rec.autos.simulators

Just one piece of information out of many, but worth a brief look for those
about to decide.

www.gamersdepot.com/hardware/video_cards/ati_vs_nvidia/dx9_desktop/00...

I've been wanting to get a new card, but to be honest my current PNY Ti4400
works so damned well that it's hard to justify it.  My main game is NR2003,
and I have no frame-rate problems at all.

If I did get a newer card it would be so I can turn on all the card-based
goodies (FSAA, Anistropic, etc...) and stay at around the same frame
rates/resolution (I run 1280X1024 on my 22" display).

Right now, I'd have to go with a 9800 AIW, but I'm watching the ATI driver
situation very, very carefully before I decide.

-Larry

From the article posted:

" If you're still "stuck in the past" and think that ATI is plagued with
driver issues, than go ahead and keep your head stuck in the sand like an
ostrich, buy a 5900 Ultra and then start crying when your pals are smoking
your ass in games like Half Life 2 and Halo because they're running ATI
hardware. "

Mike
http://mikebeauchamp.com

www.gamersdepot.com/hardware/video_cards/ati_vs_nvidia/dx9_desktop/00...

I did the same thing by getting a 9700 Pro recently and am very glad I
did.
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I completely disagree.  IMO, ATI has had much better drivers than nvidia
since the Radeon 8500 when they switched to the catalyst program however
nvidia, like they've always done, feeds bs to all who want to listen and
have trained nvidiots to believe whatever they say.  Review sites over the
past year have only begun to resist their practice of strong arm tactics.
Remember how nvidia downplayed the whole 3dfx FSAA abilities?  Remember how
nvidia reacted to the new 3dmark timedemos?  Remember how it was ok once
they started cheating?  Like the article says, keep your head buried in the
sand all you want and keep trying to defend your nvidia purchasing decisions
because it provides great comedy to the rest of us!

-Tim

I'm not sure I'd go quite that far, but I do agree that it's somewhat
amusing that people talk about ATI's drivers as being worse than
nVidia's, and while nVidia certainly has improved a lot in this regard,
for one who used to run 3Dfx cards it was quite entertaining in selfish
sort of way to read about the people doing the driver hop to get <insert
fav game title here> running on their particular system

However, it's no GPL

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"

http://www.theuspits.com

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--

I could be wrong, but you sound like a (former) 3DFX owner that got very
annoyed when nVidia smoked them. ;-)

all.

    Ok, let's make it "since the 9700".  But that was a year ago, and Nvidia
has spent all the time since then committing consumer fraud over the entire
FX line with their cheating and lying, while ATI has been performing like
gangbusters.  There is currently no compelling reason to buy Nvidia cards,
and won't be until NV40, and I expect R420 will upstage that as well.

rms

Please expand upon this if you have the time since I still have time to
cancel my FX5900 ultra order (building a new AMD 2800+ rig) and go with a
9800 pro (or non-pro for the best value).

I'm looking to run mainly sims (flight/racing), sports (Madden 2004, NHL
2004) and a few "hot" shooters (Half-life 2).  Why would ATI be the better
choice?

TIA.

--
Joe M.

ATI should perform quite a bit better in HL2 based on the recent
discussions of DX9 performance. Madden and NHL don't exactly push
systems to their limits.
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Don't know if this is the one Roger is talking about

http://tech-report.com/etc/2003q2/3dmurk03/index.x?pg=1

There was an earlier one as well, which was talked down afterwards by
both nVidia and 3DMark

Personally I happen to think both cards are plenty fast enough and would
have based my next purchase on image quality rather than raw speed,
assuming both had somewhat similar performance, and most reputable sites
these days give ATI the nod here

As for my personal POV it's useless since I'll never buy an nVidia card
again as long as there's a reasonable alternative :-)  

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"

http://www.theuspits.com

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--

I like ATI's 3d-image quality better. Speed-wise the two top contenders
shouldn't be too far apart, sometimes the 5900 Ultra winning, and sometimes
the ATI 9800 Pro.

But for all I know a new card from ATI is imminent within the next 3 weeks,
so maybe you should wait for that car to be released? Apologies if I'm
mistaken about this.

Achim

...

This one has a good overview of Nvidia's company policy of cheating and
lying during the whole of 2003:
http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NTAz
Hardocp has always backed Nvidia, and the fact that even they have had
enough indicates the level of disgust in the industry that has built up over
this company's actions.

Looking ahead to newer games, there are many reports now that the FX series
of cards performs extremely badly in DX9 pixel shaders, which are heavily
used in the new Tombraider game, as well as HL2 and Doom3.  The only
solution for Nvidia seems to be in lowering image quality to compensate.
There are several threads on
http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=14
discussing this, including one from John Carmack.

rms

You are correct.  Case in point: Madden 2004 doesn't have "shiny helmets"
and based on the screen shots it looks terrible compared to an nvidia card
(should be patched soon but still a problem for those playing now).  I keep
fence hopping on my video card purchase and I'm now on the nvidia side of
the fence because I too play across too many genre to risk incompatibility
(Madden looks too good for me to lose graphical quality with an "upgrade").

--
Joe M.

And here's another...

http://www.techreport.com/etc/2003q3/valve/index.x?pg=1

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"

http://www.theuspits.com

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--