http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Although I think we're talking about two different Byrons actually -
this is by Byron Hinson. Sorry bout that.
Joe
I think this is a different Byron though, Hinson not Forbes. My
mistake.
Joe
>>Dont you think that Microsoft can fix this and is capable of making CPR
one
>>of the best Sims avail? Well lets give them until after there vacation
from
>>MTM2 and see what happens!
>To be honest no, I honestly don't think MS (or indeed anyone else)
>could patch this product to be one of the best sims available.
>Technically it is imporbable given the amount of things so obviously
>needing attention, and commercially it makes no sense whatsoever. I
>suspect you may see these things addressed for "CPR2" should such a
>beast ever appear. By then of course GPL will have been around for
>some time and N3 and quite possible Papy's new CART sim will be on the
>market, and the bar will have been raised to a level that the engine
>MS are using for CPR and MTM2 just cannot come close to.
>I'd like to see MS do well and produce great sims, and if they can
>beat Papyrus, Ubisoft, GC and the like then it's good for all of us.
>Frankly speaking it will take a _lot_ more than they have at the
>moment, not only from the physics and game engine side but also in
>understanding the sport and the needs of the market. Accepting CPR as
>a good sim without offering constructive criticism will not help one
>iota (although mindlessly bashing their efforts will admittedly
>achieve a darn sight less).
Hey George,
I would love to see it. Not to dispute it as I am sure
you know.
But just to see how well it can be done. Everytime we have raced I never
get to see
your driving as I am too far behind :-)
thanks, Mike
> >> And the claim that Byron is bashing MTM2 is PURE bullshit - he wrote a
> >> very positive an accurate preview posted on the web the other day.
> > URL? As I would really like to see a " positive & accurate " anything
> >from Byron regarding an MS product. Really I would :-)
> Here you go:
> http://www.activeguide.com/previews/prev/mtm2.html
> Although I think we're talking about two different Byrons actually -
> this is by Byron Hinson. Sorry bout that.
> Joe
> >> And the claim that Byron is bashing MTM2 is PURE bullshit - he wrote a
> >> very positive an accurate preview posted on the web the other day.
> > URL? As I would really like to see a " positive & accurate " anything
> >from Byron regarding an MS product. Really I would :-)
> Here you go:
> http://www.activeguide.com/previews/prev/mtm2.html
> Although I think we're talking about two different Byrons actually -
> this is by Byron Hinson. Sorry bout that.
> Joe
> Oh yeah, Joe take a look a few posts down from Mr Negative. No wait I will help you.
> Here is one quote from Byron (a.k.a Mr. Negative) about MTM2
> Some of you people take this way too seriously. I made one or two
> references to MTM2 after it was reveiled CPR had been shafted in favour
> of getting MTM2 on the shelves. Big deal. I don't give a hoot about MTM2
> - not my cuppa tea.
> That aint no BS either
>Hmmm, Maybe we all need to spend the big bucks and get the CDS5000
>Wheel/Pedal system??? Maybe someday, huh? I have a feeling my wife would
>take that CDS5000 and hit me upside the head with it :)
And how do you know you're at thresshold braking the entire time? You
might just not be braking as much in one corner as you possibly could?
Either way, it takes only a small amount of brake pedal travel to
generate 50% braking, way too little to be able to modulate as well as
you can with some other sims.
Yes you can definitely put a tire off. Never said you couldn't...
Okay, will do.
You have and you haven't. First of all, I never claimed you couldn't
trail brake in CPR. I've done it myself and know its doable. The
issue is whether the pedal-travel-to-braking force ratio is all out of
whack for all but a tiny percentage of PC pedals. And the fact that
such little travel means its incredibly difficult for most people to
do even a reasonable job at braking without locking 'em up all the
time.
Not really. You'd need wheelspin values to see you locking wheels up
for the tiniest amounts of time when they locked & released. Since
CPR doesn't track wheelspin its hard to tell. The best thing you can
do is go down a long straight and brake to a stop as quickly as you
can without locking up the tires, and look at the Pi traces to see
what your braking % was to get to the limit. If you are going 150+
mph and you can lock 'em up with only 50% braking, something is wrong.
Your downforce should allow more braking than that! Now perhaps under
100 mph 50% might lock 'em up.
Lets throw ice water on this fight before it gets out of control. I
took it personally because your comments seemed to imply that I wanted
ICR2 anti-lock brakes and wanted to be able to just slam the brakes to
the stops and hold it there. No such thing was ever suggested...by
anyone. So for you to try to prop that puppy up and knock it down
seemed to me like you were getting extreme in your arguments. I never
called you stupid. But neither did I appreciate it you acting like I
thought ICR2 braking was perfectly wonderful either.
You've demonstrated you can TRAIL brake, not threshhold brake, since
you yourself admit you have no Pi trace that shows the wheelspin
necessary to show you actually touched the limit of braking.
Randy
Randy Magruder
Contributing Reviewer
Digital Sportspage
http://www.digitalsports.com
OK - I've decided. All the shit I posted was real stupid on my part.
I apologize to the news group.
BF
>> Well Pat I wouldnt know about the AI cause I dont race them I race
Humans.
>> George
>Well George, I do too - on NROS. That wouldn't excuse Papyrus if the
>AI in N2 was lame, and it doesn't excuse Microsoft either. MS's
>blatant attempt to force IE on me is even more lame than their AI.
>--
>Pat Dotson
>IMPACT Motorsports
but I rem when N2 came out, all you guys did was complain how bad the AI
was. Wasnt there some people out there that fixed the AI? I dont remember
Papyrus doing it for you!
Well CPR is a MS game played in a MS zone why should they make it work with
other browsers first?
George
>>Well the effects might not be exact to par but I can trail brake while
>>turning, Isnt that what trail braking is??? I guess I am the only one that
>>has the touch? You must be very gentle though!
>I wasn't talking about slowing down while braking and turning. I'm talking
>about the effects the weight transfer has on steering and car balance.
>Specifically, the car should turn in better when trail braking. I haven't
>seen this effect in CPR compared to other sims like F1RS.
>>I never said the brakes were perfect. I agree that they need to be fixed
>and
>>I have said this from the start. But until they are I CAN ADJUST!
>It's not just the brakes that are a problem in this sim. I can care less
>when there are several minor problems in a sim, but the sum of the major
>problems in CPR lead me to delete it and race exclusively in F1RS. I was
>once a fan of CPR, hoping that future patches would improve it. They
>haven't delivered, and I doubt that they ever will.
>--
>Kevin
>(Remove the "x-" prefix from my address in order to reply via email)
>Well Kevin, F1RS is not on the shelves here yet so I wouldnt know about
I would assume that it must be the perfect Simulator since it has had 8
patches so far!
George
>> BTW if anyone else would like to see the PI Analysis E-Mail me and I
>would
>> be glad to send it to you!
>> Later
>> George
>Hey George,
> I would love to see it. Not to dispute it as I am sure
>you know.
>But just to see how well it can be done. Everytime we have raced I never
>get to see
>your driving as I am too far behind :-)
>thanks, Mike
George
hehehe I noticed the e-mail address was diffrent too. I knew you wouldnt
actually apologize to this NG. You have to admit tho, its pretty funny
> > OK - I've decided. All the shit I posted was real stupid on my part.
> > I apologize to the news group.
> > BF
> Now this I MUST have posted in my sleep. And on someone elses
> computer considering the email address. To whoever posted this all I can
> say to you is what you say about yourself is entirely true and well
> demonstrated by the fact you forgot to change your email address. I have
> recorded your email address and if you attempt to do this again be
> assured a complaint to your ISP will follow promptly!
> > Well CPR is a MS game played in a MS zone why should they make it work
with
> > other browsers first?
> Why not at the same time? Are they hopeless or are they scum?
