rec.autos.simulators

Hello,

I've recently built myself a system based around an ASUS A7V133 (1.05),
Athlon C 1.2GHz, Voodoo5 5500 PCI, ELSA MicroLink 56k PCI, 256Mb PC133,
Maxtor 40Gb ATA100, Fujitsu 10Gb ATA33, CD R/RW 2x2x24 and 300W PSU. The CD
ROM runs of the IDE controller, while the two HDD's run from the Promise
controller. The software installed in Windows 98SE, VIA 4-in-1 4.25 (INF
driver 1.02 and GART only (for when I tried my old AGP TNT card)), Promise
driver (from supplied CD), audio driver (ditto), USB patch for K7 (ditto),
Saitek R4 Force Wheel driver, DirectX 8.0a, Voodoo5 5500 1.04 drivers. GPL
was patched to 1.2 and had the disconnect fix applied.

Generally, the system seems to run fine, but in GPL I get blue screens
fairly randomly but regularly. Somtimes I can do a race or to (online or
offline) before it fails, while other times it fails before even qualifying
is over. The error I get is "Exception 0E at 0028:C000A4B0 in VXD VMM(01) +
000094B0".

I've tried my ald AGP TNT card in DirectX mode and it fails too. More to the
point, it doesn't seem to matter which graphics card I use (TNT in D3D mode
or V5500 in 3Dfx or D3D mode), the error I get is always identical (even the
address and offset!). I would conclude from this that it isn't a graphics
card problem - do you agree? I've tried running in software rendering mode,
and that seems reliable, though I need to use it more to be sure.

I have a suspicion that it may be the motherboard that is at fault, as it
was sealed with a piece of ordinary sticky tape and so may have been
returned before already.

I have tried many things, from different RAM modules, graphics cards, BIOS
settings, 4-in-1 driver versions (4.25 and 4.28), reinstalled DirextX 8.0a,
reinstalled drivers, and a whole lot of other things, but now I'm really
stuck.

Please, can anyone help me? In particular, if anyone has a similar system,
could you please tell me what all your BIOS settings are and what drivers
you have installed?

Thanks,

Andrew.

  first off, there is a much newer  4in1 driver set available for your
motherboard.  you have 4.25  i think they are up to 4.31 or 4.32.  Give
those a try first.   From my experience, Blue screens usually are the fault
of one program misbehaving.  Recently I have reformatted and re-installed
windows several times on two different drives.  If I try and run some
programs that were installed while windows was on my d:\ drive...they will
bsod often.  if i go backwards and reinstall those programs so they are
properly written into the registry to match which drive I have windows on,
they seem to run fine.
  Try shutting down as many background tasks as possible, perhaps one of
those is conflicting with GPL.
Your 1.04 drivers for your V5 should be ok...check the date on them,
Febuary 2000 is a good target to shoot for.(has it been a year & a half
since the V5 debut'd??)
voodoosource.com might have newer drivers for your card.  Good luck..GPL
usually is a pretty stable program.  hope you get it figured out.
dave henrie

I wouldn't say that it's not a graphics card, despite the fact that
you get the same problem with both cards. Is the system stable for
other programs? Windows, internet, other 3d games?

It may be caused by conflicting interrupts, as the AGP port shares
it's irq with one of the pci slots. You mentioned an internal pci
modem - any other cards? Sound is onboard?

Try removing all pci cards, or at least swapping slots, so that
different irq's are used, see if that has any effect.

If it only occurs in 3d mode, then I'd suggest that it almost
certainly is video card related, but not the actual card itself. Maybe
the mobo or the AGP port.

See how you go and report back!

Rafe Mc

On Sun, 01 Jul 2001 15:29:42 GMT, "Andrew Hollom"

Another thought is that it may be bad RAM sector, or that the slot is
no good. That may be why you can race for only a few minutes. or a
couple of races. If you can get hold of some old RAM, or at least
change the slots, that will at least rule out the possibility.

Rafe Mc

Thanks for the reply Rafe. I'm using the onboard AC97 audio, so there's no
sound card as such, though it does still count as a PCI device. The only
other cards are the modem (PCI) and V5500 (PCI). There is no AGP card fitted
normally, though I tried my old AGP TNT card just to see if it was the V5500
that was the problem. I've tried the system without the modem, but it still
fails. I've also tried moving the V5500 around, but still no luck.

The problem does only seem to be 3D related, as Windows has not had a single
problem (yet!). I have this sneeking feeling that it is the motherboard or
CPU, but probably the former.

I have since found that it also fails in Nascar 4 too, again with exactly
the same error at exactly the same address and offset. I'm going to try a
friends CPU tomorrow to check that out, but please keep the replies coming.

Andrew.

Andrew...

I had an ASUS A7v133.....finally had to get rid of it.  Its a totally
"buggy" board (so is their P3V4x as well).  ASUS is pretty famous for
putting ***product on the market...and never fixing it.  There were some
"workarounds" for your issue (I had it too....but don't remember
them....this has been about six months ago).  From what you wrote in your
original post...it sounds like you've covered most of the bases with
checking for bad RAM modules, etc.  The only small thing I can add to try is
try activating the "Memory Hole at...." in your BIOS (its probably set to
"disable"....set it to "enable" and test run GPL).  By the way, what is your
3DMark2000 scores with this box?  (Don't bother with 3DMark2001.....it
virtually won't run on your system.)  3DMark2000 is not only a very good 3D
*** box, benchmarking program....it will stress the hell out of your
*** rig and bring all those little problems to the surface.  I use it
even to burn in CPU's when I plan on overclocking them....it works great for
this purpose (it was this fact that finally sent the A7V to the trash bin).

As a general issue.....you've spent a fair amount of money to build a very
fast *** platform.....AGP4x, lots of RAM (doesn't that mobo take PC2100
RAM, though???  maybe not) and so forth.  Why then, put a 3D card into that
system that can't really use any of it?  The V5 does not use the AGP port at
all....its essentially a PCI card (operationally).  You've invested good
money....why not a little more for an GF2-ULTRA....and your system will
S.C.R.E.A.M.  As it is now...its just a "fast Volkswagen"....you know?  Go
"hog all out" and put in a GF3 (especially if you play other PC
***....FPS stuff in particular)?

Wish I could have been more helpful.....

Regards,

Tom

Tom,

Thanks for your reply, but I cannot see the memory hole option in the BIOS.
My old FIC VA-503+ had the option, and a friends ABIT KT7 has it, but I
can't see it on this damned ASUS A7V133!!!! Is it called something else?

By the way, I understand what you're saying about the V5500 (which IS a PCI
card!), but I use GPL a lot, and I find that it performs the best of all
cards for this game, though my only comparision is an almost identical
system I built for my father that uses an AGP Radeon VIVO 64Mb. I'm sure one
day I'll change it though!

Thanks,

Andrew.

Sorry Tom.. have to totally disagree with you about ASUS products and their
reputation.   They are some of the most stable motherboards on the market
and have a reputation as such.

I currently have a CUSL2 that I have been using for almost a year and it is
as solid as they come.  I helped a friend build two P3-866 on P3V4X systems
with the AGP GART driver 3.59 which worked perfectly fine.  We upgraded to
the 4.02 released back in May and gained a marginal speed increase, but
still remained as solid as can be.   Both systems run great and have not
crashed on any Sandra or 3dmark 2001 test runs with GeForce 2 Ultra 64mb
cards.

Now of course there are better boards now available to do the job, since the
P3V4X has been around for awhile....    the only motherboards I will build a
system on are ASUS.

--
Scott B. Husted
ICQ# 4395450
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Sorry Scott, I'm agreeing with Tom on this one, Asus seem to have a
"hit and miss" thing with mobos. My bro's a7v is quite buggy,
sometimes it'll be fine, but one slight change and it'll be stuffed.
Maybe it's just the a7v series, because I've quite a few complaints
about them. Their irq sharing is very dodgy too, it leaves 3 free,
them jams everything else onto 2 or 3 others.

But I've also heard many ppl who are very happy with them, so I think
their quality control is letting too many bad boards slip through the
net.

Rafe Mc

On Mon, 2 Jul 2001 18:39:08 -0400, "Scott B. Husted"

Well at least that rules out the AGP issues, and irq issues. When you
borrow that cpu, borrow his RAM as well and test that. I think you may
simply have a dud mobo, unfortunately. I had a new Abit board not that
long ago, seemed to crash for no reason every so often. I replaced it
with an Iwill board, not one crash since!

Another thing to look at may be your power supply. Those V5's chew a
LOT of power, so maybe there's an intermittent problem there. What
resolution do you run? Obviously the higher res settings will chew
more power and stress the system more.

The same address and offset could mean memory problems, so definitely
test out your friend's RAM.

HTH
Rafe Mc

On Mon, 02 Jul 2001 18:29:25 GMT, "Andrew Hollom"

Hmm, I don't agree with this at all, maybe I'm biased cos I've got an
ASUS A7V also, but mine works fine! (with GPL and every other
game/sim/program I've ever thrown at it).

And one of the reasons I built my system (Yes, I build my own systems)
based on an Asus A7V, was because they were getting very good reviews
(at Toms Hardware & AnandTech's websites) and have a very good
reputation for reliability and their ability to be overclocked and be
tweaked.

I think the problem this guy is having is probably a set-up or driver
issue. The hardware should work fine. (I personally would never have a
m/b with onboard sound or graphics though).

8-)

*Peter* -  http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

Scott....

A year ago......I would have agreed with you as well, I was a solid ASUS
customer then as well.  But in the last 6 months....ASUS has changed....or
should I say, "they have failed to keep product reliability in line with
their historic reputation."

Both mobo's you refer to in your post represent "last generation" hardware.
The current gen hardware from ASUS is buggy...and even includes the
occasional "design flaw"....exemplified by the A7V133 being built as a
"overclocking" mobo....but they put a resister so close to the CPU bay that
you can not get anything but a "stock" fan/cooler to fit on the AMD chip!
That's clearly a design flaw....and resulted in some 40% of those boards
being returned the first week they were released.  ASUS...did not stand
behind them...would not allow them to be returned.  They have since
recanted.....but they did try to get away with it.....didn't they?

Further, your CUSL2 mobo has IRQ assignment problems up the ass....check the
boards!  You are probably just "lucky" yours works.

On the P3V4X you "helped a friend with"......I guess "help" is a relative
term?   If you are using the "AGP GART" driver...that's a generic AGP driver
and its no wonder you aren't having problems...you're likely running the
mobo in 1xAGP un-accelerated mode!  None of us would have problems if we
were doing the same!  That mobo has a VIA Apollo Pro133A chipset on it (VIA
northbridge chipset) and requires the VIA "4in1" drivers in order to
activate the AGP acceleration functions of the board.  Perhaps you are
mistaken about this GART driver?

Regarding your comments on "benchmarks" running with no
problems/crashes.....Hmmmm?  The SiSoft Sandra utility does not have a
benchmark for video 3D acceleration....so what are you benchmarking?  And,
3DMark2001 is designed and created to benchmark only systems with an Nvidia
GF3 video card.......that's not what you have is it?  You should be using
3DMark2000 for benchmarking your friends computer...its a complete useless
waste of time to run 3DMark2001 on a non-GF3 system.

Scott....you can "talk the talk"....but you can not "walk the walk".....and
that's the same reason you and I had a falling out....business wise, nearly
two years ago!  Since then you have taken "shots" at me every time you get a
chance.....particularly over the Tim McArthur issue...and I know for a fact
you had no "facts" about that issue whatsoever!  This post you made above is
just another example of "taking shots" at me.  I can not believe you are
stupid enough to have actually helped a friend build two computer systems
with the wrong drivers installed for the mobo.  No, more likely....you just
decided to "*** off" some fancy talk and look like you knew what you were
talking about.....and hoping the average non-tech, "unsuspecting" r.a.s.
reader would think you were right....and I was wrong!  ***Scott....you are
too talented of a person to waste your time doing this junk!  When you
started your new website business....I encouraged you....even though it
meant you would become in direct competition with me.  When that venture
failed....I never once took the opportunity to say "I told you so."  Did I?
No......I never had anything to say publicly about you except positive
things.  I'd liked it if over the last two years you'd taken the same tactic
with me.  But, you chose not to do that.......yet I have not once ever
responded to your crap.

But this time.....I have had enough of you.  You represent such a complete
waste of good talent....it such a shame.

Tom Pabst

Yeah Scott, you're such a waste of good talent.......how dare you post
something like that, what a waste of precious bandwidth your post was, I
hope you're really proud of yourself now

You capitalist pig you

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

"A woman is an occasional pleasure but a cigar is always a smoke"
--Groucho Marx--

Goy....you're always such a kidder!

....lol...

Tom

;)

--
Scott B. Husted
ICQ# 4395450
http://www.Husted.cc