rec.autos.simulators

Sega GT 2002 - C
Project Gotham - B
Thunder 2003 - A
Rallisport Challenge - B
F1 2001 - D
Moto GP - A

The demo of Rally Fusion was horrible and not enough to convince me to
even shell out the paltry $20-30 it's going for.  I'm probably going
to grab Colin Mcrae 3 and Apex this week and will post some sort of
review probably if they're worth the time.

For more action oriented games, I enjoy Spy Hunter and Wreckless quite
a bit.  I also have Crazy Taxi, but you're not missing much if you
already have either of the Dreamcast versions.

Thunder 2003 and Moto GP alone could kill hours of your time.  Thunder
features the best career mode I've seen in a racing sim (haven't tried
Dirt to Daytona, wish it was ported to the x-box).  If you really
want, you can race a full schedule over 20 years with 100% race
lengths, which obviously would kill a significant portion of your
time.  It's amazing to me just how much better the console versions of
Thunder are compared to the incredibly weak PC version.  This is also
the only x-box racer I sort of wish I had a wheel for.

Moto GP is xbox live enabled and is fairly challenging to drive even
if you don't spend hours with multiplay.  Doesn't have a real career
type mode per se, but you can create a new rider and improve his
performance by completing training exercises.  I've heard nothing but
good things about the online support for it.  The graphics/sound are
incredibly immersive.

Rallisport Challenge is quite fun with a gamepad.  I wasn't overly
keen on it on the PC with a wheel and sometimes choppy framerates, but
on the X-box with the s-controller it really is a lot of fun for a
short-stage rally game.

Proejct Gotham is my favorite street racer ever (with it's
predecessor, Metropolis Street Racing on the Dreamcast a close
second).  The kudos system sounds silly before you try it, but it's
really challenging trying to put down good times and win races while
maximizing your style score (you get kudos for doing tricks basically,
like getting air and pulling off long handbrake slides).

Also, FWIW, the only 3 x-box racers that I'm aware of having a proper
***pit camera are Thunder, Moto GP, and F1 2001.

Jason

Looks like I won't get a chance to pickup CMR3 or Apex until Thursday.

Jason

It's amazing for once to hear people anticipating a game I hired 3 months
ago (CMR3).  (Normally the other way around for European releases)  CMR3
falls between a sim and arcade game and fails at both.

If you thought that Sega GT was good then you'll enjoy Apex.  Personally, I
find them both like watching paint dry compared to Project Gotham which has
awesome variety and carefully crafted arcade gameplay.

Can't get Thunder here in Australia and I find Moto GP to be more of a poor
simulation rather than a good arcade game.

Seems the best features are smart and competitive AI (rare in just about any
racer), interesting car development/customization, and nice graphic and 5.1
DD sound.

--
Joe M.

You know, I haven't actually gotten Heat 2002 yet.  I'll grab it when
I make my run to EB later this evening to pick up Apex, CMR3, and Kung
Fu Chaos. =)

I'm a big realism fan, but consoles to me are more about fun than
realism.  I do wish that MGI had released Dirt to Daytona for the
console however, as it looks very nice.

Jason

Let me know what you think of Kung Fu Chaos, I might get it this weekend.
If you think it's too OT for here just e-mail me with your opinion.

Thanks,
Hal

Picked it up but haven't had a chance to play it yet.  I don't think
anything is too OT for this newsgroup. =p

Quick summaries of the other 2:

Apex:  Very GT3/Sega GT style physics.  The build-your-own-brand
career mode is fun but disappointing since you can't actually design
anything.  AI is interesting in that you will actually encounter cars
losing control after making or avoiding contact with each other, but
at the same is really annoying because of the obnoxious speed up/slow
down routine.  Winning a race against the AI seems more a matter of
holding the inside line to each corner than actually putting up great
lap times.  The graphics are unbelievable, particularly the
environments which are stunning.  It has the NR2003 style 2-d animated
objects (altho in this case in addition to helicopters/blimps there
are airplanes, buses, and so forth) as well as nice little touches
such as a crowd holding a huge Atari banner that is flopping about in
the wind.  I've knackered moer than one race in the early going
because something off-track caught my eye.  Overall a good arcade
racer but more on par with Sega GT or GT3 in terms of overall fun and
gameplay than Project Gotham.  I'd give it a B-.

CMR3:   Fun but really dodgy physics.  The stages are the typical
Colin Mcrae 3 minute blasts with a 90 degree turn every 50 feet.
Graphics/sound are a good way below Rallisport Challenge which also
has much more convincing handling imho.  Strong point is the damage
model which actually appears to make a difference in the way the car
handles this year.  I hit a tree fairly hard and destroyed the left
front of the car, resulting in the car pulling to one side really
badly the rest of that day while the hood flopped in my face for a bit
before finally shearing off.  Has the scariest "hood in your face"
effect this side of Nascar 4.  Makes me wish Rallisport Challenge
would get redone with a proper damage model and 20km special stages.
I'd give it a C thusfar, altho the career mode seems to have some
potential and may raise that to a B-.

Jason

Don't get too e***d about ''''''developing'''''' your own car :-\  If
looking at 3 plans and then telling someone to go develop that car is your
idea of fun, go for it.

any

Smart and competitive?  Hardly.  Stupid cheaters would be a far more apt
description.  The races get easier as you progress through the game - how
pointless and boring is that?

I assure you, there aren't any 'interesting' developments.  It's all kiddie
car upgrades that do virtually nothing.  DD 5.1 sound?  Well, yes, but it's
not anywhere near as good as Sega GT's which wasn't that special either.
The car sounds are truly pathetic.

The graphics are *extremely* nice.  However, they would want to be
considering Apex runs at half the frame rate of Gran Turismo 3 - pathetic.
The lighting, despite featuring fully reflective cube-mapping, doesn't look
natural.

The only saving grace is that the handling is quite fun (not realistic
though) but not as fun as Project Gotham.  The races are brain-numbingly
repetitive.

This game was made with two things in mind - making pretty screenshots for
websites and magazines and being able to hype it as having a career mode
despite the fact it has no substance whatsoever.  Apex is the most
overrated, overhyped Xbox game since Halo.

Picked up Rallisport Challenge yesterday and so far like it, much better
that Sega GT IMHO.

Well, Project Gotham is head and shoulders above everything else.
Rallisport Challenge is probably the next best.

Yeah, for once Gamespot hit the nail right on the head with Apex.  It's a
fabulous concept but very poorly executed.

If you don't like Sega GT then you won't like Apex - they've got a lot in
common.  Sega GT has smoother graphics and more polished replays but not as
much detail.  The career mode is equally poorly structured in both games.
They both involve unlocking a minimal number of cars except Apex tries to
pretend that it's allowing you to make decisions.