rec.autos.simulators

Do you think so?! Can we have separate lawyers please.....

Just because you decide to click "yes" without reading what it is
you're putting your name to, doesn't absolve you from the
responsibilities you've just taken on. Ignorance is not an excuse, and
laziness doesn't count either. The only safety net you have is that
there are too many people out there to prosecute, but should you draw
attention to yourself (say, for example, by selling something gained
by breaking the license agreement), you haven't a legal leg to stand
on.

Exactly, and most other licenses don't - including Papy's.

Of course not, Dave isn't the one breaking the law here, it's all the
people _using_ the program - they're the people who are breaking the
law.

Cheers!
John

PS - Reading this far absolves me of all responsibility to pay $100,
and further requires that $100 be paid in compensation to cover
administrative costs.

Theft is theft. Try telling the judge that you'd "forgotten it was
there".

It's a discussion - no-one's spiralled into an argument yet!

Cheers!
John

Once again you try to create a straw-man argument that has NOTHING
whatsoever to do with what I said.

OK: Someone with the guts and conviction to devote their energies to
their art (hint: this is not you). IOW, someone who's art is their
career - which applies to both Mozart and Kurt Cobain, but not to you.

Bullshit - you made up a strawman argument in your own mind and
"quoted" that.

GMAFB - by your definition EVERYONE is an artist, and the word
"artist" ceases to have any meaning whatsoever. It is an insult to
real, dedicated artists everywhere. You don't have the GUTS to be a
real artist, but you like the idea of calling yourself one. Pathetic.

Joe

Says who? People could make tracks of whatever they want. And if they
make a track that invringes on someones copyright, that obviously does
not affect Papyrus at all - it is an issue between the copyright
holder and the track creator.

And here we finally get to the real issue - the idea that a closed
program can generate more income through potential (but highly
limited) addon sales is PRECISELY the "close-minded" thinking I was
talking about. It is the old-fashioned software sales model, one that
Doom and Quake have proven is utterly invalid. ID has gained FAR, FAR
more income and sales from the open-architecture approach than they
ever could have by locking everyone else out of the addon business. I
would have thought this was obvious to anyone by now, but yout post -
not to metion the persistent close-mindedness of sim companies like
Papryus - shows that this is not the case. To me it's as obvious as
the nose on my face, but for some reason people just can't understand
the ID business model and why it makes them so successful.

Joe

Joe

Personally, being a programmer, I see nothing wrong with reading one
file format and converting to be used in a later version of the same
prgram.  Indycar, ICR2, Nascar, Nascar2 all being written by the same
company and programmers and generally using the same physics modeling
code.  If Papyrus had been Microsoft or Borland, etc,,,, backwards
compatibilty would have been included in the base package anyway.  And
that's the way it should be.  Just because you change Word versions
doesn't mean you throw out all your earlier Word documents and start
over again.

So more power to him.

Just food for thought.  (less than 2 cents worth.)
No insults intended.

Em....he's right you know. An artist by your definition is one
particular form of artist, but everyone is an artist in one form or
another. Arguing whether someone is or isn't is attempting to make
black and white of something which isn't.

Cheers!
John

It doesn't matter if it affects Papyrus or not. It infringes their
license sure, it also affects Daytona's, Indy's, whoever's track
you've copied. The fact is a license is infringed and if you're
profiting from that it is seen as taking a slice of their action.
They're more likely to want a slice of something than a slice of
nothing.

Joe, you've finally lost it. NO-ONE is arguing against that, it is
perfectly straightforward logic. The point you neglected to address is
that ID can do that because they have no copyright issues at all. They
make an open architecture, release it, and if some level artist makes
a copyrighted entity, hey, he's on his own. In Papyrus case the vast
majority of things people will make will be copyrighted, and it may
even be a part of the license with the tracks that there isn't an
editor.

It could also be that they don't have time, don't see money in it,
find the process too complex or a million other things. Monster Truck
Madness has an open architecture, as does POD - I don't see them
taking over the world.

Cheers!
John

Good race at the Brickyard,  (-o-)

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