rec.autos.simulators

by **Joe Marque** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 02:59:12

If you told me a year ago my favorite F1 game would be EA's F1 2001 for the
PS2 I would not have believed you. Given that dramatic improvement, I feel
the same may be in store for Nascar fans and Nascar Thunder. It looks like
EA is committed to adding realistic physics to their list of things that are
"in the game." Perhaps sponsoring an actual Nascar event brought them
closer to sim fans. I also read that Ed Martin (formerly of Nascar Heat) is
with EA Sports so that can only help. Here's a quote from Ed:

"I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin, director of
NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to deliver that
this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making NASCAR
Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing fans."

My money is on EA to deliver a fairly realistic and compelling Nascar game.
I can't believe I just said that! ;-). Some additional features include:

-full damage including flying parts
-43 car field, amazing for a console
-career mode, take your driver through a 20 year career

--
Joe Marques

by **Cliff Roma** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 03:37:59

Take your driver through a 20 year career?

Hell, how many people have actually finished 1 offline season with a Nascar
game?

They are already missing the mark, thinking that offline racing is more
important that good online racing.

Yes the PS2 will have online by then

by **Biz** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 03:52:27

Its still a console.....

--
Biz

"Don't touch that please, your primitive intellect wouldn't understand
alloys and compositions and,......things with molecular structures,....and
the....." - Ash

by **ymenar** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 05:35:27

>"[...]the most exciting and fun experience for all racing fans."

This quote is quite clear. It's an sim-arcade type of racing simulation, in
the vein of the first Nascar Heat. All racing fans <> people who want
serious racing simulation. Racing is not always fun and exciting, even for
the drivers. It's frustrating.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- May the Downforce be with you...
-- http://www.ymenard.com/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...

by **Rod Princ** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 05:47:30

100% correct. Afterall, we don't buy games to pop them in the CD caddy
and just turn the machine on and expect it to load and run without
crashing, we want to endlessly*** around with them to try and squeeze
one more fps out of it or try myraids of drivers because the sodding
thing won't work in the first place. Look around at the F1-2001 posts.

You only have to look at the last few console racing titles to see that
the console has alot of potential in the racing genre.

Cheers,
Rod.

by **Joe Marque** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 08:45:02

How are they off the mark by focusing on offline racing on a platform that
doesn't have online capability yet? They're trying to offer the best
offline experience for that system which is right on the mark. There's
little point in focusing on online racing for the PS2 before it exists, the
size of the market is too uncertain to make that kind of bet with capital.

--
Joe Marques

> Take your driver through a 20 year career?

> Hell, how many people have actually finished 1 offline season with a
Nascar
> game?

> They are already missing the mark, thinking that offline racing is more
> important that good online racing.

> Yes the PS2 will have online by then

> > If you told me a year ago my favorite F1 game would be EA's F1 2001 for
> the
> > PS2 I would not have believed you. Given that dramatic improvement, I
> feel
> > the same may be in store for Nascar fans and Nascar Thunder. It looks
> like
> > EA is committed to adding realistic physics to their list of things that
> are
> > "in the game." Perhaps sponsoring an actual Nascar event brought them
> > closer to sim fans. I also read that Ed Martin (formerly of Nascar
Heat)
> is
> > with EA Sports so that can only help. Here's a quote from Ed:

> > "I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin, director
> of
> > NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
> > entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to deliver
> that
> > this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making NASCAR
> > Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing fans."

> > My money is on EA to deliver a fairly realistic and compelling Nascar
> game.
> > I can't believe I just said that! ;-). Some additional features
include:

> > -full damage including flying parts
> > -43 car field, amazing for a console
> > -career mode, take your driver through a 20 year career

> > --
> > Joe Marques

by **T. Wortm** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 09:01:45

On Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:59:12 GMT, "Joe Marques" <Joe

>"I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin, director of
>NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
>entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to deliver that
>this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making NASCAR
>Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing fans."

Sorry, but he said the same thing about Heat.....and it's still
collecting dust on my shelf.

by **Cliff Roma** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 09:13:16

Just showing you why it will fail as a true Nascar Sim

> How are they off the mark by focusing on offline racing on a platform that
> doesn't have online capability yet? They're trying to offer the best
> offline experience for that system which is right on the mark. There's
> little point in focusing on online racing for the PS2 before it exists,
the
> size of the market is too uncertain to make that kind of bet with capital.

> --
> Joe Marques

> > Take your driver through a 20 year career?

> > Hell, how many people have actually finished 1 offline season with a
> Nascar
> > game?

> > They are already missing the mark, thinking that offline racing is more
> > important that good online racing.

> > Yes the PS2 will have online by then

> > > If you told me a year ago my favorite F1 game would be EA's F1 2001
for
> > the
> > > PS2 I would not have believed you. Given that dramatic improvement, I
> > feel
> > > the same may be in store for Nascar fans and Nascar Thunder. It looks
> > like
> > > EA is committed to adding realistic physics to their list of things
that
> > are
> > > "in the game." Perhaps sponsoring an actual Nascar event brought them
> > > closer to sim fans. I also read that Ed Martin (formerly of Nascar
> Heat)
> > is
> > > with EA Sports so that can only help. Here's a quote from Ed:

> > > "I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin,
director
> > of
> > > NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
> > > entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to deliver
> > that
> > > this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making
NASCAR
> > > Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing
fans."

> > > My money is on EA to deliver a fairly realistic and compelling Nascar
> > game.
> > > I can't believe I just said that! ;-). Some additional features
> include:

> > > -full damage including flying parts
> > > -43 car field, amazing for a console
> > > -career mode, take your driver through a 20 year career

> > > --
> > > Joe Marques

by **Joe Marque** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 09:49:34

So the absence of online play means certain failure as a TRUE sim regardless
of overall quality? Says who, you? When were you named industry spokesman?
Pleeeeease, let's not take ourselves too seriously Cliffy.

If it has realistic physics, accurate tracks, good AI, good graphics, good
damage modeling, and is fun to play then it will absolutely succeed as a
TRUE sim to me and many others. Mind you I'm not saying it WILL have these
things nor am I certain it will succeed as a true sim. I'm not nearly as
presumptuous or obnoxious as you since I base my conclusions on facts and
actual experiences. This elitist-PC shit is amazing.

I posted here simply to share my pleasant surprise with the recent advances
in console sims. I was sharing info and a hopeful opinion, nothing more. I
wasn't starting a PC vs. Console thread. I still believe the PC will remain
as the choice for ultimate realism for many years. The fact that consoles
are catching up so quickly is good news for the industry. F1 2001 on the
PS2 is a refreshing improvement for console racing. There's the added bonus
of solid fps and no headaches to get it running. It appears Nascar Thunder
has the same potential. I'm pleased that such great simming is available on
a $300 PS2 (that was the price of my damn video card on my PC yet I still
can't run anywhere near 43 cars in N4).

Shouldn't we be encouraged by more realism on a low cost alternative to PCs?
There's no need to bash a pre-release console sim, unless of course you're
just pissed that you're running 19 cars in N4 at 23 fps with a $400 video
card. :-p

Sometimes this group can be f*ing annoying. Here's a summary of this
thread:

Multi-Platform Modern Man: Hey Nascar Thunder 2002 might actually be a real
live sim from EA, can you believe it?

PC Caveman 1: Offline suck. Online only TRUE sim. Offline not TRUE sim.
EA not TRUE sim.

PC Caveman 2: Console suck. PC is good. Me love PC. Me hate console.

PC Caveman 3: EA fun. Fun bad. Racing not fun. Racing frustrating.
Frustrating good. Frustrating real. Me want frustrating. EA not
frustrating. No EA for me.

Notice the difference in tone? This ng is such a ray of sunshine.

--
Joe Marques

> Just showing you why it will fail as a true Nascar Sim

> > How are they off the mark by focusing on offline racing on a platform
that
> > doesn't have online capability yet? They're trying to offer the best
> > offline experience for that system which is right on the mark. There's
> > little point in focusing on online racing for the PS2 before it exists,
> the
> > size of the market is too uncertain to make that kind of bet with
capital.

> > --
> > Joe Marques

> > > Take your driver through a 20 year career?

> > > Hell, how many people have actually finished 1 offline season with a
> > Nascar
> > > game?

> > > They are already missing the mark, thinking that offline racing is
more
> > > important that good online racing.

> > > Yes the PS2 will have online by then

> > > > If you told me a year ago my favorite F1 game would be EA's F1 2001
> for
> > > the
> > > > PS2 I would not have believed you. Given that dramatic improvement,
I
> > > feel
> > > > the same may be in store for Nascar fans and Nascar Thunder. It
looks
> > > like
> > > > EA is committed to adding realistic physics to their list of things
> that
> > > are
> > > > "in the game." Perhaps sponsoring an actual Nascar event brought
them
> > > > closer to sim fans. I also read that Ed Martin (formerly of Nascar
> > Heat)
> > > is
> > > > with EA Sports so that can only help. Here's a quote from Ed:

> > > > "I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin,
> director
> > > of
> > > > NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
> > > > entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to
deliver
> > > that
> > > > this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making
> NASCAR
> > > > Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing
> fans."

> > > > My money is on EA to deliver a fairly realistic and compelling
Nascar
> > > game.
> > > > I can't believe I just said that! ;-). Some additional features
> > include:

> > > > -full damage including flying parts
> > > > -43 car field, amazing for a console
> > > > -career mode, take your driver through a 20 year career

> > > > --
> > > > Joe Marques

by **John Pancoas** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 10:39:11

Exactly, thank you. My personal favorite was the "sorry we can't comment
on our plans for Heat's online play and why it doesn't have yellows online,
but we're in the middle of double-top secret negotiations with Nascar,
because they won't let us have them"

Sure..........I like Heat, but sorry, saw this carrot in front of the
horse already.

-John

> On Sun, 14 Oct 2001 17:59:12 GMT, "Joe Marques" <Joe

> >"I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin, director
of
> >NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
> >entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to deliver
that
> >this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making NASCAR
> >Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing fans."

> Sorry, but he said the same thing about Heat.....and it's still
> collecting dust on my shelf.

by **Cliff Roma** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 11:12:56

How well did NH do?

Some would say the physics are great, some would say the graphics are great?
But lack of a good online play killed the game.

Sure, Nascar Thunder 2002 may actually be a good game, maybe even have
realistic physics and graphics.. but it will fail in what I consider to be a
Sim.

Just my opinion.. if you can not take my opinion then do not read it. I
have not knocked you for yours as you seem to want to do because of mine

Btw, for the record, I DO own a PS2 and I do love it and I DO love playing
GT3. Oh, and I do get 43 cars in N4 with 60fps without a $400 video card
thank you.

> So the absence of online play means certain failure as a TRUE sim
regardless
> of overall quality? Says who, you? When were you named industry
spokesman?
> Pleeeeease, let's not take ourselves too seriously Cliffy.

> If it has realistic physics, accurate tracks, good AI, good graphics, good
> damage modeling, and is fun to play then it will absolutely succeed as a
> TRUE sim to me and many others. Mind you I'm not saying it WILL have
these
> things nor am I certain it will succeed as a true sim. I'm not nearly as
> presumptuous or obnoxious as you since I base my conclusions on facts and
> actual experiences. This elitist-PC shit is amazing.

> I posted here simply to share my pleasant surprise with the recent
advances
> in console sims. I was sharing info and a hopeful opinion, nothing more.
I
> wasn't starting a PC vs. Console thread. I still believe the PC will
remain
> as the choice for ultimate realism for many years. The fact that consoles
> are catching up so quickly is good news for the industry. F1 2001 on the
> PS2 is a refreshing improvement for console racing. There's the added
bonus
> of solid fps and no headaches to get it running. It appears Nascar
Thunder
> has the same potential. I'm pleased that such great simming is available
on
> a $300 PS2 (that was the price of my damn video card on my PC yet I still
> can't run anywhere near 43 cars in N4).

> Shouldn't we be encouraged by more realism on a low cost alternative to
PCs?
> There's no need to bash a pre-release console sim, unless of course you're
> just pissed that you're running 19 cars in N4 at 23 fps with a $400 video
> card. :-p

> Sometimes this group can be f*ing annoying. Here's a summary of this
> thread:

> Multi-Platform Modern Man: Hey Nascar Thunder 2002 might actually be a
real
> live sim from EA, can you believe it?

> PC Caveman 1: Offline suck. Online only TRUE sim. Offline not TRUE sim.
> EA not TRUE sim.

> PC Caveman 2: Console suck. PC is good. Me love PC. Me hate console.

> PC Caveman 3: EA fun. Fun bad. Racing not fun. Racing frustrating.
> Frustrating good. Frustrating real. Me want frustrating. EA not
> frustrating. No EA for me.

> Notice the difference in tone? This ng is such a ray of sunshine.

> --
> Joe Marques

> > Just showing you why it will fail as a true Nascar Sim

> > > How are they off the mark by focusing on offline racing on a platform
> that
> > > doesn't have online capability yet? They're trying to offer the best
> > > offline experience for that system which is right on the mark.
There's
> > > little point in focusing on online racing for the PS2 before it
exists,
> > the
> > > size of the market is too uncertain to make that kind of bet with
> capital.

> > > --
> > > Joe Marques

> > > > Take your driver through a 20 year career?

> > > > Hell, how many people have actually finished 1 offline season with a
> > > Nascar
> > > > game?

> > > > They are already missing the mark, thinking that offline racing is
> more
> > > > important that good online racing.

> > > > Yes the PS2 will have online by then

> > > > > If you told me a year ago my favorite F1 game would be EA's F1
2001
> > for
> > > > the
> > > > > PS2 I would not have believed you. Given that dramatic
improvement,
> I
> > > > feel
> > > > > the same may be in store for Nascar fans and Nascar Thunder. It
> looks
> > > > like
> > > > > EA is committed to adding realistic physics to their list of
things
> > that
> > > > are
> > > > > "in the game." Perhaps sponsoring an actual Nascar event brought
> them
> > > > > closer to sim fans. I also read that Ed Martin (formerly of
Nascar
> > > Heat)
> > > > is
> > > > > with EA Sports so that can only help. Here's a quote from Ed:

> > > > > "I came on board at EA SPORTS to do one thing," said Ed Martin,
> > director
> > > > of
> > > > > NASCAR production. "To produce the deepest, most compelling and
> > > > > entertaining NASCAR game ever developed and we are on track to
> deliver
> > > > that
> > > > > this fall. The entire NASCAR team at EA has committed to making
> > NASCAR
> > > > > Thunder 2002 the most exciting and fun experience for all racing
> > fans."

> > > > > My money is on EA to deliver a fairly realistic and compelling
> Nascar
> > > > game.
> > > > > I can't believe I just said that! ;-). Some additional features
> > > include:

> > > > > -full damage including flying parts
> > > > > -43 car field, amazing for a console
> > > > > -career mode, take your driver through a 20 year career

> > > > > --
> > > > > Joe Marques

by **Biz** » Tue, 16 Oct 2001 15:22:02

As a TRUE sim it will fail, as a fun game that can be another issue. Most
of us only consider a few of the racing PC titles out there as true sims