rec.autos.simulators

Although racing GPL for a number of years now (mostly F2's), I still
find that I'm lagging significantly behind the laptimes of others.  So,
I thought that it's about time that I make some significant
improvements.

I've tried the well-known adage of brake first, then enter the curve
slowly and squeeze the throttle out of the corner, and that's resulted
in some improvement.  However, when I enter a curve too hot, I
invariably either a) drift too much to the outside and leave the track,
or b) the back comes around and I spin.  My question is how to handle
these 2 situations in terms of pedal control (assuming that the car
set-up is pretty balanced).

When you find yourself drifting too far to the outside what's the best
technique to use in getting back on the racing line under control?  Of
course time will be lost, but I'm talking about staying on the track
pointed in the right direction.

Maybe it's my set-ups, but I find that when I turn into a curve too
early or sharply, the back of the car drifts out and I can't recover.  I
turn into the drift (ie - if the back end drifts out to the left, I turn
the wheel to the left) and sometimes catch it, but then I invariably
overdo it and the back end snaps out of control the other way.  Should I
apply more brake or more throttle when this happens?  Any help on how to
handle this situation would be greatly appreciated.

Once I get responses to these questions, is there a particular track or
skidpad to best practice the correct technique?  Remember, I race mostly
the F2, so grip is even less than normal, which necessitates the use of
correct technique even more.

If it matters, I use the Logi MOMO Force Wheel (the red one), and TSW
peds, under Windows XP.  Any thoughts/help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Bert

At a GPL rank of +50 I'm definitely not the right guy to be handing out
advice on this one, but that never stops me.  ;o)  If you are drifting out
too wide, try turning in later and taking a later apex.  From a purely
geometrical standpoint that should allow you to make it, plus that will
allow you to brake just a bit later.  Me, I just take the chickenshit
approach and feather the throttle.

If you do lose the rear I think the best way to catch it is to straighten
the wheel and maintain moderate, steady throttle pressure.  You can also add
a simultaneous light touch to the brake if you are a left foot braker.  But
don't take your foot off the throttle, that just makes it worse.  Now I am
speaking from real life experience.  :o(

I think the best GPL track for practicing four wheel drift is Silverstone,
although Zandvoort can be kind of fun too.

I guess you mean that you want to be able to recover from errors as quickly
as possible & get back into the race? I do this quite alot ;-)

I tend to find that if I'm really pushing hard (probably too hard) to catch
up to someone in front, I'll brake later & often trail-brake a little. If I
get the car out of shape (easily done under those circumstances) I'll
usually add a little throttle & continue to brake as normal. What I mean by
braking as normal is that your instinct is to squeeze the brake pedal harder
& harder as you head towards the grass, and I find it very hard to over-ride
that natural instinct. By adding a little throttle I am ensuring that the
rear wheels won't lock up, so the car will at least be pointing the right
way even though I may be going too fast to make the turn.

The next part is pretty hard to do & it all happens very quickly. It'll come
with practice though. You lift off the brake gently at the same time as
lifting the throttle. Keep a little gas on though (or dip the clutch) so
that you are neither accelerating or backing off, and use as little steering
lock as possible to point the car where you want it to go. You may be on the
grass at this point, and big control movements will just unsettle the car.

Use the steering to help the car begin to turn in the direction you want,
but use very light brake pressure to put a little more weight on the front
wheels, and as the car starts to turn, use the throttle to balance the rear
& prevent it from sliding wide.

You can do this on the track surface through Monza T1 to avoid the barrier,
at Nurby to ease the car back onto the track without losing too much speed
if you run wide, or even during a 130mph jaunt across the grass at
Silverstone if you go off at Abbey ;-)

This is pretty close to what you would do in a real car, but in gpl's case
there is (arguably) a flaw in the physics model that you can take advantage
of too, which is chronic understeer (push). If you can feel the back end
coming round and you can't recover with opposite lock & balancing the
throttle, lock up the fronts with the brakes (add gas if you need to stop
the rears from locking up) and the car will straighten itself out.
Alternatively stay off the brakes & apply loads of positive lock (steer away
from the skid) and the front tyres will skid 'faster' than the already
sliding rears, again straightening the car out. The brake thing works in
real life although it's very risky (better than crashing though ;-)) but the
positive lock thing is really a quirk of papy sims imo.

hth, Malc.

Don't brake, countersteer (often more than you'd think you need at
first, and then *anticipate* that the car is going to swing back, and
straighten the wheel again), while holding the gas about steady, or very
gradually back off. Practice this for a while in, let's say Rouen or
Zandvoort, and do it on purpose to hone your responses.
Also, make sure it's not because you're getting off the gas that you're
drifting wide - in Rouen's T1 for example I find that I have to floor it
mid-corner to kick the rear out a bit and avoid understeer.

Still, this is very general advice though. Entering a corner too hot is
probably the biggest problem of (race) car driving anyway. You can do a
lot with a car, but generally, for the average driver, the end result
usually is  "too fast = you're out". After all, there's only so much
grip a tyre can give you, and there's only so much road.

So as far as I'm concerned, the solution is more like 'how not to enter
the corner too fast or on the wrong line in the first place'   ;)
and maybe concentrate more on making yet faster exits.

Practice in different cars and with different setups may help here - as
usual in GPL, practice makes less imperfect.

Personally, what helped me here is A) using another car - the Eagle (and
Cooper) are easier to handle in this department than the Lotus or
Ferrari and B) keep looking for setups that handle easier while not
sacrificing speed (by using too much understeer, for example). I use
Peter Jensen's (www.geocities.com/pj_corner/setup.htm), which are pretty
stable and made quite some difference.

Regards, Rudy
(GPLRank -4.8)

On Mon, 18 Aug 2003 19:09:31 -0400, BRH

All good advice, guys, but don't neglect this: add silicon! No, not to
adhance your figure. If you are not getting a solid 36 framerate, your
ability to hang on to slides is compromised. A fast machine and a fast
vidcard makes a BIG difference! You need a high polling rate to
maximize control. I only mention this because many people gloss over
this. Cheers,
SPS

A worthy point, although I haven't had that problem with gpl in three years
;-)
No need to spend money, just lose a little eye candy ;-)

Malc.