rec.autos.simulators

by **Alan Coate** » Fri, 14 Jul 2000 04:00:00

IMOLA
1. The first F1 Grand Prix race was14th September 1980
2. The winner was Piquet in a Brabham-Ford
3. The fastest race lap was 1m 36.098 secs (116.399mph)

Right, the questies.
1. is the new GPL Imola track a guestimate of what it might have been (circa
1967) or as it was in 1980?
2. Considering that in 1980 when the cars had benefit of downforce the best
race lap was 1:36 how come Jim Clark (with no downforce) clocks up a 1:31 in
Legends in a 'Novice' race?
3. Can any of you guys (and gals) out there match that?!

My best time (Lotus) is 1:35.98

STILL, IT'S EARLY DAYS, YET AND WE WON'T DIE IN TRYING, LOL!

Alan

by **Toni Lassi** » Fri, 14 Jul 2000 04:00:00

The first F1 race was held April 21st 1963, a non-championship race (they had
plenty of those before the nineties). Guess they needed someplace to practice
during all those months between Kyalami and Monaco ;)

It's a portait of the track layout that existed during the sixties. I don't know
if Dave Noonan had any pictures or videos of the track at the time so can't
speak for the graphical accuracy. See below.

Variante Bassa chicane was added in 1973 and Variante Alta in 1974 so the track
would have definitely been faster in 1967!

Hell no, not while trying desperately to push my GPLRank up (barely out of the
three-figure numbers).

by **rik anthra** » Fri, 14 Jul 2000 04:00:00

2. Considering that in 1980 when the cars had benefit of downforce the best
race lap was 1:36 how come Jim Clark (with no downforce) clocks up a 1:31
inLegends in a 'Novice' race?
3. Can any of you guys (and gals) out there match that?!

My best time (Lotus) is 1:35.98

Been tryin like the***ens, but can only get a 1:34.5 so far.

by **Thomas JS Brow** » Fri, 14 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Bruce,

How many races comprised the Tasman Cup? I saw some footage from the 65
season on speedvision during the winter, and one of the courses looked
like it was a country road and if I remember correctly the cars went
through a railroad crossing in one section. Seems like some of those
tracks would make interesting additions to GPL.

TJSB

> Well, for many of the drivers most of those months (December, January &
> February) allowed them to holiday in the warmer climes of the Antipodes as
> they competed in the Tasman Cup.

> --
> Regards,
> Bruce Kennewell,
> Canberra, Australia.
> ---------------------------

> > On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 16:55:37 +0100, "Alan Coates"

> > >IMOLA
> > >1. The first F1 Grand Prix race was14th September 1980

> > The first F1 race was held April 21st 1963, a non-championship race (they
> had
> > plenty of those before the nineties). Guess they needed someplace to
> practice
> > during all those months between Kyalami and Monaco

by **rik anthra** » Fri, 14 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Well I just found out that you know Huttu has gotten 1:31's in 3 different
chassis already.

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Well, for many of the drivers most of those months (December, January &
February) allowed them to holiday in the warmer climes of the Antipodes as
they competed in the Tasman Cup.

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

> >IMOLA
> >1. The first F1 Grand Prix race was14th September 1980

> The first F1 race was held April 21st 1963, a non-championship race (they
had
> plenty of those before the nineties). Guess they needed someplace to
practice
> during all those months between Kyalami and Monaco

by **Rich** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

If you check out the replays you'll find out how Hutoo:) the guy is ***y
quick and has trail braking in his genes:)....still i can die trying to be 4
seconds slower than he is:)
R

> Well I just found out that you know Huttu has gotten 1:31's in 3 different
> chassis already.

> > 2. Considering that in 1980 when the cars had benefit of downforce the
> best
> > race lap was 1:36 how come Jim Clark (with no downforce) clocks up a
1:31
> > inLegends in a 'Novice' race?
> > 3. Can any of you guys (and gals) out there match that?!

> > My best time (Lotus) is 1:35.98

> > Been tryin like ens, but can only get a 1:34.5 so far.

by **Thomas JS Brow** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Actually it's not trailbraking that makes him fast. He carries a lot of
speed into fast and medium speed corners and uses the steering to induce
a certain amount of understeer at which point he lifts off of the
throttle to allow th car to take a set and then applies throttle as soon
as possible so as not to lose too much speed on corner exit. What makes
this possible in part, is the fact that he seems to prefer using a lot
of clutches in the diff. so as to make the car more stable under
trailing throttle conditions and also he can approach slow corners
relatively fast and then brake hard as using more clutches seems to
reduce the necessary braking distance. It's an interesting approach,
even if it isn't very realistic.

TJSB

> If you check out the replays you'll find out how Hutoo:) the guy is ***y
> quick and has trail braking in his genes:)....still i can die trying to be 4
> seconds slower than he is:)
> R

> > Well I just found out that you know Huttu has gotten 1:31's in 3 different
> > chassis already.

> > > 2. Considering that in 1980 when the cars had benefit of downforce the
> > best
> > > race lap was 1:36 how come Jim Clark (with no downforce) clocks up a
> 1:31
> > > inLegends in a 'Novice' race?
> > > 3. Can any of you guys (and gals) out there match that?!

> > > My best time (Lotus) is 1:35.98

> > > Been tryin like ens, but can only get a 1:34.5 so far.

by **Phil Le** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

You may be interested in this site which has details of the circuits used in
the Tasman series and the possibility of creating them for GPL. The URL is:

http://underworld.fortunecity.com//spaceinvader/115/Maps/ausmaps.html

Cheers

Phil

--
F1 GPL Handicap: +62.32 secs
F2 GPL Handicap: +151.16 secs

St Eldred's Cup: -8.13 secs

http://www.youpies.co.uk

by **Thomas JS Brow** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Thanks for the link, I see that I was correct in thinking there was a
track with a rail-crossing, a true street circit, and 4.5 miles long
with some great high speed straights. Warwick farm looks like a blast as
well. I hope these tracks get the attention they deserve, the Tasman
Series would be a great addition to GPL.

TJSB

by **Greger Hut** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

>> If you check out the replays you'll find out how Hutoo:) the guy is ***y
>> quick and has trail braking in his genes:)....still i can die trying to be 4
>> seconds slower than he is:)

>What makes this possible in part, is the fact that he seems to prefer using a lot
>of clutches in the diff. so as to make the car more stable under
>trailing throttle conditions and also he can approach slow corners
>relatively fast and then brake hard as using more clutches seems to
>reduce the necessary braking distance. It's an interesting approach,
>even if it isn't very realistic.

>TJSB

Actually I don't use a lot of clutches anymore. I used to use 85/45
diff with 4-5 clutches like many others but for a few months I've used
a 45/60+1 diff with the Lotus. With the other cars I've been using
different variations like 45/45, 60/60, 60/45 etc.

In my newest Imola Lotus setup I use a 45/85 diff with 1 clutch. I
moved the brake balance forwards (53%) and this seems to work pretty
well.

- Greger
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Andre Warring** » Sat, 15 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Damn, after reading the former post I thought that finally someone
discovered how you do those amazing laps, and now it turns out to be
untrue!

Andre

by **Bruce Kennewel** » Sun, 16 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Six, seven or eight, Thomas, depending on which year(s)!
Primarily, though there were eight, with four in New Zealand (Pukekohe,
Teretonga, Wigram and Levin....excuse my spelling if the Maori words are
incorrect) and four in Oz (Lakeside, Queensland; Warwick Farm, New South
Wales; Sandown Park, Victoria and Longford, Tasmania).

The circuit you are thinking about is Longford and, for some period photos
of that track and other Australian-related Tasman Cup pix, here's a
link........
http://big.business.8m.com/Retro/Tasman_Cup.htm

--
Regards,
Bruce Kennewell,
Canberra, Australia.
---------------------------

> Bruce,

> How many races comprised the Tasman Cup? I saw some footage from the 65
> season on speedvision during the winter, and one of the courses looked
> like it was a country road and if I remember correctly the cars went
> through a railroad crossing in one section. Seems like some of those
> tracks would make interesting additions to GPL.

> TJSB

> > Well, for many of the drivers most of those months (December, January &
> > February) allowed them to holiday in the warmer climes of the Antipodes
as
> > they competed in the Tasman Cup.

> > --
> > Regards,
> > Bruce Kennewell,
> > Canberra, Australia.
> > ---------------------------

> > > On Thu, 13 Jul 2000 16:55:37 +0100, "Alan Coates"

> > > >IMOLA
> > > >1. The first F1 Grand Prix race was14th September 1980

> > > The first F1 race was held April 21st 1963, a non-championship race
(they
> > had
> > > plenty of those before the nineties). Guess they needed someplace to
> > practice
> > > during all those months between Kyalami and Monaco

by **Thomas JS Brow** » Sun, 16 Jul 2000 04:00:00

As far as some of his other hotlaps are concerned, for instance Mosport
(1:19.30) using a 45/60 with 4 clutches he is using a lot of the locking
force provided by the clutches to great advantage, as well as turning
the steering wheel past the point of adhesion which will do 2 things.
Firstly, it will keep the rear end from losing adhesion and secondly it
will provide a certain amount of braking force (Carrol Smith mentions
this in Drive to Win).

Having just looked at the replay of his Imola lap (using 45/85 1
clutch)going through the tamburello (sp.?) in particular, he is still
diving hard into the corners and inducing understeer by turning the
wheel just past the point of adhesion and also (as far as I could tell)
by shifting down a gear while keeping his foot fairly deep in the
throttle and just a wee bit of trail braking. What I can't quite grasp
is how he is preventing the car from ratcheting during throttle on/off
transition which in my experience is one of the drawbacks to using
45/85. Then again I seem to go out of my way to make things more
difficult for myself than necessary (like 7:1 steering ratio with linear
setting full left with RH typically at or above 3.5 and brake bias set
to %51) but then I'm not out to break any records anyway.

TJSB

by **Leo Landma** » Sun, 16 Jul 2000 04:00:00

For you maybe. I still can't even imagine how you drive these GH2 setups.
The moment I lift the throttle, the car swaps ends!
Wish you'd do a 'conventional' GPL setup for Imola too.

Bye,
Leo

rec.autos.simulators

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola

GPL: Imola