rec.autos.simulators

The phrase 'This is an entirely new project' makes
me a bit worried though...

      _
Mats Lofkvist

PS it is at http://www.racesimcentral.net/

Nonetheless, nice to finally have an official word on what they've
been up to and looking forward to finding out more.

Jason

If it's what it looks like it will be...it'll probably be the last racing
sim I buy, ever...

Milhouse

Man, still reading the website here.  My jaw is currently somewhere
down around my ankles.

The only problem I'm seeing is that these boys seem to have a problem
matching their boundless enthusiasm with a product. =/

Jason

Sure, it SOUNDS good, but I'll reserve judgement for the product release
(if there is indeed one this this time - and I honestly hope there is).

If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown
above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame.
=========================================================

I agree. If this isn't proof positive, I don't know what is...

    WEST RACING LEGENDS ROCKS!!!!!!!!

Note: this is more a business case analysis than game analysis. Stop reading
now if you'll be bored!

The great things about this potential game are the focus on the features
that Sim Racers want - modularity, expansion, realistic physics, online
play. It really comes across as a mouth watering temptation.

However, before we get too e***d, I think we need to realistically
consider the business model and ask the question: Is this going to work? Are
West going to be able to pull this off?

I understand that West is a small (family?) outfit. Such an undertaking as
their new proposal requires huge capital and a lot of risk. Can a simulation
that requires a lot more work than a racing game, but appeals to a much
smaller, niche market, really be viable?

There are some promising signs:

Pricing model. The casual gamer will pay little more than street price for
the standard game. However, the dedicated Sim Racer will pay extra for each
option, and for new tracks. I would imagine that a full blown package with
all options and extra tracks might cost in the vicinity of US$500, plus
maybe a subscription for high level online racing. This is good thing. Sim
Racers have consistantly said that they would pay for the right product -
consider the recent threads about people demanding a GPL2 and saying that
they'd pay $500 for it!

Modular format. The creators understand that people want an evolving Sim,
with new cars, new tracks, and maybe even new concepts in racing. All of
this will add value to the base product and Intellecutal Property. However,
don't be surprised if unlike current sims, West control the additions to
their products and require all  new cars/tracks to licenced from them
instead of freely available from third party enthusiasts. Maybe they will
encourage people by offereing a comission on new cars/tracks that are sold.

Vapourware?

After 2 years, WSC vanished into the  vapourware cloud it had always been
in. It sees that West relied on a vapourware business model, hoping that VCs
or 3rd parties would take enough of an interest in their game to sponsor the
development. West was too small to take this risk by themselves. Racing
legends appears to be starting off the same way. We have been promised the
stars, but have seen nothing in concrete except a beautifully rendered, but
practically un-realistic racing car. Even with Moore's Law, it will take a
decade or so before we see cars with that level detail running around the
track together in real time!

The web site comes across to me a VC marketing tool, more than a realistic
"this is what is coming soon" type site.

Risk. To get this concept into production requires a huge amount of risk
taking. Not only does the game have to work, but there are issues of
infrastucture for hosting online racing, marketing, and finding a top notch
distribution outfit. Something of this scale is normally only taken on by
large corporations prepared to take the gamble. Remember that recently Papy
declined to do a GPL2, even though the Sim Racing community loved the
original so much. At the end of the day, Papy made a business decision -
they decided that even a very vocal niche market wasn't enough to justify
the expense of doing the game.

dot game boom?

After the dot com crashes of the last 2 years, we have seen a resurgance in
computer games, especially online ***. A lot of people are saying its the
next "big thing". In many ways I agree. Machines are get fast enough to some
wonderful stuff, and broadband has really taken off, so the infrastructure
is there to support a new generation of online ***.

However, have we already forgotten the lesson of the dot com boom? In the
end, it was mostly the new comers like web van that did the skyrocket and
fell back to earth. However, the traditional players ended up surviving and
now prosper. I wonder if it will be the same for ***?

Maybe I'm being a little too cynical. If West can get this game to at least
inital production, and the concept takes off, then they might be able to
sell out to one of the established big players and walk away smiling. It
might also drive forward the market and help create standards for wanted
peripherals such as FF pedals (inc clutch), and hydraulic***pits that
simulate motion and g-forces.

As for me, I'll take a wait and see. I *hope* it all works out.

Tim

That can't happen this time.

Not to say they won't find some way to turn it into vaporware...

Based on the website, the core pack will be released this year.  I
sure as hell hope so.  Then again, who knows what it will cost.  $200?
$500?  $1000?

Jason

So far there is no more real proof that it actually be a reality other than
what has been said on the site. And this was all pretty much done before,
altbeit in other forms. etc.

- Isotrip?

<really, REALLY big snip>

.......................................................wait and see. I
*hope* it all works out.

All that stuff is kinda confusin'. Can you just tell me if my MSFF wheel
will work with it , or do i need to go buy a better one??

     Maybe it's time for guys like you have a reality check. Anyone can
claim anything they want to on a website.  Just exactly what has the West
brothers ever produced or finished? NOTHING. We've had 2+ years of promises,
countless pics that mean absolutely nothing. I haven't seen one post of
anyone who actually drove a fully workable demo of WSC. You do remember the
demo that the West promised us after E3 of 2001 don't you?

      Grand Prix Legends took 2 years from start to finish with a full team
of highly paid professionals working a min of 8 hours per day, 5 days per
week. Now just how is 2 brothers named West going to do that and get it done
by end of the year working part time on this project?  They do have jobs
don't they?

       I'm still waiting to hear their version of what really transpired
with Empire. You don't really believe the***order do you?

Joel Willstein

--

"If you can leave black marks on a straight from the time you exit a corner
till the time you brake for the next turn
, then you have enough horsepower."
Mark Donohue