rec.autos.simulators

by **Jason Moy** » Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:18:53

You can hit the wall at 15 mph and do enough damage to increase the
drag on the car a tiny but noticeable amount while triggering the
'repair damage' option in the F9 screen. Also I hit the wall at 130
at Talladega and while the exterior damage seemed minor I did enough
internal damage that the car had a hard time cracking 150mph driving
back to the pits. Very nice, and it seems that the promises of a
damage system that is "similar to N2002 but much more sensitive" are
true.

For an 80% build I'm really impressed. A few things to complain about
actually, but I'm holding off until I have the final version. I'm not
sure how the driving is with force feedback, but without it I'm
finding myself losing the car when I really try to push it at
Michigan, which is nice. Seems like there's more grip when the tires
are heated and the wings/tires are oriented correctly in terms of
shouldering the weight of the car, but if you get out of the groove
and continue pushing hard the car wants to turn around faster than
before. The AI seems improved but who cares, I think I may be playing
this one online a bit more than the last 2, purely on the strength of
the new damage model.. =)

Jason

by **Haqsa** » Thu, 23 Jan 2003 12:51:14

Try it with FF and either the fast or Jasper setup. Hang on to that wheel!
There is even more of a pull than before, but once you get used to it you
can almost just shift your hands to a comfortable position with the wheel
***ed to the right and leave it there, steering entirely with your right
foot. Interesting. What lap times are you getting at Michigan in a test
session? Best I could manage in the 15 minutes or so that I had available
was 39.4 sec. That's about 2 sec off the lap record, but I would think the
lap record was probably set in the draft, so I don't know if my time is good
for a test session or not.

by **Dave Henri** » Thu, 23 Jan 2003 13:10:35

"Haqsau"
What lap times are you
Here's a blurb from last year's qualifying, which is done with no
drafting help.(from the racingups.com website)

----------
Nearly all the qualifying times improved from practice to qualifying.
Jarrett, who was also the fastest car during the morning practice, picked
up four-tenths of a second to post a qualifying lap of 38.081 seconds.
--------

dave henrie

by **Steve Blankenshi** » Thu, 23 Jan 2003 13:41:10

From the Michigan track.ini:

record_lap_time = 37.667
record_holder = Dale Earnhardt, Jr.

From my playrecs.ini in the '03 demo, after about 10-15 minutes of setup
tweaking (can't bear the Jasper setup; way too pushy):

BestLap_Sim_CUP_Race_Laptime=37.504000

(Done in a race but not a close draft; I ran some high 37's alone in
practice.)

Looks a bit generous in this build, and indeed the track.ini surface and
tire parameters in '03 are quite different than in '02. But the nominal
grip number's actually lower at Michigan than it was in '02. Some seriously
different tires in this beta!

SB

by **GTX_SlotCa** » Thu, 23 Jan 2003 16:10:23

After about 20 laps in a test session I was into the low & mid 38's with the
stock "fast" setup (which I think needs some serious help). I didn't follow
the racing line. Just give it some time, Haqsau.
I'm kind of anxious to play with this a little more, but not until after
Thursday's GPL race :-)

--
Slot

Tweaks & Reviews
www.slottweak.com

by **Larr** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 02:58:31

I was going to bring this up...

The annoyance factor of the Pull has increased in N2003.

We all know why it happens. I have no argument with that. But it seems to
be _fighting_ with the force-feedback now. It did not do this in NR2002.
In NR2002 the pull was there, and the wheel was off-center, but it didn't
fight with the FF of the wheel like it does now.

I still say not all controllers are alike, and we deserve a Trim Tab :)

Larry

by **frederickso** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 03:08:45

As far as damage goes, does anyone know if the damage model will be
simplified in multiplayer like in 2002 ? I thought that was everyone's main
problem with it.

by **Steve Blankenshi** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 03:10:10

Most likely a function of the new tire model, and you can make it less
annoying by simply holding the wheel a bit left of center when you calibrate
it. I won't tell... ;-)

SB

(don't forget to reset it for roadies, of course!)

> I was going to bring this up...

> The annoyance factor of the Pull has increased in N2003.

> We all know why it happens. I have no argument with that. But it seems
to
> be _fighting_ with the force-feedback now. It did not do this in NR2002.
> In NR2002 the pull was there, and the wheel was off-center, but it didn't
> fight with the FF of the wheel like it does now.

> I still say not all controllers are alike, and we deserve a Trim Tab :)

> Larry

> > Try it with FF and either the fast or Jasper setup. Hang on to that
> wheel!
> > There is even more of a pull than before, but once you get used to it
you
> > can almost just shift your hands to a comfortable position with the
wheel
> >***ed to the right and leave it there, steering entirely with your
right
> > foot. Interesting. What lap times are you getting at Michigan in a
test
> > session? Best I could manage in the 15 minutes or so that I had
available
> > was 39.4 sec. That's about 2 sec off the lap record, but I would think
> the
> > lap record was probably set in the draft, so I don't know if my time is
> good
> > for a test session or not.

by **GTX_SlotCa** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 05:42:09

I know what you mean. I haven't spent much time on it yet, but it seemed
worse at 'dega than michigan. Did you notice that? I thought it might just
be the default setup. It also seemed to fight the FF more at the bottom of
the track, like it would pull to the inside. Well, maybe I'm mistaken and
just need more time on it. Changing the FF latency didn't help at all.

--
Slot

Tweaks & Reviews
www.slottweak.com

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by **Larr** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 06:33:22

Yep.

At dega, on the pace lap, you are in a banked left turn and you have to
crank the wheel to the right and hold on to it to go in a straight line
around the corner. It feels totally weird.

Larry

by **Mitch_** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:29:38

I feel the same way Larry. In fact my entire NR6 FFB has left a sour taste
in my mouth. Ive tried about every setting I could find but each feels ways
off. GTR2002 feels very nice with FFB but Nr6 feels like the thing is
exactly backwards..

Mitch

> I was going to bring this up...

> The annoyance factor of the Pull has increased in N2003.

> We all know why it happens. I have no argument with that. But it seems
to
> be _fighting_ with the force-feedback now. It did not do this in NR2002.
> In NR2002 the pull was there, and the wheel was off-center, but it didn't
> fight with the FF of the wheel like it does now.

> I still say not all controllers are alike, and we deserve a Trim Tab :)

> Larry

> > Try it with FF and either the fast or Jasper setup. Hang on to that
> wheel!
> > There is even more of a pull than before, but once you get used to it
you
> > can almost just shift your hands to a comfortable position with the
wheel
> >***ed to the right and leave it there, steering entirely with your
right
> > foot. Interesting. What lap times are you getting at Michigan in a
test
> > session? Best I could manage in the 15 minutes or so that I had
available
> > was 39.4 sec. That's about 2 sec off the lap record, but I would think
> the
> > lap record was probably set in the draft, so I don't know if my time is
> good
> > for a test session or not.

by **Jason Moy** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 11:57:49

[snip]

Something else I just noticed that may be worth testing. It looks
like they may have attempted to fix the black flag that came out if
you crashed into the pits. Kinda tough to test but I just slid
through the pits sideways during an incident and didn't receive a
penalty even though I was spinning at 100mph through the entrance to
the pits.

Jason

by **Jason Moy** » Fri, 24 Jan 2003 12:01:17

[snip]

Another damage observation: Hit the wall at about 100 at tally, had
to have the hood ripped off and some engine work done, couldn't top
145 even in a draft aftwerwards.

Fooking yay.

Jason

by **Eldre** » Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:04:13

>We all know why it happens. I have no argument with that. But it seems to
>be _fighting_ with the force-feedback now. It did not do this in NR2002.
>In NR2002 the pull was there, and the wheel was off-center, but it didn't
>fight with the FF of the wheel like it does now.

Ha...ha! Now you get to fight with it like us non-FF equipped drivers do...<g>

Well...I wonder how that would***up the driving model if you had to take
evasive action? Now you wouldn't be able to turn the wheel fully to one side,
and have the same effect on the car.
Of course, there's no real way to test it, but I'm curious...

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPLRank:-0.381
N2002 Rank:+17.59

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Steve Blankenshi** » Fri, 31 Jan 2003 00:33:44

> >We all know why it happens. I have no argument with that. But it seems
to
> >be _fighting_ with the force-feedback now. It did not do this in NR2002.
> >In NR2002 the pull was there, and the wheel was off-center, but it didn't
> >fight with the FF of the wheel like it does now.

> Ha...ha! Now you get to fight with it like us non-FF equipped drivers
do...<g>

> >I still say not all controllers are alike, and we deserve a Trim Tab :)

> Well...I wonder how that would***up the driving model if you had to
take
> evasive action? Now you wouldn't be able to turn the wheel fully to one
side,
> and have the same effect on the car.
> Of course, there's no real way to test it, but I'm curious...

> Eldred

Eldred,

All you have to do with a non-ff wheel to reduce the offset on ovals is to
hold it slightly left of center at the last stage of the calibration routine
in the game. How far left is down to trial and error; and preference, of
course. But it works fine and causes no problems. It'll work in FF wheels
too, but the pull will still be felt. You can do this for pedal travel too
in Papy sims; set the max travel and tip-in points to your heart's desire
during in-game calibration by either not fully compressing the pedals and/or
holding them down a bit at the end to set the minimum. It doesn't affect
other games at all; you just have to remember to re-center your wheel before
doing road courses!

Have fun,

SB

rec.autos.simulators

N2003 Damage

N2003 Damage

N2003 Damage

N2003 Damage

N2003 Damage

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