rec.autos.simulators

by **Andre Warrin** » Fri, 15 Jun 2001 18:55:48

>> >the ff does work OK, it's just that it's not as good as gpl. however, it
>is
>> >better than any other f1 sim - including gp3.

>> I heavily disagree with you, In My Humble Opinion the ff in GP3 is way
>> better. But as you say so yourself, the ff in 3-year old GPL is way
>> better and that is sad.

>It's also sad that GPL doesn't have the best graphics ever in a sim ("way
>better" in detail, complexity and optimization), pitting, tire wear, ghost
>mode, perfect track accuracy, telemetry (although either did the old boys),
>dynamic weather..............

>I don't think GPL even had ff at all three months after it's release.

>David G Fisher

Is it really that hard to understand? It's three years later, ofcourse
these things are much better in F1RC! Nobody will disagree on that.
But back to the point: Why does a 3-year old game have much better ff
and multiplayer?? The ff -addon- (not patch) being released a couple
of months after GPL's release is totally irrelevant.

Andre

by **Andre Warrin** » Fri, 15 Jun 2001 19:00:57

On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 10:00:22 GMT, "Jan Verschueren"

>Absolutely depressing Andre. It's *such* a burden to continu playing GPL
>because nothing surpasses it on all levels.

Ok.. point taken :)

Andre / Still hoping for a current F1 sim equalling GPL's level

by **Thomas Gatschneg** » Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:38:59

> On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 00:46:26 +0200, "Thomas Gatschnegg"

> >Everyone with crappy F1RC-AI, try this AI Update:
> >http://www.f1-star.de/f1rc/f1rctools/KI_Perf_Phys_v_1_3.rar

> >It' s a trial worth, i think, but I don't know, if it works.

> I will, thanks! This update is user-made I assume?

> Andre

Yes, it is user made, i noticed it on the german official Forum. On this
Forum was (and is?) some discussion of this patch. I have tried the patch
only at Melbourne, but i had not the time to make some intensive testing.
It simply comes with a new MechaCar.mfd. The author played 15 days with the
F1RCMaster (in advanced Modus).
But what i dont understand:
1. If it is really so simple to improve the AI -> why didnt Ubisoft give us
a patch for the AI????
2. If there are two versions released, why didnt Ubisoft gives us a patch
for the user with the crappy AI-Version??? If they released a version with
good AI, then they have the solution for the version with the crappy AI.

Its very mystique for me.

Thomas

by **Andre Warrin** » Fri, 15 Jun 2001 20:40:36

On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 13:38:59 +0200, "Thomas Gatschnegg"

>Yes, it is user made, i noticed it on the german official Forum. On this
>Forum was (and is?) some discussion of this patch. I have tried the patch
>only at Melbourne, but i had not the time to make some intensive testing.
>It simply comes with a new MechaCar.mfd. The author played 15 days with the
>F1RCMaster (in advanced Modus).
>But what i dont understand:
>1. If it is really so simple to improve the AI -> why didnt Ubisoft give us
>a patch for the AI????
>2. If there are two versions released, why didnt Ubisoft gives us a patch
>for the user with the crappy AI-Version??? If they released a version with
>good AI, then they have the solution for the version with the crappy AI.

Memory is lacking again, but I remember two versions were released.
Even the version numbers were confusing, they were the same, but the
file sizes were different if I recall correctly.
Anyway, very soon the correct exe file was posted in the high gear
forums. It -did- improve the AI, but it was still way too bad.

But first we had the hassle with two different versions of F1RC, and
still there seems to be a bigtime difference between the quality of
the AI.. Perhaps they were even more different versions released?

Andre

by **ymenar** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 02:18:14

> It's also sad that GPL doesn't have the best graphics ever in a sim ("way
> better" in detail, complexity and optimization), pitting, tire wear, ghost
> mode, perfect track accuracy, telemetry (although either did the old
boys),
> dynamic weather..............

GPL release year : 1998.
F1RC release year : 2001.

Btw, F1RC doesn't have perfect track accuracy.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- May the Downforce be with you...
-- http://www.ymenard.com/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimato Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...

by **Iain Mackenzi** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 03:47:19

oh here we go again. i don't really know why i bother with you, but i find
it compulsive!
To repeat yet again, what i (and many others in other forums as well as ras)
said about f12k and f1rc is that a LOT of the problems people encounter with
the ai are related to their driving ability. (Note use of english here, a
LOT does not mean all - look them up if you're in doubt.)
The ai in some sims, is dumbed down and made to be much less precise and
aggressive than it should be. Try braking hard in f1cs on a straight and
you'll see all the ai cars finding a way round you. Try that in a real F1
race and find x cars piled up into your rear end! In real F1, missing a
gear can involve a pile up. Try that in gp3 or f1cs or f12k and see what
happens.
I repeat, there are problems with some aspects of the ai in f1rc (and f12k)
but certainly not to the extent that SOME people here bang on about.
Iain

> On Thu, 14 Jun 2001 07:40:07 +0100, "Iain Mackenzie"

> >will this ever go away? as i've said many times, it is very difficult to
> >understand how this situation is occurring. why do some not have the
> >(apparent) problem of crashes at the start and others do. clearly
neither
> >of those groups are lying, so there must be a reason. if F1RC crashed
half
> >the field at every T1 of every race, I would be very pissed off and would
> >likely be posting in the same vein as some of you have. however, it
doesn't
> >happen with me, and i could also send a replay to anyone who wants it to
> >prove it! i also don't have the faster/slower problem. some people say
the
> >opposite to Andre, so i guess that is just a setup thing.

> But, you said the AI in F12K was fine too and it was our driving
> skills that was the problem so your opinion means jack-shit to me.

by **Iain Mackenzi** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 03:49:24

Actually Andre, I think you'll find that many people here have said that
they don't believe there will be a patch.
Iain

by **David G Fishe** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 05:03:01

"Of course" those features are better? Why aren't all sims at the level of
F1RC in graphics for example if it's so easy?

As for FF and multiplayer, we've gone over this. The multiplayer option was
limited by the FIA, regardless of what ymenard would have you believe. Ubi
was not allowed to have dedicated servers, and the TCP/IP feature was snuck
into the game. You can't even type an IP address into the little box on the
multiplayer screen.

As for FF, all I can say is that it's either buggy (some people say it's
great), or after working on ALL THOSE OTHER features I listed, they didn't
have time to polish the FF. GPL was a bare bones sim in comparison. All
those other features matter more to me than FF, so I can easily forgive
that.

BTW, the FF "add on" was released a year after GPL was released, not a
couple of months.

David G Fisher

by **chainbreake** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:13:06

Hey, I can say with absolute certainty that I'm NOT having any problems with
the AI in F1RC!

Of course, I wish that I *was* having problems with the AI in F1RC. :-)

Jerry Morelock

by **David G Fishe** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 08:24:25

Did you limit the number of characters in your driver name to less than 12?

David G Fisher

by **Don Burnett** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:17:36

Ummm, GPL came out what, almost 3 years ago?
At the time of it's release, the graphics were top notch.

Btw, they didn't have telemetry in 1967 either.

Now keep quiet you anti-Papy pig !!!!

Don Burnette

> > >the ff does work OK, it's just that it's not as good as gpl. however,
it
> is
> > >better than any other f1 sim - including gp3.

> > I heavily disagree with you, In My Humble Opinion the ff in GP3 is way
> > better. But as you say so yourself, the ff in 3-year old GPL is way
> > better and that is sad.

> It's also sad that GPL doesn't have the best graphics ever in a sim ("way
> better" in detail, complexity and optimization), pitting, tire wear, ghost
> mode, perfect track accuracy, telemetry (although either did the old
boys),
> dynamic weather..............

> I don't think GPL even had ff at all three months after it's release.

> David G Fisher

by **Don Burnett** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:18:42

Well your sure not convincing me to run out and buy F1RC.
:)

Don Burnette

> "Of course" those features are better? Why aren't all sims at the level of
> F1RC in graphics for example if it's so easy?

> As for FF and multiplayer, we've gone over this. The multiplayer option
was
> limited by the FIA, regardless of what ymenard would have you believe. Ubi
> was not allowed to have dedicated servers, and the TCP/IP feature was
snuck
> into the game. You can't even type an IP address into the little box on
the
> multiplayer screen.

> As for FF, all I can say is that it's either buggy (some people say it's
> great), or after working on ALL THOSE OTHER features I listed, they didn't
> have time to polish the FF. GPL was a bare bones sim in comparison. All
> those other features matter more to me than FF, so I can easily forgive
> that.

> BTW, the FF "add on" was released a year after GPL was released, not a
> couple of months.

> David G Fisher

> >> Is it really that hard to understand? It's three years later, ofcourse
> > these things are much better in F1RC! Nobody will disagree on that.
> > But back to the point: Why does a 3-year old game have much better ff
> > and multiplayer?? The ff -addon- (not patch) being released a couple
> > of months after GPL's release is totally irrelevant.

> > Andre

by **David G Fishe** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 09:36:13

That's what I said. "perfect track accuracy, telemetry (although either did
the old
boys), dynamic weather.............."

Sorry.

David G Fisher

> Don Burnette

> > > >the ff does work OK, it's just that it's not as good as gpl. however,
> it
> > is
> > > >better than any other f1 sim - including gp3.

> > > I heavily disagree with you, In My Humble Opinion the ff in GP3 is way
> > > better. But as you say so yourself, the ff in 3-year old GPL is way
> > > better and that is sad.

> > It's also sad that GPL doesn't have the best graphics ever in a sim
("way
> > better" in detail, complexity and optimization), pitting, tire wear,
ghost
> > mode, perfect track accuracy, telemetry (although either did the old
> boys),
> > dynamic weather..............

> > I don't think GPL even had ff at all three months after it's release.

> > David G Fisher

by **Iain Mackenzi** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:45:58

Don't bother then! It's only you who'll suffer, no-one else.
Iain

> Well your sure not convincing me to run out and buy F1RC.
> :)

> Don Burnette

> > "Of course" those features are better? Why aren't all sims at the level
of
> > F1RC in graphics for example if it's so easy?

> > As for FF and multiplayer, we've gone over this. The multiplayer option
> was
> > limited by the FIA, regardless of what ymenard would have you believe.
Ubi
> > was not allowed to have dedicated servers, and the TCP/IP feature was
> snuck
> > into the game. You can't even type an IP address into the little box on
> the
> > multiplayer screen.

> > As for FF, all I can say is that it's either buggy (some people say it's
> > great), or after working on ALL THOSE OTHER features I listed, they
didn't
> > have time to polish the FF. GPL was a bare bones sim in comparison. All
> > those other features matter more to me than FF, so I can easily forgive
> > that.

> > BTW, the FF "add on" was released a year after GPL was released, not a
> > couple of months.

> > David G Fisher

> > >> Is it really that hard to understand? It's three years later,
ofcourse
> > > these things are much better in F1RC! Nobody will disagree on that.
> > > But back to the point: Why does a 3-year old game have much better ff
> > > and multiplayer?? The ff -addon- (not patch) being released a couple
> > > of months after GPL's release is totally irrelevant.

> > > Andre

by **Plum** » Sat, 16 Jun 2001 15:58:38

Mmm...I've tired this patch for a couple of days and didn't notice ANY
improvements with the AI. In most cases they started doing weird things that
I never experienced before. So I've reverted back to the original file.

My main problem with the AI (aside form the occasional rear ending:-) is
trying to outbrake them while entering a turn. They seem to have waaaaay
better brakes than me because I can brake REALLY late and they are still
beside me, which isn't so bad and realistic to some extent I guess (if a
real driver is expecting this he'll try and brake late too). The problem
arises when they do a Schuey and turn into me 90% of the time when I have
the inside line. It's like they don't even know I'm there and just blindly
turn into me while I completely hold my line! But there's that 10% of the
time where the AI starts their turn in, waits and then backs off! It's times
like that where I almost lose control of the car because I'm in a state of
shock! Why can't this happen more often!

Also, they seem way less aggressive during the first lap of the race. They
back off, they give you room, they'll try and pass you cleanly and usually
won't hit you from behind. But after the first lap it's a ***shoot. Is the
AI going to turn into me? Are they going to ram me even if I brake really,
reeeeeally late into this turn? Damn, I really wish this would get sorted
out by Ubisoft. It's very frustrating to have such a fun sim but be plagued
with such INCONSISTENT AI.

Something inside of me says "why would they release a patch if the 'sequel'
is coming out in five months". Would you buy the sequel if F1RC's AI was
properly fixed? Honestly, what reason would you have to buy the sequel if
the patch fixed the AI? Looking at the way Ubisoft operates, this is the
kind of thinking that *may* prevent them from ever releasing a patch that
addresses the AI in F1RC. Just look at EA. F1 2000...suspect AI, CPU
intensive graphics engine. A patch is released that 'sort of addresses' the
AI issues but is still in need of an improvement. Then, like 6-8 months
later the real patch comes out in the form of F1CS 2000 (which addresses
both issues BTW). Of course you have to pay $45 to get the "fixes" :-)
<Sigh> Well, I did buy F1CS2K (once the price was reduced) and this is
currently my favorite modern F1 sim at the moment. Why? The physics engine
(with the advanced physics patch) is good, the online play is 'alright', the
graphics are 'okay' and the AI is very fun to run with. For me it's offers
more of a complete package than F1RC or GP3. If F1RC's AI is patched
properly, then F1RC steps into the slot as my favorite F1 sim (which to me
shows how much this sim actually gets right).

I REALLY hope Ubisoft proves me wrong on this one but I have a bad feeling
about EVER seeing a 'free' patch. The 'patch' will be F1RC2 in November...

- Plum

rec.autos.simulators

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!

Where the hell is the F1RC patch?...seriously!