rec.autos.simulators

by **pjgt..** » Mon, 10 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Ok, its got to that time again, first a few years ago it was F1GP2 that
forced me to upgrade (brand new Evesham Vale pc). Then it was GPL (Home
built brand new pc) that forced an upgrade.

Now, with GP3 looming onto the horizon, I'm once more looking at the
best hardware upgrade options.

So, has anyone got any opinions on the best upgrade path? (Obviously,
the pc's *main* use will be on-line and offline ***, mostly driving
sims, TOCA2, GPL, GP2, GP3, Rally Masters, etc)

NB: most previews, etc that I've seen concerning GP3, they appeared to
use 600 based cpu's, so I figure anything around 700/800 should run GP3
pretty good?

I'm thinking of either a Celeron (500a or 533a which apparently can
easily be overclocked to 750/800!) or an Athlon (Duron, which can also
be overclocked?) on a suitable M/B with AGPx4 & UDMA66 & softbios

least 1 ISA slot too, cos my 56k Pace modem is ISA!)

I'm hoping to use my old ATX case, PSU, keyboard, mouse & FDD.

I was also thinking of getting some PC133 memory (min 128, possibly
256Mb) and either a GeForce 2 GTS or Voodoo5 5000 card? (which also can
be overclocked, hehe).

Prolly also need a new hard disk (at least 15Gb and with UDMA66
support). And I may go the whole hog and get a new DVD drive as well!
(***y hell, this is gonna cost me!!!)

Advice, opinions, comments, welcomed......

8-)

*Peter* - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

by **A Thoma** » Mon, 10 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I'm planning to upgrade my system later this year to a Duron . A 650 mhz ,
with the right mobo , can be clocked as high as 950 according to
www.tomshardware.com

I've also got an Isa modem so I'll wait for either the Abit KT7 or the QDI
Kinetiz boards to be released . Both of these boards can unlock the CPU
multiplier . Tests so far confirm that the Duron is very fast for a "value"
chip.

Andrew

> Ok, its got to that time again, first a few years ago it was F1GP2 that
> forced me to upgrade (brand new Evesham Vale pc). Then it was GPL (Home
> built brand new pc) that forced an upgrade.

> Now, with GP3 looming onto the horizon, I'm once more looking at the
> best hardware upgrade options.

> So, has anyone got any opinions on the best upgrade path? (Obviously,
> the pc's *main* use will be on-line and offline ***, mostly driving
> sims, TOCA2, GPL, GP2, GP3, Rally Masters, etc)

> NB: most previews, etc that I've seen concerning GP3, they appeared to
> use 600 based cpu's, so I figure anything around 700/800 should run GP3
> pretty good?

> I'm thinking of either a Celeron (500a or 533a which apparently can
> easily be overclocked to 750/800!) or an Athlon (Duron, which can also
> be overclocked?) on a suitable M/B with AGPx4 & UDMA66 & softbios

> least 1 ISA slot too, cos my 56k Pace modem is ISA!)

> I'm hoping to use my old ATX case, PSU, keyboard, mouse & FDD.

> I was also thinking of getting some PC133 memory (min 128, possibly
> 256Mb) and either a GeForce 2 GTS or Voodoo5 5000 card? (which also can
> be overclocked, hehe).

> Prolly also need a new hard disk (at least 15Gb and with UDMA66
> support). And I may go the whole hog and get a new DVD drive as well!
> (***y hell, this is gonna cost me!!!)

> Advice, opinions, comments, welcomed......

> 8-)

> *Peter* - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

by **Mark Stah** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

do you have a link for more info on mobos that can unlock the CPU
multiplier? this is the first i've heard of it.... thanks

> I'm planning to upgrade my system later this year to a Duron . A 650 mhz ,
> with the right mobo , can be clocked as high as 950 according to
> www.tomshardware.com

> I've also got an Isa modem so I'll wait for either the Abit KT7 or the QDI
> Kinetiz boards to be released . Both of these boards can unlock the CPU
> multiplier . Tests so far confirm that the Duron is very fast for a
"value"
> chip.

> Andrew

> > Ok, its got to that time again, first a few years ago it was F1GP2 that
> > forced me to upgrade (brand new Evesham Vale pc). Then it was GPL (Home
> > built brand new pc) that forced an upgrade.

> > Now, with GP3 looming onto the horizon, I'm once more looking at the
> > best hardware upgrade options.

> > So, has anyone got any opinions on the best upgrade path? (Obviously,
> > the pc's *main* use will be on-line and offline ***, mostly driving
> > sims, TOCA2, GPL, GP2, GP3, Rally Masters, etc)

> > NB: most previews, etc that I've seen concerning GP3, they appeared to
> > use 600 based cpu's, so I figure anything around 700/800 should run GP3
> > pretty good?

> > I'm thinking of either a Celeron (500a or 533a which apparently can
> > easily be overclocked to 750/800!) or an Athlon (Duron, which can also
> > be overclocked?) on a suitable M/B with AGPx4 & UDMA66 & softbios

> > least 1 ISA slot too, cos my 56k Pace modem is ISA!)

> > I'm hoping to use my old ATX case, PSU, keyboard, mouse & FDD.

> > I was also thinking of getting some PC133 memory (min 128, possibly
> > 256Mb) and either a GeForce 2 GTS or Voodoo5 5000 card? (which also can
> > be overclocked, hehe).

> > Prolly also need a new hard disk (at least 15Gb and with UDMA66
> > support). And I may go the whole hog and get a new DVD drive as well!
> > (***y hell, this is gonna cost me!!!)

> > Advice, opinions, comments, welcomed......

> > 8-)

> > *Peter* - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

by **SKur** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I don't see any mention of unlocking the multiplier here. The overclocking they
are referring to is just increasing the bus speed

Martyn_D

> do you have a link for more info on mobos that can unlock the CPU
> multiplier? this is the first i've heard of it.... thanks

> > I'm planning to upgrade my system later this year to a Duron . A 650 mhz ,
> > with the right mobo , can be clocked as high as 950 according to
> > www.tomshardware.com

> > I've also got an Isa modem so I'll wait for either the Abit KT7 or the QDI
> > Kinetiz boards to be released . Both of these boards can unlock the CPU
> > multiplier . Tests so far confirm that the Duron is very fast for a
> "value"
> > chip.

> > Andrew

> > > Ok, its got to that time again, first a few years ago it was F1GP2 that
> > > forced me to upgrade (brand new Evesham Vale pc). Then it was GPL (Home
> > > built brand new pc) that forced an upgrade.

> > > Now, with GP3 looming onto the horizon, I'm once more looking at the
> > > best hardware upgrade options.

> > > So, has anyone got any opinions on the best upgrade path? (Obviously,
> > > the pc's *main* use will be on-line and offline ***, mostly driving
> > > sims, TOCA2, GPL, GP2, GP3, Rally Masters, etc)

> > > NB: most previews, etc that I've seen concerning GP3, they appeared to
> > > use 600 based cpu's, so I figure anything around 700/800 should run GP3
> > > pretty good?

> > > I'm thinking of either a Celeron (500a or 533a which apparently can
> > > easily be overclocked to 750/800!) or an Athlon (Duron, which can also
> > > be overclocked?) on a suitable M/B with AGPx4 & UDMA66 & softbios

> > > least 1 ISA slot too, cos my 56k Pace modem is ISA!)

> > > I'm hoping to use my old ATX case, PSU, keyboard, mouse & FDD.

> > > I was also thinking of getting some PC133 memory (min 128, possibly
> > > 256Mb) and either a GeForce 2 GTS or Voodoo5 5000 card? (which also can
> > > be overclocked, hehe).

> > > Prolly also need a new hard disk (at least 15Gb and with UDMA66
> > > support). And I may go the whole hog and get a new DVD drive as well!
> > > (***y hell, this is gonna cost me!!!)

> > > Advice, opinions, comments, welcomed......

> > > 8-)

> > > *Peter* - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

by **Larr** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Buy what you need now, and for the future. If it over-clocks,
that's a bonus.

That's the _proper_ way to look at this.

Overclocking isn't guaranteed. It's not a 'right'. You
typically only hear about the success stories, with the failures
buried away.

The Athlon Platform is cheaper than the Intel, but the Intel is
(RAMBUS/i820 fiasco aside) more reliable and requires less
fiddling.

I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
***.

-Larry

-----------------------------------------------------------

Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Uncle Feste** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

> I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
> ***.

Really? Have I been missing something? I'll be moving up soon to
either a PIII700 or 750, depending where the prices go. But I've used
first a C300, and now a Celeron 466, and haven't had any complaints with
it. Just curious how you come about the conclusion you do.

--
Chuck Kandler
GPL F1 Handicap of +210.00 as of 6/15
GPL F3 Handicap of +438.42 as of 6/21
K&S Racing
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Registered Linux User #180746
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **SKur** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Hmmm i've also been running a heavily clocked celery for 2 years for 3d
*** and for the most part it competed at par with the p2's
Celery 266 at 448 mhz v p2 450

SKurj

> > I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
> > ***.

> Really? Have I been missing something? I'll be moving up soon to
> either a PIII700 or 750, depending where the prices go. But I've used
> first a C300, and now a Celeron 466, and haven't had any complaints with
> it. Just curious how you come about the conclusion you do.

> --
> Chuck Kandler
> GPL F1 Handicap of +210.00 as of 6/15
> GPL F3 Handicap of +438.42 as of 6/21
> K&S Racing
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

> Registered Linux User #180746
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **SKur** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

And.... bang for the buck a celery couldn't be beat back then

Martyn_D
SKurj

> Buy what you need now, and for the future. If it over-clocks,
> that's a bonus.

> That's the _proper_ way to look at this.

> Overclocking isn't guaranteed. It's not a 'right'. You
> typically only hear about the success stories, with the failures
> buried away.

> The Athlon Platform is cheaper than the Intel, but the Intel is
> (RAMBUS/i820 fiasco aside) more reliable and requires less
> fiddling.

> I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
> ***.

> -Larry

> -----------------------------------------------------------

> Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
> Up to 100 minutes free!
> http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Larr** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Because I've been there, and moved beyond it.

Once you upgrade you'll understand.

-Larry

>> I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
>> ***.

>Really? Have I been missing something? I'll be moving up soon
to
>either a PIII700 or 750, depending where the prices go. But
I've used
>first a C300, and now a Celeron 466, and haven't had any
complaints with
>it. Just curious how you come about the conclusion you do.

>--
>Chuck Kandler
>GPL F1 Handicap of +210.00 as of 6/15
>GPL F3 Handicap of +438.42 as of 6/21
>K&S Racing
>http://www.racesimcentral.net/

>Registered Linux User #180746
>http://www.racesimcentral.net/

-----------------------------------------------------------

Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **pjgt..** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

> Buy what you need now, and for the future. If it over-clocks,
> that's a bonus.

> That's the _proper_ way to look at this.

Depends what you want from your system, I want the fastest pc for the
lowest price, not too much to ask is it? hehe.

But, if overclocking is done properly and in moderation it can work
fine. I've overclocked my last three pc's, the last pc, my current
*main* pc was hand built by me, and is overclocked (CPU, M/B and
graphics card) and has worked fine since day one with no probs.
I got the performance of a faster pc for less money. Obviously if you
are gonna overclock, a little research beforehand is well advised!

Hmmm, not so sure about that, based on what info? My old AMD K6 200
(clocked at 225 and faster than a 233) was, and still is, very reliable.
And I hear (from several well known websites such as Anandtech and Toms
Hardware) that the new AMD's are pretty good CPU's.

Well my current main pc (a Celery 300a clocked at 450) has been clocked
since the day I bought it, about 18 months ago? and has never missed a
beat, and saved me loadsa money on a faster CPU. And again, according to
those in the know (the well known overclocking/pc hardware sites) all
say the new Celery's are pretty good value for money. A celeron
running at *800* should run most games/sims pretty good IMHO? You pays
your money and takes your choice.

You are obviously *not* into overclocking, fair enough, no-one is
asking/forcing you to do it if you don't want to. Me personally? If I
know some pc hardware can be made to run faster, thus giving me a faster
pc and saving me money, I'm gonna try it and see. Thats my choice.

8-)

*Peter* - http://www.cix.co.uk/~peterpc/home.html

by **Eldre** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

>Because I've been there, and moved beyond it.

>Once you upgrade you'll understand.

>-Larry

>>> I wouldn't buy a Celeron. No way, no how. Hot for heavy 3D
>>> ***.

>>Really? Have I been missing something? I'll be moving up soon
>to
>>either a PIII700 or 750, depending where the prices go. But
>I've used
>>first a C300, and now a Celeron 466, and haven't had any
>complaints with
>>it. Just curious how you come about the conclusion you do.

So what was your suggestion again? Get the fastest chip out there? Can't
afford it. If I can get something that I can overclock to just as fast as the
fastest, and save some bucks in the process, wouldn't that make sense?

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
GPL hcp. +70.45

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Eldre** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

>And.... bang for the buck a celery couldn't be beat back then

>Martyn_D
>SKurj

Or now, from what others have said...

Eldred
--
Tiger Stadium R.I.P. 1912-1999
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL hcp. +70.45

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Jenera** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I've recently upgraded to a Celeron 566(850) from my Celeron 300a(450) and I
couldn't be happier. For less than $140US, I have a quick CPU running in my
"old" ASUS P2B board. I bought a Slocket adapter, set the voltage to 1.8v,
added some thermal compound(VERY IMPORTANT!!! It would not work without
thermal compound!) and a Golden Orb fan. Now that's a nice bargain for a
400Mhz boost over my 300a/450. This way I didn't have to buy a new board and
new RAM! Although, I did pick up a GeForce 2 GTS card to replace my aging
Voodoo2.
I hope this upgrade is better than the one I bought before GP2 came out! At
the time, I bought a Pentium Pro 200(oc233) and a Matrox Millenium in hope
of getting a great frame rate. I was a little disappointed. Actually, only
with my 850 have I now been able to run Monaco with all details (sky was
always the killer) and get 70-80% occupancy on the first turn. I have a
funny feeling GP3 will run better in software mode than GP2. : )

Bring on GP3!!

Michael M

by **A Thoma** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

It seems from today's news that AMD have just moved the goalposts again .
The original item on tomshardware had both 650mhz and 700mhz chips clock to
950mhz without difficulty .

AMD originally issued some unlocked cpu's for evaluation according to
www.aceshardware.com but have subsequently locked them . I can only hope
that someone comes up with some kind of workaround .

Even a Duron clocked by 10% via FSB is still going to be very potent for
racing sims .

Keeping my ear to the ground

Andrew

> do you have a link for more info on mobos that can unlock the CPU
> multiplier? this is the first i've heard of it.... thanks

> > I'm planning to upgrade my system later this year to a Duron . A 650 mhz
,
> > with the right mobo , can be clocked as high as 950 according to
> > www.tomshardware.com

> > I've also got an Isa modem so I'll wait for either the Abit KT7 or the
QDI
> > Kinetiz boards to be released . Both of these boards can unlock the CPU
> > multiplier . Tests so far confirm that the Duron is very fast for a
> "value"
> > chip.

> > Andrew

> > > Ok, its got to that time again, first a few years ago it was F1GP2
that
> > > forced me to upgrade (brand new Evesham Vale pc). Then it was GPL
(Home
> > > built brand new pc) that forced an upgrade.

> > > Now, with GP3 looming onto the horizon, I'm once more looking at the
> > > best hardware upgrade options.

> > > So, has anyone got any opinions on the best upgrade path? (Obviously,
> > > the pc's *main* use will be on-line and offline ***, mostly driving
> > > sims, TOCA2, GPL, GP2, GP3, Rally Masters, etc)

> > > NB: most previews, etc that I've seen concerning GP3, they appeared to
> > > use 600 based cpu's, so I figure anything around 700/800 should run
GP3
> > > pretty good?

> > > I'm thinking of either a Celeron (500a or 533a which apparently can
> > > easily be overclocked to 750/800!) or an Athlon (Duron, which can also
> > > be overclocked?) on a suitable M/B with AGPx4 & UDMA66 & softbios

> > > least 1 ISA slot too, cos my 56k Pace modem is ISA!)

> > > I'm hoping to use my old ATX case, PSU, keyboard, mouse & FDD.

> > > I was also thinking of getting some PC133 memory (min 128, possibly
> > > 256Mb) and either a GeForce 2 GTS or Voodoo5 5000 card? (which also
can
> > > be overclocked, hehe).

> > > Prolly also need a new hard disk (at least 15Gb and with UDMA66
> > > support). And I may go the whole hog and get a new DVD drive as well!
> > > (***y hell, this is gonna cost me!!!)

> > > Advice, opinions, comments, welcomed......

> > > 8-)

> > > *Peter* - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~peterpc/home.html

by **Larr** » Tue, 11 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Cmon, man. I never said that :)

The AMD Thunderbird 800 is $259.

-Larry

-----------------------------------------------------------

Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
Up to 100 minutes free!
http://www.keen.com

rec.autos.simulators

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)

GP3 forcing an upgrade (again)