rec.autos.simulators

The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but to
try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead of
accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>

I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and loopholes.

On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.

I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use them,
because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
into arcade 'beat the game' playing.

Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits and
loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they can
report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.

Achim

the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

pez

He is an old guy, that has been around since N1, and has a reputation of being a sneaky player looking for holes, and exploiting them to his advantage.  As he just showed.  He has also been accused of cheating on N2.  

  who is Don Wilshe? old skool gpler? new skool n2003er?

  the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
  sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
  the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

  pez

  > The honourable thing would be to not pester people bound by NDAs to give
  you
  > information they can't give you.
  >
  > The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but
  to
  > try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
  > that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead
  of
  > accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>
  >
  > I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and
  loopholes.
  >
  > On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
  > loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
  > not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
  > loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.
  >
  > I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
  > later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use
  them,
  > because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
  > honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
  > into arcade 'beat the game' playing.
  >
  > Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits
  and
  > loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they
  can
  > report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.
  >
  > Achim
  >
  >
  >


  > > Beta Testers!
  > >
  > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
  us
  > > regular racers what are the
  > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
  > race
  > > with us and you have
  > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
  > priviledged
  > > information, but that
  > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
  > > phyics holes and coding
  > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
  havent
  > to
  > > date shared it with
  > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
  its
  > > not fair if you know of
  > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
  exploited
  > > until the end of
  > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
  >
  >

KK.. get real.. you have been accused of cheating on all nascar releases.. do you believe your
accusers. lol

Don

  He is an old guy, that has been around since N1, and has a reputation of being a sneaky player looking for holes, and exploiting them to his advantage.  As he just showed.  He has also been accused of cheating on N2.  

    who is Don Wilshe? old skool gpler? new skool n2003er?

    the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
    sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
    the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

    pez

    > The honourable thing would be to not pester people bound by NDAs to give
    you
    > information they can't give you.
    >
    > The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but
    to
    > try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
    > that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead
    of
    > accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>
    >
    > I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and
    loopholes.
    >
    > On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
    > loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
    > not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
    > loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.
    >
    > I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
    > later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use
    them,
    > because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
    > honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
    > into arcade 'beat the game' playing.
    >
    > Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits
    and
    > loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they
    can
    > report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.
    >
    > Achim
    >
    >
    >


    > > Beta Testers!
    > >
    > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
    us
    > > regular racers what are the
    > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
    > race
    > > with us and you have
    > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
    > priviledged
    > > information, but that
    > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
    > > phyics holes and coding
    > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
    havent
    > to
    > > date shared it with
    > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
    its
    > > not fair if you know of
    > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
    exploited
    > > until the end of
    > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
    >
    >

But no, Don is neither, he's been around since before N1, and he was
complaining back then too :-)

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"

http://www.theuspits.com

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--

It's a ***ing game Don.  It's not national security.  Get a grip!

  Its not very reassuring to know that Papyrus doesnt know about these flaws in the game.

  You really think Papyrus is  gonna tell the truth.

  You expect us regular guys to believe that 30 beta testers get together and dont discount problems and solutions.

  Hear, See and Say no evil about this game..  

  hehe

  DW  

    Actually Don, I've been in contact with many of them, and they didn't know about these flaws.  You think they would say "Hey if I leave this in I could have an advantage..."  Wrong.  And you wanting to KNOW about these flaws is just childish and frankly lame.  I mean cmon, think about what you just said.  I always knew you were about exploiting things, but man you sure showed it with this one.

    Kevin

If you wouldn't alienate everyone with the *** theories you may still be in the "network of knowledge".   Stop being such a whiner, I have the same question as Kevin,  How old are you?  I thought you were knocking on the 50s door but your acting like a 12 year old.

  Nice Speech...

  But I didnt say what you said.. I just said there are people that race with us that have advantages because they
  are beta testers and they know of bugs and flaws in the game.   this knowledge is gained from testing and
  from being part of a network of knowledge..

  dW

    Don what part don't you get?

    For some reason you think there are beta testers that withheld these loopholes for advantages, and you're saying there has to be more and you want dibs on them.  Seriously think about what you're saying.  I have yet to see a Beta tester just blow away the field because of some little trick they know.  And when you say us, please do not include the honest racers out there in your little group.  As of now you are the only one jumping up and down crying for all the loopholes to be told so you can use them against people.  Seriously how old are you?

      Jay.. your right

      its us and them.. them racing against us....

      We should always have an equal chance to win...

      NDA I understand... But how about some leaks.. There are
      non betas that have information...

      laughable.

      Right I have been a beta tester for 10 years just in sim racing..  I think
      i know what kind of informatioin goes on between a large group of
      testers.. ie, visit www.games-advertising.com

      Don

      > In translation this means....  I really really want to know if the
      exploits
      > I've been able to take advantage of are going to be fixed, so I know if
      I'll
      > still maintain my advantage.
      >
      > I realize your chassis dragging setups are near and dear to you, but
      you'll
      > just have to wait and find out like everyone else.  Besides until anything
      > is final, there's no point is disccusing it since it could still change.
      Be
      > a good sport, and wait like everyone else.  As for your comments about the
      > beta testers, you know very well they are all covered with NDA's.  Which
      > means if they want to remain beta testers they can not discuss what may or
      > may not be changed, tweeked, adjusted, fixed, or reworked in anyway.  You
      > can dislike it all you want, but its not going to change.  Besides the
      > claims that beta testers have any tangible advantage is laughable.  I
      guess
      > your just worried they may know of an exploit you havn't found yet.  Most
      of
      > the beta testers I know probably aren't racing in any league your a part
      of,
      > so whats the problem?
      >
      > Jay Taylor
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >


      > > Beta Testers!
      > >
      > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
      us
      > > regular racers what are the
      > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
      > race
      > > with us and you have
      > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
      > priviledged
      > > information, but that
      > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
      > > phyics holes and coding
      > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
      havent
      > to
      > > date shared it with
      > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
      its
      > > not fair if you know of
      > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
      exploited
      > > until the end of
      > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
      > >
      > > Don Wilshe
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >

I have only been accused since N3, and a simple sending of a setup shut them up.  I'd love for you to take a poll on who thinks cheats more, you or I.  I bet I can guess the result.  

  KK.. get real.. you have been accused of cheating on all nascar releases.. do you believe your
  accusers. lol

  Don

    He is an old guy, that has been around since N1, and has a reputation of being a sneaky player looking for holes, and exploiting them to his advantage.  As he just showed.  He has also been accused of cheating on N2.  

      who is Don Wilshe? old skool gpler? new skool n2003er?

      the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
      sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
      the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

      pez

      > The honourable thing would be to not pester people bound by NDAs to give
      you
      > information they can't give you.
      >
      > The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but
      to
      > try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
      > that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead
      of
      > accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>
      >
      > I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and
      loopholes.
      >
      > On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
      > loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
      > not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
      > loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.
      >
      > I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
      > later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use
      them,
      > because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
      > honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
      > into arcade 'beat the game' playing.
      >
      > Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits
      and
      > loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they
      can
      > report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.
      >
      > Achim
      >
      >
      >


      > > Beta Testers!
      > >
      > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
      us
      > > regular racers what are the
      > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
      > race
      > > with us and you have
      > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
      > priviledged
      > > information, but that
      > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
      > > phyics holes and coding
      > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
      havent
      > to
      > > date shared it with
      > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
      its
      > > not fair if you know of
      > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
      exploited
      > > until the end of
      > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
      >
      >

According to my info he's 58ish

  If you wouldn't alienate everyone with the *** theories you may still be in the "network of knowledge".   Stop being such a whiner, I have the same question as Kevin,  How old are you?  I thought you were knocking on the 50s door but your acting like a 12 year old.

    Nice Speech...

    But I didnt say what you said.. I just said there are people that race with us that have advantages because they
    are beta testers and they know of bugs and flaws in the game.   this knowledge is gained from testing and
    from being part of a network of knowledge..

    dW

      Don what part don't you get?

      For some reason you think there are beta testers that withheld these loopholes for advantages, and you're saying there has to be more and you want dibs on them.  Seriously think about what you're saying.  I have yet to see a Beta tester just blow away the field because of some little trick they know.  And when you say us, please do not include the honest racers out there in your little group.  As of now you are the only one jumping up and down crying for all the loopholes to be told so you can use them against people.  Seriously how old are you?

        Jay.. your right

        its us and them.. them racing against us....

        We should always have an equal chance to win...

        NDA I understand... But how about some leaks.. There are
        non betas that have information...

        laughable.

        Right I have been a beta tester for 10 years just in sim racing..  I think
        i know what kind of informatioin goes on between a large group of
        testers.. ie, visit www.games-advertising.com

        Don

        > In translation this means....  I really really want to know if the
        exploits
        > I've been able to take advantage of are going to be fixed, so I know if
        I'll
        > still maintain my advantage.
        >
        > I realize your chassis dragging setups are near and dear to you, but
        you'll
        > just have to wait and find out like everyone else.  Besides until anything
        > is final, there's no point is disccusing it since it could still change.
        Be
        > a good sport, and wait like everyone else.  As for your comments about the
        > beta testers, you know very well they are all covered with NDA's.  Which
        > means if they want to remain beta testers they can not discuss what may or
        > may not be changed, tweeked, adjusted, fixed, or reworked in anyway.  You
        > can dislike it all you want, but its not going to change.  Besides the
        > claims that beta testers have any tangible advantage is laughable.  I
        guess
        > your just worried they may know of an exploit you havn't found yet.  Most
        of
        > the beta testers I know probably aren't racing in any league your a part
        of,
        > so whats the problem?
        >
        > Jay Taylor
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >


        > > Beta Testers!
        > >
        > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
        us
        > > regular racers what are the
        > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
        > race
        > > with us and you have
        > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
        > priviledged
        > > information, but that
        > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
        > > phyics holes and coding
        > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
        havent
        > to
        > > date shared it with
        > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
        its
        > > not fair if you know of
        > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
        exploited
        > > until the end of
        > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
        > >
        > > Don Wilshe
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        >
        >

Beta tester....well, I did a lot of Beta testing for Dave's GPL->N3
converter as I worked on the AI, never heard a single complaint from my
fellow TPTCC racers that I had an unfair advantage

Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"

http://www.theuspits.com

"A man is only as old as the woman he feels........"
--Groucho Marx--

And stole 100s of setups from unknowing racers who only wanted to compete in a fair offline league in the days of N1.

Don's a PEACH!

  He is an old guy, that has been around since N1, and has a reputation of being a sneaky player looking for holes, and exploiting them to his advantage.  As he just showed.  He has also been accused of cheating on N2.  

    who is Don Wilshe? old skool gpler? new skool n2003er?

    the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
    sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
    the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

    pez

    > The honourable thing would be to not pester people bound by NDAs to give
    you
    > information they can't give you.
    >
    > The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but
    to
    > try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
    > that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead
    of
    > accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>
    >
    > I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and
    loopholes.
    >
    > On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
    > loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
    > not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
    > loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.
    >
    > I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
    > later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use
    them,
    > because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
    > honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
    > into arcade 'beat the game' playing.
    >
    > Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits
    and
    > loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they
    can
    > report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.
    >
    > Achim
    >
    >
    >


    > > Beta Testers!
    > >
    > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
    us
    > > regular racers what are the
    > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
    > race
    > > with us and you have
    > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
    > priviledged
    > > information, but that
    > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
    > > phyics holes and coding
    > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
    havent
    > to
    > > date shared it with
    > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
    its
    > > not fair if you know of
    > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
    exploited
    > > until the end of
    > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
    >
    >

There is a difference between being accused and being proven.  You have been proven to cheat and have admitted to stealing from fellow racers.  Until you can mentally tell the difference between the two it would probably best to shut the *** up Don.

  KK.. get real.. you have been accused of cheating on all nascar releases.. do you believe your
  accusers. lol

  Don

    He is an old guy, that has been around since N1, and has a reputation of being a sneaky player looking for holes, and exploiting them to his advantage.  As he just showed.  He has also been accused of cheating on N2.  

      who is Don Wilshe? old skool gpler? new skool n2003er?

      the name rings a bell but i cant associate anything with it (sorry if that
      sounds harsh don, but i see you going on and on about quick guys 'bending'
      the games rules, and it gives all quick guys a bad name).

      pez

      > The honourable thing would be to not pester people bound by NDAs to give
      you
      > information they can't give you.
      >
      > The honourable thing would be to not look for exploits and loopholes, but
      to
      > try and beat your opponents fair and square on the track - and to accept
      > that you're slower than them if you can't beat them on the track, instead
      of
      > accusing them of using exploits and loopholes <g>
      >
      > I can't believe you go public and seriously ask for exploits and
      loopholes.
      >
      > On a side note, I am pretty much convinced beta testers don't know about
      > loopholes and exploits any more than people like you do, usually, at least
      > not through their beta testing activity, because if they'd have found
      > loopholes during the beta phase, they would have gotten fixed.
      >
      > I also am pretty convinced that if beta testers become aware of loopholes
      > later on (things which can only be fixed in a patch) they wouldn't use
      them,
      > because at least Papy's beta testers not only have a certain feeling of
      > honour, they also usually are strictly focussed on realistic racing, not
      > into arcade 'beat the game' playing.
      >
      > Therefor, I wouldn't fear about beta testers beating you using exploits
      and
      > loopholes. Rather, I suggest you share your findings with them, so they
      can
      > report them to Papy and have them fixed in the next patch.
      >
      > Achim
      >
      >
      >


      > > Beta Testers!
      > >
      > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
      us
      > > regular racers what are the
      > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
      > race
      > > with us and you have
      > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
      > priviledged
      > > information, but that
      > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
      > > phyics holes and coding
      > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
      havent
      > to
      > > date shared it with
      > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
      its
      > > not fair if you know of
      > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
      exploited
      > > until the end of
      > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
      >
      >

Cranking old man!

  According to my info he's 58ish

    If you wouldn't alienate everyone with the *** theories you may still be in the "network of knowledge".   Stop being such a whiner, I have the same question as Kevin,  How old are you?  I thought you were knocking on the 50s door but your acting like a 12 year old.

      Nice Speech...

      But I didnt say what you said.. I just said there are people that race with us that have advantages because they
      are beta testers and they know of bugs and flaws in the game.   this knowledge is gained from testing and
      from being part of a network of knowledge..

      dW

        Don what part don't you get?

        For some reason you think there are beta testers that withheld these loopholes for advantages, and you're saying there has to be more and you want dibs on them.  Seriously think about what you're saying.  I have yet to see a Beta tester just blow away the field because of some little trick they know.  And when you say us, please do not include the honest racers out there in your little group.  As of now you are the only one jumping up and down crying for all the loopholes to be told so you can use them against people.  Seriously how old are you?

          Jay.. your right

          its us and them.. them racing against us....

          We should always have an equal chance to win...

          NDA I understand... But how about some leaks.. There are
          non betas that have information...

          laughable.

          Right I have been a beta tester for 10 years just in sim racing..  I think
          i know what kind of informatioin goes on between a large group of
          testers.. ie, visit www.games-advertising.com

          Don

          > In translation this means....  I really really want to know if the
          exploits
          > I've been able to take advantage of are going to be fixed, so I know if
          I'll
          > still maintain my advantage.
          >
          > I realize your chassis dragging setups are near and dear to you, but
          you'll
          > just have to wait and find out like everyone else.  Besides until anything
          > is final, there's no point is disccusing it since it could still change.
          Be
          > a good sport, and wait like everyone else.  As for your comments about the
          > beta testers, you know very well they are all covered with NDA's.  Which
          > means if they want to remain beta testers they can not discuss what may or
          > may not be changed, tweeked, adjusted, fixed, or reworked in anyway.  You
          > can dislike it all you want, but its not going to change.  Besides the
          > claims that beta testers have any tangible advantage is laughable.  I
          guess
          > your just worried they may know of an exploit you havn't found yet.  Most
          of
          > the beta testers I know probably aren't racing in any league your a part
          of,
          > so whats the problem?
          >
          > Jay Taylor
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >


          > > Beta Testers!
          > >
          > > Seem to me it would be the fair, just and honorable thing to do to tell
          us
          > > regular racers what are the
          > > holes in the games, and what will be fixed in the patch..  Many of you
          > race
          > > with us and you have
          > > knowledge that we dont have.  We realize you are fortunate with
          > priviledged
          > > information, but that
          > > doesnt level the playing field.   I have read several posts here of some
          > > phyics holes and coding
          > > problems in the game.   Now you all have this information, but you
          havent
          > to
          > > date shared it with
          > > the regular people!   Its great to be part of a knowledge base.   Buts
          its
          > > not fair if you know of
          > > problems!  Some of these problems will never be fixed and can be
          exploited
          > > until the end of
          > > time..   Please consider!   Need more speed. hehe
          > >
          > > Don Wilshe
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >

I'd like to see this proof. Tell us all about it...and of course show us the proof. :-)

  There is a difference between being accused and being proven.  You have been proven to cheat and have admitted to stealing from fellow racers.  Until you can mentally tell the difference between the two it would probably best to shut the *** up Don.