rec.autos.simulators

GPL-Anti Aliasing

Paul Jage

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by Paul Jage » Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:00:00

What do I need to be able to use the anti-aliasing
option in GPL. I have 2xMonster 3dfx 12mb cards
but the option is greyed out. If I can not use it,
am I missing out on much?
Thanks
David Mocn

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by David Mocn » Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:00:00

You need a Rendition video card (eg Hercular Thriller 3D). Voodoo cards cannot
really do antialiasing (in theory they can (look in the mirrors) but in
reality it takes way too much of a performance hit (estimate 50%).

Now, if you're running GPL in 800x600 (or higher) then the antialising becomes
less significant (visualy). What it does is smoothes the edges of all
polygons so that you don't see the "jagged" edges. ie. it blends them in.

Regards,
David Mocnay



>What do I need to be able to use the anti-aliasing
>option in GPL. I have 2xMonster 3dfx 12mb cards
>but the option is greyed out. If I can not use it,
>am I missing out on much?
>Thanks

Steve Edward

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by Steve Edward » Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:00:00

So how is it that I have anti-aliasing on the 3Dfx patch for N2 and
Rendition never had it, or that Quake has AA?


>You need a Rendition video card (eg Hercular Thriller 3D). Voodoo cards
cannot
>really do antialiasing (in theory they can (look in the mirrors) but in
>reality it takes way too much of a performance hit (estimate 50%).

>Regards,
>David Mocnay

Matthias Buesi

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by Matthias Buesi » Wed, 11 Nov 1998 04:00:00

PJ> What do I need to be able to use the anti-aliasing
PJ> option in GPL. I have 2xMonster 3dfx 12mb cards
PJ> but the option is greyed out. If I can not use it,
PJ> am I missing out on much?

GPL doesn't offer this for voodoo-cards ;-(

I don't know if it's a problem with GPL or the voodoo !?

Also, man mailt sich...

.\\atze        [ FmMW2109 - FmMB2139 ]


*home* : http://www.home4u.de/buesing/

David Mocn

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by David Mocn » Thu, 12 Nov 1998 04:00:00

I have never seen a 3dfx game that does antialising (and I've been looking).
Quake does not have antialiasing. Also, I doubt that N2 has it (I have never
seen N2 run though Voodoo so I can't be as definate).
I have a feeling that you cannot differentiate between anti-aliasing (only
seen in Rendition games) and bilinear filtering (most 3d cards support this).
Anyway, here's what they are:

-antialiasing = smoothing of the edges on the polygons. This is done by
placing "in between" color pixels in the "jaggies" of the lines. Have a look
at GPL or ICR2 run through the Rendition card/s to see what this looks like.

-bilinear filtering = smoothing of the inside of the polygon.

Now, here's the techical bit. Renition chipset has a spare frame buffer so
that you do your antialising there. Voodoo chipests have got limited bufferes
that are very specific and you don't have a secondary buffer to do your
anialising. Therefore you have send the "screen" to the voodoo chip (as you
normaly do), then retrieve it back to memory where you antialias it, and then
back to the voodoo chip. This takes a lot of time and therefore you can kiss
your frame-rate goodbye.



>So how is it that I have anti-aliasing on the 3Dfx patch for N2 and
>Rendition never had it, or that Quake has AA?


>>You need a Rendition video card (eg Hercular Thriller 3D). Voodoo cards
>cannot
>>really do antialiasing (in theory they can (look in the mirrors) but in
>>reality it takes way too much of a performance hit (estimate 50%).

>>Regards,
>>David Mocnay

Steve Edward

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by Steve Edward » Thu, 12 Nov 1998 04:00:00

OK Dave

I have a Rendition Card, a Voodoo 1 and a Voodoo 2.   In Nascar 2 the top of
the guard rails have the jaggies with software and Rendition rendering, slap
in the 3Dfx patch and presto, the top of the guard rails are smooth.   So
which is that, BF or AA?

Steve


>I have never seen a 3dfx game that does antialising (and I've been
looking).
>Quake does not have antialiasing. Also, I doubt that N2 has it (I have
never
>seen N2 run though Voodoo so I can't be as definate).
>I have a feeling that you cannot differentiate between anti-aliasing (only
>seen in Rendition games) and bilinear filtering (most 3d cards support
this).
>Anyway, here's what they are:

David Mocn

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by David Mocn » Fri, 13 Nov 1998 04:00:00

Hi Steve,
That would be AA, If you're right, then N2 des have anti-aliasing in game (or
part of it). GPL has antialiasing though Voodoo to a degree as well - in the
mirrors. I haven't seen a full screen anti-aias in a 3dfx game .... N2 could
be THE one, but I haven't seen it so I can't comment. Can you tell be if
N2 though 3dfx has anti-alisong on:
- side of the road,
- the lines on the road
- skid maks on the rad
- outside of the cars
- trackside ojects

Thanks.
By the way, I have a feeling that OpenGL games are more likely to have
anti-aliasing than Glide games, I haven't seen one, but Turok comes to
mind.... it might have antialising in some places but I can't remember. If
anyone can check this then it could be helpfull.

By the way, I'd love it of there was game out there that supports
anti-aliasing though 3dfx. Then we could get on the "back" of manufactures and
make them put it into theyr 3dfx games. IMHO antialising can do amazing things
to the visuals of the game (of course the game has to look good in the 1st
place.... F1RS could have used antialising.... that would make it 10x better).

Regards,
David Mocnay



>OK Dave

>I have a Rendition Card, a Voodoo 1 and a Voodoo 2.   In Nascar 2 the top of
>the guard rails have the jaggies with software and Rendition rendering, slap
>in the 3Dfx patch and presto, the top of the guard rails are smooth.   So
>which is that, BF or AA?

>Steve


>>I have never seen a 3dfx game that does antialising (and I've been
>looking).
>>Quake does not have antialiasing. Also, I doubt that N2 has it (I have
>never
>>seen N2 run though Voodoo so I can't be as definate).
>>I have a feeling that you cannot differentiate between anti-aliasing (only
>>seen in Rendition games) and bilinear filtering (most 3d cards support
>this).
>>Anyway, here's what they are:

GEORGE ARUGAY MONTEMAY

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by GEORGE ARUGAY MONTEMAY » Fri, 13 Nov 1998 04:00:00

: I have never seen a 3dfx game that does antialising (and I've been looking).
: Quake does not have antialiasing. Also, I doubt that N2 has it (I have never
: seen N2 run though Voodoo so I can't be as definate).

The 3Dfx patch for Tomb Raider (still prefer this over 2 and 3) was one of
the first, if not the first, patches that supported edge anti-aliasing for
the Voodoo Graphics.  The differences between with and without
anti-aliasing on TR was noticeable.  The jaggies were gone, and I would
occasionally turn the feature 'on' and 'off' during the game for those
little 'Kodak moments'.  Ooohhh... aawww...  eeeewwweeee.... ahhhh.  :)

George

David Ript

GPL-Anti Aliasing

by David Ript » Tue, 17 Nov 1998 04:00:00



>That would be AA, If you're right, then N2 des have anti-aliasing in game (or
>part of it). GPL has antialiasing though Voodoo to a degree as well - in the
>mirrors. I haven't seen a full screen anti-aias in a 3dfx game .... N2 could
>be THE one, but I haven't seen it so I can't comment. Can you tell be if
>N2 though 3dfx has anti-alisong on:
>- side of the road,
>- the lines on the road
>- skid maks on the rad
>- outside of the cars
>- trackside ojects

Bilinear filtering: Anti-aliasing of textures within a polygon
Edge anti-aliasing: Anti-aliasing of polygon edges

Pretty much all 3Dfx games do bilinear filtering, but edge AA
is rare on 3Dfx for two reasons.  One, it requires an extra
pass, which affects frame rate.  Two, it's incompatible with
Z-buffering, which is used in many games for fast depth
culling.  Edge AA is more common for Rendition games because
with that architecture it doesn't kill speed, and Rendition
doesn't support hardware Z-buffering anyway.

The latest Tomb Raider 1 3Dfx patch does full-screen AA when
you hit a function key.  (I forget which one; try 'em all.)
TR1 is limited to 30 fps, so with a modern CPU you can leave
it on for the full game without noticing a frame rate hit.

The market has mostly followed the 3Dfx architecture, which
means lots of games using Z-buffering and not many using edge
AA.  As resolutions increase, edge AA matters less, though
it's still nice except when it's applied indiscriminately
and blurs text.

--

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