rec.autos.simulators

Hi all,

hands up who would like to see NOTHING changed in from GP2 to GP3 except
support for 3dFx and the new '98 season. Really, what needs changing. I say
this because A) any attempt to make it more of s realistic simulation will
fail because without actually feeling the inertia etc we can never have a
game "realistic". In other words ANY driving game is going to be arcade like
to some extent - it has to be. Look at CPR, maybe the driving model is
accurate, and even the vibrations etc, but without being able to actually
feel the car about to break traction I say it's TOO realistic. GP2, I think
is a perfect balance. And B) any attempt to concentrate too much on the
graphic and make it like Andretti Racing would suck. AR is graphicaly
supurb, and fun to play so long as you accept it as being an arcade game.

So to the GP3 developers, PLEASE don't change too much - just fix up the
graphics and stats.

Thanks

  So you don't want a multiplayer setup??  Hotlaps are cool, but...getting a
whole pak of dedicated human drivers dicing it out...man how can you beat that??

(of course you also run the risk of getting a bunch of Destruction Derby
morons..)
dave henrie

I agree that they shouldn't change very much.

Big things:
1. Most of all, _keep_ the idea of simulating "on the limit"-driving with tyre
squeling. This is sadly missed in F1RS, but will probably show up in F1RS 2 :o).

2. 3Dfx support, but dont overdo it. Not to much, not to little.
3. Multiplayer of course, so we can start up those indoor sim racing places
:o))).
4. Get ride of the possibility of driving in slow motion.
5. Internet support. I have an idea how over 20 human players should be able to
race online over internet, without having to wait for any new version of the IP
(Internet Protocol).
6. '97 season is enough for me. Fast cars, fast tyres :o))). Dont know if there
will be any track records in 98?
7. Rain, would be nice, but I dont know what all the fuzz is about this. I dont
think the real drivers just hoping for rain in every race.
8. A Super Ace level, where we, who are incredibly fast :o), wont outlap the
field by 2 to 4 secs per lap.
9. Hotlap and game checker, to view what grip, BHP, tyre compound, car setup and
such has been used. Would make it almost impossible to cheat.
10. Camber, castor, tyre temp, better setup simulation. Unfortenately we drive
very fast with all dampers on zero, and ARB's very low.

Little things:
10. In qualifying, driving out of the garage, just for the feeling :o).
11. Warmup lap, where you have the possibility to warm up your tyres or spin off
before the race.

/Christer Andersson, without any helps or aids at all in GP2 and never above
100% processor occupancy - http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2922/

% hands up who would like to see NOTHING changed in from GP2 to GP3 except
% support for 3dFx and the new '98 season. Really, what needs changing. I say
% this because A) any attempt to make it more of s realistic simulation will
% fail because without actually feeling the inertia etc we can never have a
% game "realistic". In other words ANY driving game is going to be arcade like
% to some extent - it has to be. Look at CPR, maybe the driving model is
% accurate, and even the vibrations etc, but without being able to actually
% feel the car about to break traction I say it's TOO realistic. GP2, I think
% is a perfect balance. And B) any attempt to concentrate too much on the
% graphic and make it like Andretti Racing would suck. AR is graphicaly
% supurb, and fun to play so long as you accept it as being an arcade game.

My hands are down.  Work on variable weather.  Create realistic pit
stops (i.e., don't rebuild a wrecked car in the same amount of time it
takes to do a regular pit stop).  Fix modem hook-up.  Add multiplayer
over the IPX & Internet.  Work on the driving model, even with all help
turned off GP2 didn't quite capture driving on the edge.  Work on the AI
(good, but still needs some improvement).  Work on the curbs and the
gravel pits.  Realistic penalities for rule violations.  When going up
or down in elevation, give us gravity.  Find someone who knows how to
create a working graphical engine that doesn't violate the 4th
dimension.  Stop cars that sit in the pits for extended amounts of time
from floating up into space (not a game killer, but certainly a bug).

From your short list all you want is version 2.01, I would like to see
a version 3.0.
% So to the GP3 developers, PLEASE don't change too much - just fix up the
% graphics and stats.

% Thanks

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Vital:
3dfx support -  better graphic performance
better Artificial Intelligence (more than just horsepower and grip)
97 upgrade (circuits, cars, rules, no friday qual)

wanted:
real warming uplap with possible jump start (result: black flag)
real black flag (5 sec penalty)
better interface for reloading saved games (shortcuts)
rain situation
more sounds (other cars!)

Black flags for driving into other cars deliberately

Also, if the player has damage turned off, computer cars should also be
indestructable, like in F1RS

I hope you've driven a real racing car to make that statement. I personally
haven't driven anything faster than a normal car and an indoor kart when I started
to drive GP2 without any helps or aids at all, of course. It's important to turn
off opposite lock help, many forget this help on, and then make statements on the
driving model. My experience from the start was that I could feel the car very
well. After driving GP2 without helps and aids for about 500 hours I for the first
time sat down in a Formula Ford at a track here in Sweden. I was not surprised by
anything this race car did. I was prepared thanks to GP2. I missed my buttons on
the wheel for gear changes, though :o). Trailbraking I had no trouble with in the
Formula Ford. I could control the car with brake and throttle as I control the car
in GP2. At the end of the day I was really pushing the car and was sliding the
rear end in practically every corner, but it was much easier to catch than in GP2.
Well, sliding the rear in every corner doesn't make any good times, so the last
laps I drove with a little bit more controll and set the four fastest laps on the
track that day in a five lap session :o). I was 2.4 sec faster than the second
fastest. The track has many corners and is said to be technical.

So, what's your experience :o)?

/Christer Andersson, one of the fastest GP2 no helps and no aids driver in the
world :o)?
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/2922/

Well, I certainly agree that GP2 is a fantastic effort that I enjoy
thoroughly, but I would change a lot of things! However, I would happily
sacrifce any graphic improvement for greater simulation reality. I would
like to see more finely tuned AI: they should re-act accordingly to
random situations (weather!); shaking fists and waves from the***pit;
teamwork. Also, REAL black flags, and other flags.. blue etc. Overall,
here are a lot of subtle things that could improve the realism

Simon

One more thing that no one has mentioned yet:

Camber on the tracks, rather than just elevation changes.

--
Ian Rae, Motorola GSM Products Division,         | Tel: +44 1793 565159
16 Euro Way, Blagrove, Swindon, England, SN5 8YQ.| Fax: +44 1793 541228

good point and also the thing I love most about CPR is the bumps in the
tracks and going back to GP2 it (to me anyway)seems to be the only thing
drastically missing. Look at the helmet of any driver at any track and you
will notice how bumpy it is.

How about having a "CAREER" mode. Imagine getting into, and committing to, an
entire career of F1 racing. Every race finish has an effect on your future with
a particular team. Challange the players to set themselves up with the right
equiptment and people to eventually win the championship. It would be kinda like
merging GPManager (whose ideas were excellent but came out all wrong) and GP2.

Any one ever try Formula One World Championship-Beyond the Limit for the
Sega CD?  This has been done before.  Great idea, bad execution.

That just serves to highlight the differing expectations of people.
Only last night I was sitting thinking through all the things I did
and didn't like about CPR overall, and that was one feature I
concluded was a complete waste of time, money and programming hours!

Working out and writing down exactly what the should say, paying him
to say all the phrases, writing the interface, adding all the sounds
into the game - would that same time and money have allowed the game
to be shipped in better condition? I'd rather have cut that procedure
after the first stage and just printed all the phrases in the
appropriate section of the manual. Would have saved on hard disk space
too.

Nothing against your own opinion, and if the majority disagree with me
then I must accept I'm wrong at least from a marketing standpoint, but
I thought it a bit of a waste of time. The race engineer had potential
though, that's something that would really help those who don't know
their third spring from the third Stooge.

Cheers!
John

So, is there a real manual in the released product?

l8er
ronny

--
          |\      _,,,---,,_        I want to die like my Grandfather,
   ZZZzz /,`.-'`'    -.  ;-;;,_              in his sleep.
        |,4-  ) )-,_. ,\ (  `'-'     Not like the people in his car,
       '---''(_/--'  `-'\_)            screaming their heads off!