

Those statistics are probably valid though I disagree with your
conclusion for these reasons.
That 8% seems to be enough to warrant a software company making
software for profit. Hardly a small number.
Surveys and polls are conducted every day all over the world using
a tiny fraction of the populace. Every day someone somewhere is
reported that ,"Most..(insert countrymen) feel that, use this,think
that...based on surveys using perhaps 1500 people. I think this
group qualifies as an ongoing barometer to some degree.
Though we all find generalized criticisms a bit unedifying I
doubt whether the manufacturers of Tide, for instance, require any
one to give a chemical breakdown of their product in order to lodge
a complaint that it doesn't work as advertised.
It may be hopeless to complain here but the complaints don't
bother me too much. I'm more annoyed at those complain about the
complainers, they're way more numerous and even less edifying.

Take Care,
Greg
Gavel

by **David Gar** » Sat, 10 May 1997 04:00:00

> Then why do you have to spoil it in another message in this group by spreading
> downright...lies (can't find another word for it, sorry)

Your acclaim for GP2 is fogging your vision to see where I'm comin'
from.
Everything I have stated about GP2 has been agreed to be true by some of
these guys
that have been involved with simulated racing for some time. Please list
"these
downright lies". My distaste for this slug of a sim is my opinion. I
will continue
to discourage anyone that plans on purchasing this sim. I will _not_ lie
to them
however. I just state the facts. You have no ground to stand on with
such an absurd comment.
If you want to debate about the differences between the pros and cons of
this sim, fine.
But please do not try to discredit my integrity to plainly state the
controversial problems
this sim was distributed with.

The problem here is that I should have been more clear. Which I believe
I was and
this is just a "clip" from context, but maybe I should have put it "in
other words".
For instance. Dont plan on "racing" in GP2 with any detail on and hope
to withstain
any "realistic" framerate, even on a p200. You can practice with another
car, but with
more than one car in front of you, adding detail will drastically throw
the CPU occupancy
to an unrealistic framerate.(maybe for the exception of one little
goodie like fences or
curbs) Now in VGA its a different story and yes you can run GP2 fine
with full detail in
VGA on a p200. The bottom line is: No sim that is being produced these
days is expected
to run in VGA. For such a "masterpiece" as GP2 _not_ to run in SVGA "in
a race" with
even half of the details on with he fastest hardware to date is an
insult to the market.

Now maybe you can see what I meant and have been meaning for the past
couple of months.

Inflated heresay!

In a actual "race" there is. Its impossible to even come close to the
awesome framerate
you get in ICR2 during an actual race with ALL details on AND plenty
cars if front.
Not to mention the awesome anti-aliasing features an incredible detail
rendition
gives you. Jo, maybe you should actually go out and purchase ICR2 and
play it sometime.
The way you stand up for GP2 might lead someone to assume that you have
never even played ICR2.

Ive spent countless hours with GP2. Most of them were just trying to get
a "decent"
framerate. I have agreed that the dynamics are "realistic", but if you
CANT actually
participate in a race then what the hell is the sim good for. Like I
said. The only
reason I have GP2 still on my HD is just to "practice" and learn the
courses for
the next generation of F1 sims. Its unfortunate that GP2 has to be the
only poster child
for Formula 1 racing when it comes to simulate its real life counter
parts. You
simply cannot "realistically" participate in a race without a horribly
unacceptable
framerate. Its impossible even on a p200. If you argue that fact you
undermine your own
credibility with that nonsense.

Your insulting my intellegence. You lose my respect when you stand up
for companies
that try to "pull the wool" over their customers eyes with unacceptable
advertising strategies.

Begining, end, irrelevant. ALL excuses. It was advertised period.

I didnt state that it was a "bug" just a nusance in using a feature that
other sims offer
to be very useful.

The bottom line is: Simulations where designed to do just that,
S-I-M-U-L-A-T-E.
GP2 was advertised as a Formula1 racing simulator. If it cant
effectively simulate
F1 racing on the fastest hardware possible then it subject to criticism
and IMO
should not be sold to someone as advertised. I know that the drivers
"practice"
on the F1 curcuit, but dont they still R-A-C-E?!! Evidently someone
didnt tell
Geoff Crammond and I'm the one thats paying for it. You are too, you
just dont
realize it!

Take care,

-David Gary-

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sun, 11 May 1997 04:00:00

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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(1). There was nothing else in your post that I considered to be
significant.
(2). That wasn't a "whine", it was an observation.
--
Bruce.
"But that was then....and this is now!"
(Guess who!)

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<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF">>How very nice of you, btw, =
to pick up the easiest and most obvious >snippets of my article to =
"counter"-whine about. (1).  There was nothing =
else in your post that I considered to be significant. (2). =
 That wasn't a "whine", it was an observation. -- Bruce. "But that was =
then....and this is now!" (Guess who!) 
</body></html>
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by **David Gar** » Sun, 11 May 1997 04:00:00

You dont have to say it again just because people disagree with you.

Do you work for a goverment statistics agency or a "one in a thousand"
software retailer?
If the latter, then sure your not going to get the whole picture.

X's every other software retailer(not to mention the thousands and
their customers that arent ***s but still want to know opinions
before
making a buying decision).

User access on the internet has tripled in under a two year peroid,
not to mention the people that only use E-mail and have access to ngs.

Where do you get your information? your imagination? -;>0

You dont have to "subscribe" to a particular ng to read its content. I
also
think it would be safe to say more people read than reply.

I must argue whos "living" in dreamland here. I will trust goverment
statistics,
before I will trust what some guy that works at a software retailer
scanning
the company's database states.

You seem to justify your position as a professional anyalist of Internet
statistics.

The bottom line is: the expansion of the internet is increasing at a
ungodly rate and
will continue to do so given the statistic that only 2 out of 10 people
are on line
as of now. Thats a fact.

With this in mind, large software companies are very aware of "word of
mouth"
and if their marketing dept. has done their homework, they know that
even a small
percentage of criticism can hurt their bussiness substantially. If one
person
likes a product after purchase he will most likely only tell 3 or 4
people about.
If he feels he has been "shafted", "scammed" or "ripped" off, then he
will tell
10 or 11 people about it.

I think we both know that finding this ng via news server is unlikely.
There are much easier
ways to find out the information posted to this ng.

People DO listen up to what people are saying about one's product or
services. Especially
the ones that are smart enough to do so before forking over 50 bucks to
something
they have not seen until it is loaded on their HD.

Bruce, please get the facts before you post your information. If not
people will judge
your intellegence and take your information with a grain of salt.

I have.

Take care =8>]

-DG-

If you must know how I derived at my facts goto:
http://www.racesimcentral.net/#INTERNATIONAL

by **Rccraze1** » Mon, 12 May 1997 04:00:00

I don't care what people in this NG say, GP2 is THE best racing sim. I
admit that it is not finish, but it is still the best. I will buy any
racing sim that MICROPROSE comes up with in the future no matter what.

Steven

by **Tero Paanan** » Mon, 12 May 1997 04:00:00

It is the best Formula One racing *sim*, because it's the only one.

Papyrus' racing sims are IMHO better, a shame they haven't produced
a Formula One racing sim (yet).

-TPP

rec.autos.simulators

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???

Who is running GP2 in SVGA full details at 25 fps ???