rec.autos.simulators

by **mark jeangerar** » Sun, 21 Oct 2001 16:57:44

I will be upgrading my core rig in a month or so and want to make sure I
don't get anything contrary to my main goal, sim racing. I will get a new
case, MB, chip, ram, sound card, and maybe a modem. My chip will be an AMD
Athlon T-Bird 1.4Ghz and I will continue to use my V5agp until it stinks. So
I need to know a few things that only the experience of this group can
answer:

Mother Board - the guy at the store says the Asus and Abit are good. What is
the trick Athlon counterpart? I'm fairly conservative with my computers,
I've no problem sacrificing a little performance for stability.

Ram - I noticed they put a lot of letters in front of RAM now, what's the
correct ram for ***? Is 256 necessary, or will 128 be fine?

Sound card - SB Live? I've heard problems.... anything else that works on
everything?

My modem is ISA. I thought I read somewhere that PCI modems are less
reliable in a race connection. Is there any truth to that, or am I making
shit up in my head? I need to know if I should get an ISA slot on my MB.

Finally, I really do not want to reinstall, repatch, and reextragoody all my
software. Is it possible to simply uninstall the hardware in window98 before
powering down?

TIA

--

"Racing! - Science for the action minded."

mark

by **Tony Rickar** » Sun, 21 Oct 2001 17:55:27

> I will be upgrading my core rig in a month or so and want to make sure I
> don't get anything contrary to my main goal, sim racing. I will get a new
> case, MB, chip, ram, sound card, and maybe a modem. My chip will be an AMD
> Athlon T-Bird 1.4Ghz and I will continue to use my V5agp until it stinks.
So
> I need to know a few things that only the experience of this group can
> answer:

> Mother Board - the guy at the store says the Asus and Abit are good. What
is
> the trick Athlon counterpart? I'm fairly conservative with my computers,
> I've no problem sacrificing a little performance for stability.

I would go for an Asus 266 board, preferably the A7M over A7A for best
performance. There have been some issues with Abit boards regarding
compatibility of late though they are renowned for being good for
overclocking - which I guess you aren't going to do.

Go for 256DDR as it is very cheap now, so simply buy a 256 stick.

If you are going to get a new one I would suggest the SB Audigy. I believe
it addresses the issues of the SB Live.

Not heard that, wasn't it USB modems that had this problem? Hopefully
someone else can confirm that before you decide as ISA slots could restrict
your choice.

I regularly change all those things without reinstalling. It is a good idea
to remove the software components of things you will remove (SB Live, modem)
first then shutdown.

Also copy the new motherboard drivers and the Windows cab files to your hard
disk, you can guarantee the CD drive will be the last thing that works!

Just install the motherboard first, when it has done everything and boots
with all system devices sorted shutdown and add the other cards (Sound &
modem)

The biggest concern when swapping boards is a blue screen on startup
referring to your IDE controller, don't worry. You will then be left with
your HD in MSDOS compatibility mode - there is a simple registry fix for
this. So don't fret!

HTH

Tony

by **JJ Srickli** » Sun, 21 Oct 2001 21:37:19

The most stable AMD solution right now is the Abit KG7 which uses the AMD
chipset.

by **REDLINE42** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 00:37:46

powering down?"

LOL, Yall liss'n here. In Win98? yaaa ask'in fer trouble boy !

Ya reckon?

--
R.I.P. - William Joseph Dunlop OBE MBE 2/25/52 - 7/2/2000

http://www.roadracers.uk.com/legend.htm

by **Andi Col** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 02:46:39

Mark,

Beware of the Voodoo 5, mine only had one notch cut out on the AGP
connector. My latest motherbord had two 'stops' requiring two equivelant
notches. The V5 did not fit! I ended up buying a GF3 though which is great.

Andi.

by **Goy Larse** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 07:39:20

> Mark,

> Beware of the Voodoo 5, mine only had one notch cut out on the AGP
> connector. My latest motherbord had two 'stops' requiring two equivelant
> notches. The V5 did not fit! I ended up buying a GF3 though which is great.

Good call, it does fit in the ASUS A7M266 suggested above though, which
is what I'm using myself

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/

* Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way *
"Spamkiller" http://www.spamkiller.com

by **Goy Larse** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 07:47:34

> Not heard that, wasn't it USB modems that had this problem? Hopefully
> someone else can confirm that before you decide as ISA slots could restrict
> your choice.

Actually, this is true, sort of.....

Most ISA modems of the past were genuine "hardware modems", whereas most
today's PCI modems are "software modems" which adds a little to
stability, performance and latency, which is why they are so dirt cheap

Not sure if there are any DDR based boards with ISA slots anymore
though, so you might end up hunting for a "hardware" PCI modem Mark, and
they tend to be rather pricey

One thought, regular external modems connected to the Com port, are
those still "hardware modems" ?

If so, how do they compare to the internal ISA/PCI modems ?

Also, I know 3Com used to have a "*** Modem", Scott Husted used one
of those, not sure if they still make them, but he claimed they lowered
his latency over his previous modem, but then again, who would trust
Husted......:-)

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy

"The Pits" http://www.racesimcentral.net/

* Spam is for losers who can't get business any other way *
"Spamkiller" http://www.racesimcentral.net/

by **Schoone** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 08:00:06

Audigy has more problems that the SBLive in my opinion. I just got one and
have had nothing but trouble since.

> > I will be upgrading my core rig in a month or so and want to make sure I
> > don't get anything contrary to my main goal, sim racing. I will get a
new
> > case, MB, chip, ram, sound card, and maybe a modem. My chip will be an
AMD
> > Athlon T-Bird 1.4Ghz and I will continue to use my V5agp until it
stinks.
> So
> > I need to know a few things that only the experience of this group can
> > answer:

> > Mother Board - the guy at the store says the Asus and Abit are good.
What
> is
> > the trick Athlon counterpart? I'm fairly conservative with my computers,
> > I've no problem sacrificing a little performance for stability.

> I would go for an Asus 266 board, preferably the A7M over A7A for best
> performance. There have been some issues with Abit boards regarding
> compatibility of late though they are renowned for being good for
> overclocking - which I guess you aren't going to do.

> > Ram - I noticed they put a lot of letters in front of RAM now, what's
the
> > correct ram for ***? Is 256 necessary, or will 128 be fine?

> Go for 256DDR as it is very cheap now, so simply buy a 256 stick.

> > Sound card - SB Live? I've heard problems.... anything else that works
on
> > everything?

> If you are going to get a new one I would suggest the SB Audigy. I believe
> it addresses the issues of the SB Live.

> > My modem is ISA. I thought I read somewhere that PCI modems are less
> > reliable in a race connection. Is there any truth to that, or am I
making
> > shit up in my head? I need to know if I should get an ISA slot on my MB.

> Not heard that, wasn't it USB modems that had this problem? Hopefully
> someone else can confirm that before you decide as ISA slots could
restrict
> your choice.

> > Finally, I really do not want to reinstall, repatch, and reextragoody
all
> my
> > software. Is it possible to simply uninstall the hardware in window98
> before
> > powering down?

> I regularly change all those things without reinstalling. It is a good
idea
> to remove the software components of things you will remove (SB Live,
modem)
> first then shutdown.

> Also copy the new motherboard drivers and the Windows cab files to your
hard
> disk, you can guarantee the CD drive will be the last thing that works!

> Just install the motherboard first, when it has done everything and boots
> with all system devices sorted shutdown and add the other cards (Sound &
> modem)

> The biggest concern when swapping boards is a blue screen on startup
> referring to your IDE controller, don't worry. You will then be left with
> your HD in MSDOS compatibility mode - there is a simple registry fix for
> this. So don't fret!

> HTH

> Tony

by **Dave Henri** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 10:28:54

Systems based on the Intel P4 cannot use a 3dfx V5 5500. As Goy says, the
V5 does NOT have the extra notch cut in the connectors. The V4 is a
slightly newer version and IT CAN be used with a P4 although that
combination doesn't strike me as too appealing.
I do not believe there are any problems with a V5 5500 and AMD system
boards.
dave henrie

> Mark,

> Beware of the Voodoo 5, mine only had one notch cut out on the AGP
> connector. My latest motherbord had two 'stops' requiring two equivelant
> notches. The V5 did not fit! I ended up buying a GF3 though which is
great.

> Andi.

> > I will be upgrading my core rig in a month or so and want to make sure I
> > don't get anything contrary to my main goal, sim racing. I will get a
new
> > case, MB, chip, ram, sound card, and maybe a modem. My chip will be an
AMD
> > Athlon T-Bird 1.4Ghz and I will continue to use my V5agp until it
stinks.
> So
> > I need to know a few things that only the experience of this group can
> > answer:

> > Mother Board - the guy at the store says the Asus and Abit are good.
What
> is
> > the trick Athlon counterpart? I'm fairly conservative with my computers,
> > I've no problem sacrificing a little performance for stability.

> > Ram - I noticed they put a lot of letters in front of RAM now, what's
the
> > correct ram for ***? Is 256 necessary, or will 128 be fine?

> > Sound card - SB Live? I've heard problems.... anything else that works
on
> > everything?

> > My modem is ISA. I thought I read somewhere that PCI modems are less
> > reliable in a race connection. Is there any truth to that, or am I
making
> > shit up in my head? I need to know if I should get an ISA slot on my MB.

> > Finally, I really do not want to reinstall, repatch, and reextragoody
all
> my
> > software. Is it possible to simply uninstall the hardware in window98
> before
> > powering down?

> > TIA

> > --

> > "Racing! - Science for the action minded."

> > mark

by **Larr** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:06:02

I just upgraded mine (again - I'm gonna***off Windows XP Yet!). So far,
it's been the most trouble-free non-Intel system I've used to date:

ABIT KG7 (Standard - I don't like on-board RAID).
AMD Athlon XP 1800+ (1.53 Ghz).
VisionTek GeForce 3 Ti500.
512MB of RAM.
Turtle Beach Santa Cruz Sound Card.
Intel In-Business NIC Card.
TDK 16/10/40 CDRW Drive.
Pioneer DVD-113 DVD Drive.
Maxtor DiamondMax Plus 40GB 7200 RPM Hard Drive.
Mitsubishi DiamondPro 2060u 22" Monitor.
Klipsh ProMedia 5.1 Speakers.
Logitech Freedom Pro Optical Wireless Keyboard/Mouse.
Windows XP RC2.

Why I chose certain components:

ABIT KG7 - Uses the AMD 760 North Bridge. Less troublesome than the VIA
North Bridges IMHO. VERY stable motherboard. NOTE - I do not overclock.
Not my thing. Don't see the point these days... The KG7 has fewer
complaints about it than most any recent board, from what I've read on the
newsgroups. Most complaints that are posted are related to the Highpoint
RAID controller on the KG7-RAID. I prefer Add-In cards for my controllers,
so I have the standard KG7.

AMD Athlon XP 1800+ - Why not? :)

TBSC - Most trouble-free sound card I've ever owned. Solid, Stable, RELEASE
WHQL Windows XP drivers. Handles Dolby 5.1 DVD playback like a champ.
Excellent sound quality. Far better card than the SB Live! IMHO. Only
costs $79, and includes PowerDVD 3.0.

Klipsh ProMedia 5.1 Speakers - 500 watts. Best computer speakers available.
Couldn't help myself :)

Mitsubishi DiamondPro 2060u 22" monitor - Again, couldn't help myself :)
Excellent display.

Logitech Freedom Pro Optical Wireless Keyboard/Mouse - Not sure about this
one yet. I like it, and the keyboard has an excellent feel, but I need more
time with the optical/wireless mouse to decide if I really like it.

TDK CDRW - Just plain good performance. Excellent reliablilty. ZERO
coaster count so far.

GeForce 3 Ti500 - Again, why not?

You can knock some components down one notch, save a LOT of money, and not
miss that much. For example, you are fine with the 1.4Ghz Athlon. I had an
Athlon 1.2Ghz before I upgraded to the Athlon XP 1800+. Picked up about 10%
performance increase, and 700 3DMarks in 3DMark2001.

GeForce 3 Ti500 - I had a Hercules GeForce 2 GTS Pro before installing this
card. Yes, the new 'buzz word' features are nice to have, for the future,
and I did pick up about 25% better frame rates in N4, but I remain
unconvinced it was money well spent.

For the money these two upgrades cost me ($550-$600 for Processor (Boxed)
and GeForce Ti500 Card), it wasn't really worth it IMHO. Nice to have it,
but it wasn't really necessary.

If you buy a NIC, stick with an industry-standard 3COM 3C905C-TXM or Intel
Pro/100. Everything and anything works with these, including Linux if you
care to dabble. Stay away from the cheap soho/home user cards. Buy a NIC
you'll keep for years and years.

If you have room for a 22" monitor, I can't recommend them enough. There is
never such a thing as enough screen real-estate. The Sony 520 is actually a
_tiny_ bit better than the Mitsubishi 2060u, but it also costs twice as
much. Performance of the Mitsubishi, at $850, is superb.

A 22" monitor brings a new dimension to N4...

Hope this helps!

-Larry

by **Larr** » Mon, 22 Oct 2001 13:09:39

FWIW, I don't like the idea of 'dirty' motherboard installs. It just isn't
worth the trouble it causes. False Economy...

This is a good time to clean out the rafters. Back up all important
documents, including mail, game settings, car setups, etc...

Install the new hardware. Format the drive, and start from scratch.

Once the basic Operating System, Patches and Drivers are all installed and
working properly, Ghost the system to a CDR using either Ghost or
DriveImage. Now, continue with adding applications, games etc... When all
are installed, Ghost it again as your "Quick Recovery" image.

Now copy your data and settings back.

Yes, it takes more time. However, I think the effort is well worth it and
pays off in stability in the long run.

JMHO :)