rec.autos.simulators

Thanks..

Dave C.

Anyway that's just my opinion, hopefully you can manage to filter the facts
from the opinions here on r.a.s and get a good enough idea to make up your
own mind. :)

This was my post:
If you want to race a modern F1 car online with real people F1-2K is
well worth checking out (I love it) though I dont think "overall" offline
gameplay is going to impress you that much if you hated GP3. . .
If you tell me what dissipointed you in GP3 I can give you some info on
how F1-2K will compare. The main things I dont like about F1-2K are the
AI (they crash themselves out of the race too often) and the un-realistic
amount of grip you get on grass/curbs. These flaws can be fixed to some
extent with patches/add-ons and what you are left with is a sim that (IMO)
is a little better "overall" than GP3. Then again, if online play is very
important
to you then I think it would be safe to say that F1-2K blows away GP3 ;).
By the same token, the weather effects in GP3 are so good that some
people will like GP3 much more than F1-2K for that reason alone. For me,
the F1-2K car seems to drive ("feel") more like a real car, F1-2K sound(s)
are WAY better than GP3`s sound ;) and I think this adds up to make being
at an event in F1-2K a little more realistic feeling, and fun (IMO).

Lorne
Uses and likes both GP3 and F1-2K but is hoping for more from future
F1 sim`s.
-----------------------

Marc.

The poster who started this thread brings up many differences
between the two sims and I think you`ll find it very interesting.

Lorne

Dont cancel your order. I received my copy the other day and had a
drive last night.
I started the first qual session and it was raining hard but with the
weather clearing.
Now to put you into the picture, I'm pretty useless in the dry let
alone the wet.
Anyway went out for a few exploritory laps and noticed a dry line
forming. Went for a quick lap and spun out easily.
Came back into the pits and waited. 15 minutes to go and I put on some
intermediates. (had to beat 1:36 for pole at montreal)
Went out and the time started coming down, 2 minutes to go and went
for the quick final lap. I was definately in the groove, you know when
the corners feel great and I was on the edge with a damp track in
parts.I did a 1:36:?? so thought I was good for a high position.
Back in pits and when the tv monitor was put in place I had no time of
--:--:--

Result was my quick lap was also my 13th lap. Sod it but boy, did I
immerse myself in that for a while.

Dave

On Wed, 02 Aug 2000 00:47:06 GMT, "David Ciemny"

The AI in GP3 are a big step up over those in F1 2000 although there are
those who seem to have had problems with them that I have not so this is
really something that you would have to see for yourself. I have had some
great battles in the short time this sim has been out and love the way the
AI do not just give up the line and keep coming back at you once you have
got past. One of the things that I feel has improved over GP2 is this
battling aspect as I always felt that once you were past the AI in GP2 it
wasn't too much of a problem to get away from them whereas in GP3 I am
finding that they will keep pressuring you for far longer.

The graphics are something that again have brought forth mixed opinions but
having played the 2 sims one after the other a couple of nights ago I have
to say that GP3 comes out well ahead in this area for me.

Sounds.. lack of sounds from the other cars is a miss for GP3 although many
will say that this is realistic as you probably can't hear them in real
life whilst in the car... personally I would have liked to see them included
as it adds a lot to the atmosphere of the races (if you've played
GPL you will know what I mean.. hearing the other cars coming up behind you
certainly adds another dimension to the occassion). I think that the sounds
we do have have improved big time over GP2 and actually prefer them to those
in F1 2000.

Weather.. a big hit to be sure. Adds massively to the strategy element of
the sim and is very well done IMHO. Different conditions around the track
make pit stop decisions vital to the outcome of the race.. the real race at
Hockenheim last weekend and the way the weather effected the outcome was
almost like an advert for the weather feature in GP3.... FANTASTIC!!!

Garage.. Not much has changed from what we have had before and although this
is no bad thing in many ways the inclusion of camber and tyre pressure
settings really ought to have made it into this release. I would also have
liked to see the possibility of some in-car adjustments such as brake
balance, fuel mixture, etc as these were around in IndyCar 1 if I remember
correctly and would definately be a big plus.. maybe next time. The
telemetry options have not changed but they were already pretty
comprehensive.. just needed the addition of tyre temperatures really, which
ties in with the camber and tyre pressure settings we should have had.

Replays.. this is a real big letdown for me in GP3. No real replay system to
speak of :O( There is just a 15-20 second replay that you can access by
pausing the game and pressing the 'R' key.. but apart from the camera views
you have absolutely no control over the replay, no rewind, fast-forward,
save, etc. It has very limited use really as invariably when you want to
replay a pass you have just made or something by the time you have got to a
part of the track where you can pause the game without giving yourself
problems on the restart it is too late.. you press the 'R' key and the
action you view is just past where the bit you wanted to see
occured...argh!!! When so many sims have really good replay systems this was
a major
disappointment. You do get the chance to save hotlaps however, during your
practice sessions or races you can save individual complete laps for
viewing later on... again no controls othere than the camera views though.
Also, you can't save the first lap of any race unfortunately...

At the moment there is a problem getting GP3 to work with split axis pedals,
Hasbro are aware of this and although a patch has been mentioned
there has been no mention of when this will be released.

Haven't tried multiplayer yet so can't comment on that other than to say
that from what I have read in other posts and forums it is not particularly
good at the moment.

IMO GP3 is the best of the 'modern' F1 sims and well worth the purchase.

PH

The replay problem, the slomo problem and the multiplayer problems are all a
consequence of the design of the game engine and will require a major
rewrite to fix or improve.  Replays are actually recorded player input that
is reprocessed when played back. Therefor there is no rewind or jumping
through the replay. Even the frame rate is fixed, replaying on a faster
machine will not give a better frame rate since the physics would be
"speeded up". Fast forward would be possible if the machines PO allows it,
which is one of the things GP2Lap can do for GP2 (pressing f while replaying
toggles the feature).

I think the cause of this behaviour is that in GP2/3 the graphics rendering
is completely integrated in the physics engine. So it cannot replay graphics
without calculating physics again, it cannot drop frames because it would
mean leaving out physics calculations at the same time, and all machines in
a multiplayer configuration need to run at the same frame rate to keep the
physics in sync. Lot of work for the programmers to change this, if they
ever will ...

Btw, on the upside the replay consisting of recorded player input ensures
that the lap was driven on the same track layout that is it replayed on. If
not, the replay will end off track.

Bart Westra