rec.autos.simulators

GTR Demo impressions

Alan L

GTR Demo impressions

by Alan L » Mon, 03 May 2004 16:18:28

Glad I'm not the only one.  For now, my biggest clue is when I turn the
wheel and nothing happens.  On a related note, it seems very difficult to
tuck the nose in once it starts sliding.  Seems to be more of a tire thing.
Don't know if it's that way in rl, but in the demo, massive understeer is a
far bigger problem than losing grip at the rear.  I tried out semi-pro and
noticed it's much less evident.  Is this down to the rl tires being fairly
unforgiving at the edge or something wonky in the physics (tire or
otherwise)?

Alan

Damien Evan

GTR Demo impressions

by Damien Evan » Mon, 03 May 2004 16:20:12

Quite a while ago.  I've been to an F1 race weekend recently and the only
cars that had sqealing tyres around the corners were the classic cars and
the road cars (exhibition race)  The GT, F1 cars only squealed when they had
a major spin and even then it wasn't much.

Damien Evan

GTR Demo impressions

by Damien Evan » Mon, 03 May 2004 16:48:59

Don't forget you can change your setup - default is very understeery

Eric Leblan

GTR Demo impressions

by Eric Leblan » Mon, 03 May 2004 20:23:29

I'm sorry dude, but when real racing, a combination of force, vibration and
sounds make you feel how bad you are pushing it.

Know understand that the demo is very good, just more tire sounds would be
better.

EL


Dan_Leac

GTR Demo impressions

by Dan_Leac » Mon, 03 May 2004 21:08:59

Am i the only perosn that bounced into every braking area and bpounced round
every tight turn?
 If this is realistic then gtr drivers must feel sick with all the bouncing
and jumping around
Damien Evan

GTR Demo impressions

by Damien Evan » Mon, 03 May 2004 21:15:48

If you look a little closer at the demo the info screens have information
about every corner on the track.  The ruts before the low speed corners are
discussed.

Dan_Leac

GTR Demo impressions

by Dan_Leac » Mon, 03 May 2004 21:53:59


 Whether they are intentional or not ive never seen a gtr car bouncing round
spa before :)

JP

GTR Demo impressions

by JP » Mon, 03 May 2004 23:08:21


  Slicks don't squeal ?  Since when ?  Heard them squeal plenty at every
Nascar race I was at.

- Show quoted text -

Haqsa

GTR Demo impressions

by Haqsa » Mon, 03 May 2004 23:52:16

They squeal when you lose it, they don't squeal when they are still hooked
up.  I think the issue is that people who play Papy sims a lot have got used
to hearing tire squeal *before* they lose it, and they use it to gauge
whether they have the car on the edge or not.  That's not realistic with
modern slicks.  Personally I would prefer the realism, esp. in a sim like
this.  You can tell how close to the edge you are by steering response, you
don't need a phony noise to tell you.


JP

GTR Demo impressions

by JP » Mon, 03 May 2004 23:58:01

  Uh, no.  They squeal all the time during race, practice, whatever,
conditions, at tracks that are applicable(i.e., short tracks, etc.)
  Sitting trackside, its easily heard.


> They squeal when you lose it, they don't squeal when they are still hooked
> up.  I think the issue is that people who play Papy sims a lot have got
used
> to hearing tire squeal *before* they lose it, and they use it to gauge
> whether they have the car on the edge or not.  That's not realistic with
> modern slicks.  Personally I would prefer the realism, esp. in a sim like
> this.  You can tell how close to the edge you are by steering response,
you
> don't need a phony noise to tell you.



> >   Slicks don't squeal ?  Since when ?  Heard them squeal plenty at every
> > Nascar race I was at.

Haqsa

GTR Demo impressions

by Haqsa » Mon, 03 May 2004 23:56:55

Steering response should tell you how close to the edge you are.  I can
certainly feel it in the demo.  It's a subjective call, but personally I
prefer the way it is in the demo.  In Papy sims I got used to pushing the
car until the tires squeal, then when I started racing karts I had to
retrain myself to stop doing that because it was slowing me down.  I can
handle that unnecessary tire squeal in an arcade game but if a sim is
claiming to be realistic then I would prefer that the tire squeal is
realistic also.


JP

GTR Demo impressions

by JP » Tue, 04 May 2004 00:00:03

  Great.  And for the many, many sim racers that don't have a ff wheel ?  Or
I suppose now, the latest wearing your*** on a sleeve mantra will be,
"Only real sim racers have ff devices", eh ?


> Steering response should tell you how close to the edge you are.  I can
> certainly feel it in the demo.  It's a subjective call, but personally I
> prefer the way it is in the demo.  In Papy sims I got used to pushing the
> car until the tires squeal, then when I started racing karts I had to
> retrain myself to stop doing that because it was slowing me down.  I can
> handle that unnecessary tire squeal in an arcade game but if a sim is
> claiming to be realistic then I would prefer that the tire squeal is
> realistic also.



> > I'm sorry dude, but when real racing, a combination of force, vibration
> and
> > sounds make you feel how bad you are pushing it.

> > Know understand that the demo is very good, just more tire sounds would
be
> > better.

> > EL

Steve Blankenshi

GTR Demo impressions

by Steve Blankenshi » Tue, 04 May 2004 00:11:19

As opposed to wearing it on your shoulders...

No FF here either and would prefer a bit more tire sound ala Papy, but am
not going to be a*** about it.  It IS absurdly easy to change, after all.


JP

GTR Demo impressions

by JP » Tue, 04 May 2004 00:18:29

  True.  For that matter, I have a momo.  Just interesting some of the
comments; I can see it comin'  <g>


> As opposed to wearing it on your shoulders...

> No FF here either and would prefer a bit more tire sound ala Papy, but am
> not going to be a*** about it.  It IS absurdly easy to change, after
all.



> >   Great.  And for the many, many sim racers that don't have a ff wheel ?
> Or
> > I suppose now, the latest wearing your*** on a sleeve mantra will be,
> > "Only real sim racers have ff devices", eh ?

Marc Collin

GTR Demo impressions

by Marc Collin » Tue, 04 May 2004 00:12:28

It is very jumpy and incredibly easy to slide, power oversteer, etc. here.

Marc


> Thanks for the tip Marc, but I did that before my first drive :-)

> They are set to "off" there, and also when I go into the 2 pages of car
> setup...

> Maybe I'm just used to the LX6 in LFS...

> Tim



> > Go into the set-up and remove the traction control and anti-lock braking
> > aids...you won't have a problem with "natural" car control after that.

> > Marc



> > > Hi,

> > > As the word is now "on the street", I suspect that the GTR "press"
demo
> > will
> > > be impossible to pull back, even when they pull it from the server.
> > Anyway,
> > > doing justice to being a press version, here's my review after a few
> > hours..

> > > Graphics are great! I actually prefer them to the TRD2 demos, even
> though
> > > they are not (yet) so advanced. To me, the TRD2 graphics are too
> glossy -
> > > not realistic. The TRD2 graphics are "in your face", whilst the GTR
> > graphics
> > > are just very good for the job.

> > > The sound is great - on par with TRD2.

> > > There are two cars and one track (SPA) in the demo. As for the
physics -
> > > very good, but maybe some car setup tweaking is required before a
second
> > > opinion is given. I suspect that the car setup (as opposed to physics)
> has
> > > been dumbed down for the press! Both cars are set up to understeer,
> making
> > > them quite easy to drive, even in the most realistic mode with all the
> > > driver aids disabled. However, as soon as I light up the rear tyres
with
> > too
> > > much power, it is instant spin city in anything over first gear,
> > regardless
> > > of how quick I throw on the opposite lock. To me, this is the most
> > > frustrating aspect of driving the default setups. There is no way that
I
> > can
> > > trail brake into corners, or power slide out. I can't even set up a
> > neutral
> > > drift. The only way to drive is smoothly with touch of understeer
around
> > the
> > > corners, and no sliding on the exits. This gets a bit boring after a
> > while,
> > > and doesn't make for the GPL/LFS type of control that I was hoping
for.
> > > Again, to be fair, I'm no guru at car setups - hopefully someone can
> help
> > > out here with a better setup.

> > > Now for some more Pros. The force feedback (on my Momo Force) is
> > absolutely
> > > brilliant! It gives me so much more feel for what is happening, quite
> > > literally. You notice it the moment you exit the pit garage for the
> first
> > > time, as you feel the engine throbbing. The effects over the ripple
> strips
> > > and sand traps is also totally realistic.

> > > The z axis physics are the best I have come across. You can really
feel
> > the
> > > car get light over crests and bump its way over curbs. The FF also
helps
> > > here.

> > > I didn't notice any tyre wear, or any aspect of the car warming up.
For
> > the
> > > first couple of laps, I put the understeer (and lack of braking force)
> > down
> > > to cold tyres and brakes, but things didnt' seem to change after 20
> laps.
> > On
> > > the subject of braking - the default setup has braking force set to
> 100%,
> > > but its almost impossible to lock up the brakes, except at a dead
crawl.
> > As
> > > such, (again noting the default setup), I find that its a very binary
> > sim -
> > > mostly full throttle and full brakes all the time - not so great.

> > > One last negative - again on the handling. The sim doesn't seem to
react
> > to
> > > weight transfer very realistically. In order to get around the
> understeer
> > > problem, I deliberately tried to unbalance the car into the slower
> corners
> > > by turning the wrong way for a moment then throwing the car into the
> > corner,
> > > but it was still understeering. Even slaloming it in 6th gear on the
> > > straight produces mild understeer, or a sudden, uncontrollable spin.

> > > In summary - I think the sim is fantastic and has a lot of potential -
I
> > > can't wait to try again with a decent car setup.

> > > Tim


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