rec.autos.simulators

by **Tony** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 05:11:36

> I watched a couple of Solstice races (I think) which really got my juices
> running. My main problem with most of them though is that I burst out
> laughing whenever I see that Legends car. I guess it must mean something
> historically to those in the USA, but I can't imagine how anyone ever
> thought that was a good shape for a racing car! I'd feel embarrassed
> sitting inside one, even online in front of complete strangers. :-)

The Legends are a hoot to drive but like you I don't feel like I am in a
real car!

If you are into road racing and you want to trial iRacing you really
need to buy the Skippy so make that $35. The Skip Barber is excellent
and will make you just want to go and drive it GPL demo style IMHO.

iRacing is a very good simulator - the best in my view, however it
doesn't make everything else redundant. There are some great historic
racing sims/mods which the lack of fidelity compared to iracing actually
works well jumping from one to the other. For sheer brutal performance
iRacing doesn't provide a top end car yet.

Arrive & drive (pick up in olden day terms) racing is very good,
although scheduled weekly racing with a defined registered group of
drivers is better provided in Race2Play or a league.

For the sim racing *** it is a must have along with the likes of
GTR2, Race07 & rFactor for its quality online racing on tap and training
capability of the quality modelled cars & tracks.

For the casual sim racer it may not seem such good value, only you can
judge that.

The only thing I would stress is that driving teh Solstice alone does
not do it justice.

Cheers
Tony

by **Tony** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 05:28:49

> The thing that bothers me is that though I'm paying a monthly fee, I cannot
> just start my own server, invite some friends, and race the car and track
> that I want to, without ratings and contact rules. I think that if they
> added this to the options, they'd get thousands of more subscribers.

One of the key features of iRacing is organising drivers together on
track so drivers can turn up and race any time. This won't be a major
appeal to those used to organising their own events, but for getting
more people in to sim racing without needing to get invited into a
league or commit to a schedule iRacing would seem to have a formula for
attracting subscribers which fragmenting drivers across many leagues
would work against.

I actually think iRacing is a more complementary product than I first
expected. It sits nicely on my HD alongside the historic mods for GTR2 &
rFactor.

Cheers
Tony

by **Jan Verschuere** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 08:39:38

"Andrew MacPherson"...

Sit tight, McP, I've got some vacation coming up in two weeks and I'm gonna
spend the $20 to see what Franky was raving about...

Jan.
=---

by **Andrew MacPhers** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 14:44:00

> The only thing I would stress is that driving the
> Solstice alone does not do it justice.

Which is part of my frustration with the project. In order to have a
decent drive, the first thing I'd need to do is fork out some more money
over and above the basic package. Whether that's fair or not is neither
here nor there... iRacing is a commercial product after all, and who am I
to tell them how to run their business? But this kind of approach just
rubs me up the wrong way, making me less likely to take a chance.

In time I may mellow though. The trouble with strongly held viewpoints is
they require effort to maintain, and I don't have all the energy I used
to. :-)

Andrew McP

by **David Fisher's Left Testicl** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:21:51

>> Ok, so this invitation lands in my inbox. Now I've already said I dislike
>> the pricing model of iRacing intensely, and that I really object to
>> having to drive vehicles I have zero interest in, then pay -- when I'm
>> allowed -- to add decent vehicles & tracks.

>> So can someone explain to me why I've spent the last hour reading about
>> iRacing and watching youtube clips? Would it hurt to spend $20 and put a
>> toe in the water? Ok it'd be to drive a vehicle that looks & drives like
>> a tank, around tracks I've never driven before. And chances are I'd never
>> even go online with it... just do some offline circuits -- GPL demo style
>> -- to see what all the fuss is about.

>> My head says don't be stupid... you know you'll never enjoy paying out
>> regularly for a racing game when you already have 101 other distractions
>> in life. You'll never get your money's worth... and you were always a
>> lousy driver anyway. The best that can happen is that you get ***ed
>> and spend the next few months watching your penalty points clock up,
>> dooming you to drive in an eternal limbo of newbie races while others
>> zoom up the rankings and witter on about how they were once in a race
>> with someone who got out of the way for a Real Race Driver(TM).
>> It's just not a product aimed at enthusiastic, but fundamentally
>> untalented racers like you! Stick to rFactor when you need a racing fix,
>> or LFS when you want to contribute to never-ending product development,
>> or GTR2 when you want to listen to amazing engine noises.

>> But my heart whispers 'GPL2', and it's very hypnotic. I think I'd better
>> delete that invite quickly!

>> Andrew McP... methinks he doth protest too much

> I tried it for a month. But come renew time I don't think I'm going to
> continue with it. I don't like the cost and everything is too "high-brow"
> for me. There's too much of things like, "I got touched by another guy
> now my rating is going to suffer!" And things are a bit too structured
> for my tastes. If I'm going to spend so much a month, why is it that I
> can't get some of my buds together, get on a server, and race without
> ratings and all the rest of the stuff they have?

> I'm paying a monthly fee but I'm being led about as if I were a dog on a
> leash.

> Boo-hoo.

> I'll take rFactor, LFS, GTR2, etc., and race without having to pay a fee,
> and leave all the elitists to do their own thing.

Nice snide swipe at the iRacing community there.

You must be poor if you think 20 bucks is a lot. Or just a tight arse.

by **Guy de Montmorency-Lava** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 18:49:34

You can buy rFactor boxed version for twenty bucks at WalMart. Boxed
version requires no activation.

by **Larr** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:56:08

Don't forget, when you subscribe you get iRacing $$$ to spend. If you sign

Or a car or two and a track or two. I think tracks are $15 to $25.

I don't think monthly gets you much in the way of iRacing $$$ though, so
after the first month it's best to either do it or not and go for the year.
It's only $13 a month for full year plus you get the $60 in iRacing $$$.

Typically you should have raced your way OUT of the Solstice and Legends
cars by then, and ready to spend your $60 iRacing dollars on the cars for
the next level.

There is a method to the madness :)

-Larry

>> The only thing I would stress is that driving the
>> Solstice alone does not do it justice.

> Which is part of my frustration with the project. In order to have a
> decent drive, the first thing I'd need to do is fork out some more money
> over and above the basic package. Whether that's fair or not is neither
> here nor there... iRacing is a commercial product after all, and who am I
> to tell them how to run their business? But this kind of approach just
> rubs me up the wrong way, making me less likely to take a chance.

> In time I may mellow though. The trouble with strongly held viewpoints is
> they require effort to maintain, and I don't have all the energy I used
> to. :-)

> Andrew McP

by **Larr** » Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:57:02

Missed my point. You still can't sell it for much later on.

-Larry

>> If you pay $20 for say rFactor, then try to sell it, someone might
>> take it off your hands for $2. And we won't get into the copy
>> protection/online activation issues that would crop up.

> You can buy rFactor boxed version for twenty bucks at WalMart. Boxed
> version requires no activation.

by **btgos** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 03:49:25

> I think that would be a brilliant step forward eventually. However I do
> think, on reflection, that where we're going wrong is not taking iRacing
> seriously enough. It is not -- as we've been told countless times before
> -- intended for the casual *** market... and that includes most of us
> these days, no matter how much we might like to think we're still
> *** future champions. :-)

> Andrew McP

I agree with you 100%. I share your view that they are taking this
very seriously. Unfortunately, I think that is why it may ultimately
have to become more of a stand alone product, or fail. I don't think

month to support further development.

by **Guy de Montmorency-Lava** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 04:09:52

Why would I want to? I have both Trymedia and boxed version (came with
TrackIR) of rFactor and have no intention to sell either.

by **hoove** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 04:20:44

> Missed my point. You still can't sell it for much later on.

But I can n0t haz a box on my shelf added to my collection of sim
titles (lolcat speak intended ;-), re-install it three years down the
road when the mood strikes me, all that. Not possible with iR in its
current state (ok, I got the "thank you" stickers for the beta test,
but well, would you stick them on a 10 year old Ford Mondeo hatchback?
;-)

I don't consider this an investment like owning n2k3 turned out to be,
but I'm just "licensing stuff" which will be taken away from me the
minute my subscription runs out. Granted it's there when I choose to
sign up again, but somehow that's just not the same as having a nice
DVD case to look at and to dust off every once in a while.

Uwe

--

by **Tony** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 07:28:02

> I don't consider this an investment like owning n2k3 turned out to be,
> but I'm just "licensing stuff" which will be taken away from me the
> minute my subscription runs out. Granted it's there when I choose to
> sign up again, but somehow that's just not the same as having a nice
> DVD case to look at and to dust off every once in a while.

I guess like album covers will become a thing of the past...

On the investment side I think the opposite, NR2003 didn't have the
ongoing development that iRacing will have. Once the boxed product hits
the shelf who knows what project the developers will work on next and
what deal will be struck with publishers. iRacing feels like getting on
board with the developers and a long term relationship building between
sim racers and a development team. I guess only time will tell.

Cheers
Tony

by **0-0-0-0-** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 08:12:12

> Don't forget, when you subscribe you get iRacing $$$ to spend. If you

> each). Or a car or two and a track or two. I think tracks are $15 to $25.

> I don't think monthly gets you much in the way of iRacing $$$ though, so
> after the first month it's best to either do it or not and go for the
> year. It's only $13 a month for full year plus you get the $60 in iRacing
> $$$.

> Typically you should have raced your way OUT of the Solstice and Legends
> cars by then, and ready to spend your $60 iRacing dollars on the cars for
> the next level.

> There is a method to the madness :)

> -Larry

Yes there is a method to the madness..... it's called trying to turn a
profit.

--

by **0-0-0-0-** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 08:22:38

Someone should also mention that if iRacing ISN'T there anymore......
your stuff aint there anymore either!

It's like a speculation investment ;)

>> Missed my point. You still can't sell it for much later on.

> But I can n0t haz a box on my shelf added to my collection of sim
> titles (lolcat speak intended ;-), re-install it three years down the
> road when the mood strikes me, all that. Not possible with iR in its
> current state (ok, I got the "thank you" stickers for the beta test,
> but well, would you stick them on a 10 year old Ford Mondeo hatchback?
> ;-)

> I don't consider this an investment like owning n2k3 turned out to be,
> but I'm just "licensing stuff" which will be taken away from me the
> minute my subscription runs out. Granted it's there when I choose to
> sign up again, but somehow that's just not the same as having a nice
> DVD case to look at and to dust off every once in a while.

> Uwe

> --

by **Andrew MacPhers** » Sun, 13 Jul 2008 13:57:00

> Yes there is a method to the madness..... it's called
> trying to turn a profit.

To be fair that's hardly a crime. Without profit there's no product. The
hard part for them is finding a balance which will draw in enough people
to make the product work for he long term, not just a year or two while
the top end enthusiasts are eager to support the current price structure.

I'm fairly sure they will eventually have to work out a two-tier system
which allows cheaper, mass access to open servers. Then you can build up
a big pool from which drivers can be inspired to pay more to join the
serious racers.

At this stage though that won't be important to iRacing, because they'll
still be living off the development capital.

Andrew McP

rec.autos.simulators

iRacing... help... must... resist!

iRacing... help... must... resist!

iRacing... help... must... resist!

iRacing... help... must... resist!

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iRacing... help... must... resist!

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iRacing... help... must... resist!

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iRacing... help... must... resist!

iRacing... help... must... resist!