rec.autos.simulators

F1RS: Understeer problems

Hans-Martin Ha

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Hans-Martin Ha » Thu, 08 Jan 1998 04:00:00

I bought F1RS yesterday, and it surely is a nice game.

However, I'm having problems with understeering. I've tried following the
other cars through the corners, to get the correct line/entrance/speed,
but I can't keep the same speed as my competitors without driving of the
track!

I've tried to soften the front anti-roll bar and increasing downforce,
but I can't seem to get the perfect setup.

Any suggestions? What would be the most ideal suspension setup (values
etc) for a track like Silverstone?


H.M.Haga

Doug Reichl

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Doug Reichl » Fri, 09 Jan 1998 04:00:00

: However, I'm having problems with understeering.

I don't have this game, but this is true for all understeering:

1) Stiffen rear suspension/anti-roll
2) Set brake bias more towards rear
3) Trail-brake (ie carry the brake into the corner to transfer the weight
   onto the front tires and off of the rear tires to induce oversteer).
--
-------------------------------------


William Dahm

F1RS: Understeer problems

by William Dahm » Fri, 09 Jan 1998 04:00:00


> I bought F1RS yesterday, and it surely is a nice game.

> However, I'm having problems with understeering. I've tried following
> the
> other cars through the corners, to get the correct
> line/entrance/speed,
> but I can't keep the same speed as my competitors without driving of
> the
> track!


changed just about everything in the setup possible but the car still
pushes really bad.  I sent an E-MAIL to F1 Master at UbiSoft about this,
I hope they fix this.  F1RS, no matter how you set the car up, is like a
papy sim if you could only use the default "easy" setup.  For now, I
have gone back to GP2 and ICR2, although they don't look as good, the
sense of speed is just as good and you can get hooked up with that
perfect neutral handling condition that does not exist in F1RS.

Richard Walk

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Richard Walk » Fri, 09 Jan 1998 04:00:00



>However, I'm having problems with understeering. I've tried following the
>other cars through the corners, to get the correct line/entrance/speed,
>but I can't keep the same speed as my competitors without driving of the
>track!

It may sound odd, but try reducing the amount of steering lock...

Also, make sure that you are not entering the corner too fast (obvious,
but very easily done <g>)

Cheers,
Richard

DM

F1RS: Understeer problems

by DM » Fri, 09 Jan 1998 04:00:00

What circuits are you guys currently trying? I have set-ups for Hockenheim & Monaco that I'm happy with (I'm currently ironing out the one for Silverstone). I'll happily e-mail them to you or post them here if others are interested.
Regards

DM

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    > I bought F1RS yesterday, and it surely is a nice game.
    >
    > However, I'm having problems with understeering. I've tried following
    > the
    > other cars through the corners, to get the correct
    > line/entrance/speed,
    > but I can't keep the same speed as my competitors without driving of
    > the
    > track!


    changed just about everything in the setup possible but the car still
    pushes really bad.  I sent an E-MAIL to F1 Master at UbiSoft about this,
    I hope they fix this.  F1RS, no matter how you set the car up, is like a
    papy sim if you could only use the default "easy" setup.  For now, I
    have gone back to GP2 and ICR2, although they don't look as good, the
    sense of speed is just as good and you can get hooked up with that
    perfect neutral handling condition that does not exist in F1RS.

Hermann Kau

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Hermann Kau » Sat, 10 Jan 1998 04:00:00

On Thu, 08 Jan 1998 20:33:28 +0000, Richard Beckett


> It's difficult to explain, but imagine you're driving a road
>car in
>the wet, and you come to a tight turn. You turn in and the car goes
>round.
>Now...do it again, but this time suddenly apply full lock, this time the
>car
>will slide straight on - until you REDUCE the lock. It feels like
>understeer,
>but it's caused by having too much lock.

What you are talking about IS definitely understeer !!
Hermann
Greg Cisk

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Greg Cisk » Sat, 10 Jan 1998 04:00:00

Yes that is what I was saying. But *** that...

What I would like to know is how in the hell a private email I sent to
Richard Beckett ended up in this Newsgroup? Does someone seriously
have their head up their ass or what?

--
Header address intentionally scrambled to ward off the spamming hordes.




>> > Subject: Re: F1RS: Understeer problems
>> > Oh I get it. Even though the tires are turned to the max lock they
still
>> > have too little traction to stick. So it is like sliding on ice and not
>> > turning.

>> No...what I meant was that too much lock was applied in the first place
>> and
>> because of that the front tyres started to slide, and adding more lock
>> makes
>> it worse. It's difficult to explain, but imagine you're driving a road
>> car in
>> the wet, and you come to a tight turn. You turn in and the car goes
>> round.
>> Now...do it again, but this time suddenly apply full lock, this time the
>> car
>> will slide straight on - until you REDUCE the lock. It feels like
>> understeer,
>> but it's caused by having too much lock.

>> > Have you tried any rain races? Even with wet tires, it is tough. You
can
>> > break traction and spin the rears down the straight pretty easy. It was
>> > quite
>> > interesting...  I did Melbourne in 2:09 in the rain. It isn't that
great of
>> > a time
>> > but it was fun :-)

>> I started out by learning the game in the wet...it makes the dry much
>> easier
>> 8-))

>> --
>>         Cheers,
>>                 Richard.

>> Richard UNDERSCORE Beckett AT ecid DOT cig DOT mot DOT com

>    Technically speaking, what your trying to say is that the
>co-efficient of static friction (ie tyres not skidding) is greater than
>the co-efficient of kinetic friction (ie tyres skidding). In other words
>the tryes grip better when "tracking" than when skidding.
>     I am in two minds about the understeer at the moment. It's a case
>of iether Ubi being the first company to do it "true to life" or a
>matter of something being wrong. It sure is different to all other sims.
>1 or 2 mph can seem to make a hell of a lot of difference to the turning
>performance of the car.
>    Unfortunately my Viper 330 is apparently not working correctly and
>the game is so choppy when cornering that it's hard to give any type of
>accurate analysis at this point :((((

Byron Forbe

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Byron Forbe » Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:00:00



> > Subject: Re: F1RS: Understeer problems
> > Oh I get it. Even though the tires are turned to the max lock they still
> > have too little traction to stick. So it is like sliding on ice and not
> > turning.

> No...what I meant was that too much lock was applied in the first place
> and
> because of that the front tyres started to slide, and adding more lock
> makes
> it worse. It's difficult to explain, but imagine you're driving a road
> car in
> the wet, and you come to a tight turn. You turn in and the car goes
> round.
> Now...do it again, but this time suddenly apply full lock, this time the
> car
> will slide straight on - until you REDUCE the lock. It feels like
> understeer,
> but it's caused by having too much lock.

> > Have you tried any rain races? Even with wet tires, it is tough. You can
> > break traction and spin the rears down the straight pretty easy. It was
> > quite
> > interesting...  I did Melbourne in 2:09 in the rain. It isn't that great of
> > a time
> > but it was fun :-)

> I started out by learning the game in the wet...it makes the dry much
> easier
> 8-))

> --
>         Cheers,
>                 Richard.

> Richard UNDERSCORE Beckett AT ecid DOT cig DOT mot DOT com

    Technically speaking, what your trying to say is that the
co-efficient of static friction (ie tyres not skidding) is greater than
the co-efficient of kinetic friction (ie tyres skidding). In other words
the tryes grip better when "tracking" than when skidding.
     I am in two minds about the understeer at the moment. It's a case
of iether Ubi being the first company to do it "true to life" or a
matter of something being wrong. It sure is different to all other sims.
1 or 2 mph can seem to make a hell of a lot of difference to the turning
performance of the car.
    Unfortunately my Viper 330 is apparently not working correctly and
the game is so choppy when cornering that it's hard to give any type of
accurate analysis at this point :((((
Hans-Martin Ha

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Hans-Martin Ha » Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:00:00


says...

I know that driving a F1 car with ~700bhp isn't supposed to be easy, but
if Ubisoft have made the game so realistic that only Villeneuve himself
can complete a race, we do have a problem. I bought this game to have fun
- not to become an F1 driver!

I never had such great problems with understeering in F1GP, and the
developers of TOCA BTCC probably don't even know the meaning of the word.

Well, guess I'll have to give Schumacher his seat back and return to the
stands. I was at the Hockenheim GP last year, and it was a great
experience (especially driving 270kmh at the Autobahn :-))


H.M.Haga

papa..

F1RS: Understeer problems

by papa.. » Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:00:00

Great advice...and some general advice. When setting up the car dont
change more than one thing at a time while your learning the effects.
That way you get an good feel for what is happening.

I DO NOT have an understeering problem. Probably because I dont
overdrive the car....but then again I realize Im not that quick yet but
am getting there.

This sim is BAD ASS....EAU ROUGE is absolutely incredible and now I know
what Senna meant when he talked about it...and Spa. And I havent even
tried other tracks besides Monza and Spa....my oh my...this sim is
incredible Im sooooo happy I spent the extra money to buy it from
Ubisoft via Airborne.

PAPA DOC

>: However, I'm having problems with understeering.
>I don't have this game, but this is true for all understeering:
>1) Stiffen rear suspension/anti-roll
>2) Set brake bias more towards rear
>3) Trail-brake (ie carry the brake into the corner to transfer the weight
>   onto the front tires and off of the rear tires to induce oversteer).
>--
>-------------------------------------


Steve Pritcha

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Steve Pritcha » Sun, 11 Jan 1998 04:00:00

I had similar problems and found that it was due to the fact that my wheel
was set up as a joystick under Win95.  If you make sure it is set up as a
steering devices, then it works fine.

Hope this helps.

Steve.

Eric Cot

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Eric Cot » Mon, 12 Jan 1998 04:00:00

Nurburbring (dry race)

Seems some are having trouble with this sims, so i'll give one of my
setup, for 25% race distance (or 3 pitstop)

Fuel amount       : 39 litres
Tire Compound  : C
Max lock              : 13 degrees
Front wing  : 15 degrees   Rear wing : 9 degrees
Brake ratio : 52% front, 48% rear
Gear ratio : 19-25-31-36-40-43

Dampers (non-symetrical):
LF: 71% rebound        RF: 72% rebound
LF: 27% bump             RF: 27% bump

LR: 82% rebound        RR: 76% rebound
LR: 36% bump             RR: 40% bump

Ride height: 35mm front , 62mm rear

Cambers:

LF : -4 deg.   RF : -4 deg.
LR : -5 deg.   RR : -5 deg.

Packers:

LF : 56% (of 40mm)  RF : 56%
LR : 64% (of 40mm)  RR : 64%

Springs:

LF : 59%        RF : 59%
LR : 68%        RR : 68%

Anti-Roll Bar:

36% in front
60% in rear

Max. RPM: 16800


distance)

I'm using a TSW with gear shift lever, and modified pedals travel linkage

Hope it will be of help, Eric

(SPY's GP2 WEBSITE)

  vcard.vcf
< 1K Download
Ken Nicols

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Ken Nicols » Tue, 13 Jan 1998 04:00:00


>If you apply too much lock, then the car "feels" like it's
>understeering, but it isn't.

>Try this...

>Reduce the steering lock to say 5 degrees. Then gradually increase it
>until you can drive around the tightest corner happily. This should sort
>out the problem.

Thanks for that! The car was incredibly unresponsive in turns with a
lock of 15 or so with my TSW, but after dropping the lock down to 6,
the thing now handles like a dream :-)

BTW do you (or anyone else?) have problems with setups not
transferring over correctly from practice to race? I'm sure I press
the button on the setup screens, but half the time I enter race day
with a car handling like a bus :-( Only last night, I had most of the
setup across bar the steering lock, which was back at 20. Anyone aware
of any buglets in this department?

Ken
--


#include <disclaim>

Bruce Kennewel

F1RS: Understeer problems

by Bruce Kennewel » Tue, 13 Jan 1998 04:00:00

Don't forget that that adjusting the front and/or rear roll bars also
has a significant effect on fine-tuning the understeer/oversteer.
I don't think that this factor has been mentioned in this thread.

--
Bruce.
(At home)

John Wehm

F1RS: Understeer problems

by John Wehm » Tue, 13 Jan 1998 04:00:00


>Seems some are having trouble with this sims, so i'll give one of my
>setup, for 25% race distance (or 3 pitstop)

[setups from a pro snipped...]

Thank you, thank you.  I am so bad at setting up my own car, I appreciate the
"race" setups, as opposed to all the other's I've seen that are hot-lap only.  
If you have any more, please let me (us) know...I'd love to at least have a
decent starting point.

Thanks again,

John Wehman


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