rec.autos.simulators

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

btgos

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by btgos » Thu, 04 Jul 2002 23:42:28

Again. This idea is coming from someone who is mostly a lurker here, and has
only made 2 RASCAR races. So I understand if this idea is just shrugged off.

Instead of one person being responsible for pointing out errors in driving,
which is vital to better racing I feel, why don't we have a competition
board. Only people who don't make the race are part of the board for that
week. Get at least three people. They all watch a replay, hopefully from
more than one source, and they post their comments.
I know this would be alot of work, but we do seem to have alot of people who
can't make the races regularly, so this would be another way for them to get
involved. And by not being in the race they are commenting on, there is a
minimized amount of favoritism that could be called.
I know I can't make every race, but I would more than gladly make some time
to review replays and highlight what I thought were examples of bad driving.
And with at least three people making that judgement call, we should get a
fairly good idea of what is bad driving and what is just a racing incident.

Brit
btgoss # 146 with RASCAR and GROWL.



> Agreed.  I see this as a disagreement between two, maybe three people.

> There are a couple dozen of us that are getting along just fine :)

> -Larry





> > > Running a league is not easy but the big part is sticking with it when
> it
> > > gets it worst.
> > > The biggest problem I have seen of RASCAR (from the outside looking
in)
> is
> > > that you guys don't want to call it a league.  Someone has a few rules
> but
> > > no one officially stands by them and as such it is going to get out of
> > hand.

> > How has it gotten out of hand?

> > David G Fisher

The Other Larr

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by The Other Larr » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 01:30:49

Honestly, I think the best progress comes from post-race chatter here
discussing _situations_ that came up, not necessarily the precise people
involved.  The results are the same (it gets discussed), and it doesn't
create targets.

I also feel the more light-hearted these discussions are  i.e. "Boy, was a
friggen idiot today, or what!" the better.

People***up.  There's also a reason why WE aren't the one's being
watched on TV every Sunday :)  I think it's possible to discuss possible
area's of mis-understanding i.e. What should someone do in xxx situation.
"There was an incident today because of this, and I want to see if I should
have done this instead of that".

We have to stop painting targets on each other at all costs.

I'm pleased at how little of this I have seen in RASCAR, and I'd like to see
it stay that way.

I'll take leaving the track as a respected friend over a winner any day, if
I only have one choice.

-Larry


> Again. This idea is coming from someone who is mostly a lurker here, and
has
> only made 2 RASCAR races. So I understand if this idea is just shrugged
off.

> Instead of one person being responsible for pointing out errors in
driving,
> which is vital to better racing I feel, why don't we have a competition
> board. Only people who don't make the race are part of the board for that
> week. Get at least three people. They all watch a replay, hopefully from
> more than one source, and they post their comments.
> I know this would be alot of work, but we do seem to have alot of people
who
> can't make the races regularly, so this would be another way for them to
get
> involved. And by not being in the race they are commenting on, there is a
> minimized amount of favoritism that could be called.
> I know I can't make every race, but I would more than gladly make some
time
> to review replays and highlight what I thought were examples of bad
driving.
> And with at least three people making that judgement call, we should get a
> fairly good idea of what is bad driving and what is just a racing
incident.

> Brit
> btgoss # 146 with RASCAR and GROWL.



> > Agreed.  I see this as a disagreement between two, maybe three people.

> > There are a couple dozen of us that are getting along just fine :)

> > -Larry





> > > > Running a league is not easy but the big part is sticking with it
when
> > it
> > > > gets it worst.
> > > > The biggest problem I have seen of RASCAR (from the outside looking
> in)
> > is
> > > > that you guys don't want to call it a league.  Someone has a few
rules
> > but
> > > > no one officially stands by them and as such it is going to get out
of
> > > hand.

> > > How has it gotten out of hand?

> > > David G Fisher

Eldre

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Eldre » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 02:18:17



>jesus you are acting like a little girl

Y'know, you could disagree without being insulting...

Eldred

--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Stolen vehicle! - Det,MI
1999 Blk Pontiac Grand Am SE, Lic# 947SLS,
VIN:1G2NE12EXXM815898 carjacked from Grnfld/W. Chicago 6/30/02.Contact Officer
Penn at 313-596-2850.Thanks

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Eldre

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Eldre » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 02:18:17



>> On someone else's server maybe - I don't have the upload bandwidth
>> necessary to host a full field. :(

>Fancy a run with the IGPS guys (& girl - wherever she is) Eldred?

Ah...you guys just want me for my *server*...<g>  I wouldn't have a problem
loaning you a server, but I'm clearly not a good enough driver to keep up with
you guys...
Who's the girl - Alison?

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Stolen vehicle! - Det,MI
1999 Blk Pontiac Grand Am SE, Lic# 947SLS,
VIN:1G2NE12EXXM815898 carjacked from Grnfld/W. Chicago 6/30/02.Contact Officer
Penn at 313-596-2850.Thanks

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Eldre

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Eldre » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 02:18:17



>Running a league is not easy but the big part is sticking with it when it
>gets it worst.
>The biggest problem I have seen of RASCAR (from the outside looking in) is
>that you guys don't want to call it a league.  Someone has a few rules but
>no one officially stands by them and as such it is going to get out of hand.
>Either you control it fully or it's nothing more than a pickup race.   Seems
>you wanted all the good of a league without all the effort and politics well
>that isn't going to happen.

I've called it a league.  The only difference is that we don't run for points.
I've also told people to adhere to the ruls that were posted on John's site.  I
thought they were common sense, and easy to follow.  There were plans to
possibly add more, but there was no timetable for that.
But, don't think there wasn't any effort involved here.  Even though I'm the
host, my effort was minimal compared to the work that John and Phil did for
websites, cars, carsets, forum space, etc.

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Stolen vehicle! - Det,MI
1999 Blk Pontiac Grand Am SE, Lic# 947SLS,
VIN:1G2NE12EXXM815898 carjacked from Grnfld/W. Chicago 6/30/02.Contact Officer
Penn at 313-596-2850.Thanks

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Eldre

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Eldre » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 02:18:17



>RASCAR isn't a league. It's a grooup of people that race together
>because they want a clean race. To atain that goal, there needs to be
>some agreements that everyone has to follow.  Beyond that, unless and
>until the group starts examining the root causes of the incidents,
>nothing will change, and there will continue to be incident-filled
>races.  This means that they have to be able to admit when they***
>the pooch.

I came to consider it a league.  I also thought that the discussions were
helpful to rookie and veteran alike.  We gained some good insight, and have a
good group of guys.  With something as volatile as auto racing, it's
understandable that tempers will flare sometime.  I think we've done a great
job at not latting discussions get too pursonal, up until now.

I believe that, and I appreciate what you did to help the RASCAR races.

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
Stolen vehicle! - Det,MI
1999 Blk Pontiac Grand Am SE, Lic# 947SLS,
VIN:1G2NE12EXXM815898 carjacked from Grnfld/W. Chicago 6/30/02.Contact Officer
Penn at 313-596-2850.Thanks

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Tony Rickar

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Tony Rickar » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 03:47:43

"EldredP"

On the contrary IGPS always had a big range of ability. In fact IGPS/1
was so early after the release of GPL that many were in that raw
learning phase so that there were huge disparities in lap times, yet
there seemed to be mini battles going on down the field.

The odd thing was there were remarkably few incidents even when the
faster drivers lapped the learners. Maybe on-line racing was so new to
most of us that an extra degree of respect existed - who knows.

Karissa Thomas. She reappeared on my address book recently after
restoring an old copy, and I got quizzed by the wife :-)

Tony

Tony Rickar

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Tony Rickar » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 03:53:02


> > Fancy a run with the IGPS guys (& girl - wherever she is) Eldred?
> And if you do, could you hold off until after the 11th 'cos I'm on
> holiday and I would kinda like to be in that race :-)

Don't forget you will need to download the ballast patch for your BRM,
Graeme...

Tony

Eldre

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Eldre » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 05:46:26



>On the contrary IGPS always had a big range of ability. In fact IGPS/1
>was so early after the release of GPL that many were in that raw
>learning phase so that there were huge disparities in lap times, yet
>there seemed to be mini battles going on down the field.

>The odd thing was there were remarkably few incidents even when the
>faster drivers lapped the learners. Maybe on-line racing was so new to
>most of us that an extra degree of respect existed - who knows.

Possible.

Oops...<g>

Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
Stolen vehicle! - Det,MI
1999 Blk Pontiac Grand Am SE, Lic# 947SLS,
VIN:1G2NE12EXXM815898 carjacked from Grnfld/W. Chicago 6/30/02.Contact Officer
Penn at 313-596-2850.Thanks

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John Simmon

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by John Simmon » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 06:27:58



In IGPS/1, you, me and Graeme seemed to own the top three spots on the
grid.  I remember the very first race (Mexico) when Graeme was leading
by quite a hefty margin of between 20 and 30 seconds when he disco'd on
the last turn of the lap. I ended up winning because of it, and felt
real bad about Graeme disco'ing after he held the lead for the whole
race.  When I'm done readin ras, I think I'm gonna go watch a few of the
old IGPS races.

I think it might have been because I was a fascist where incidents were
concerned.  Zieg hiel.  :)

Anyone ever find out what she's been up to?  I noticed she's in GPL
Rank, and the last update from her was late last year, so she's still
plinking at lap times.

--
=========================================================
DeMONS/1 for Nascar Racing 3 & Nascar Legends
  http://www.paddedwall.org/demons
DeMONS/2 for Nascar Racing 4 and 2002 Season (in development)
  http://www.paddedwall.org/demons2
RASCAR Roster
  http://www.paddedwall.org/rascar
Redneck Techno-Biker & "programming deity"
  http://www.paddedwall.org/john
Barbarian Diecast Collector (460+ cars and counting)
  http://www.paddedwall.org/diecast

If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown
above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame.
=========================================================

Tony Rickar

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by Tony Rickar » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 06:49:02

Lead the whole race???? I Was first into T1 Mr Simmons!

Just last out of it beached on a pesky tyre and a black flag and pit
stop for the pleasure <G>

Not the perfect start to my first league race (wasn't repeated so I
guess I learnt something)

The fight back to second either shows how varied the field was or what
an incredibly quick driver I am (delete as appropriate)

Tony

BowtNetterToD

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by BowtNetterToD » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 06:25:02



> Too late - it's a done deal.  Y'all have fun.  Besides, it's better to
> have one person quit (me) than to have to people quit (ginger and
> mitch).

Naturaly i cant speak for Mitch but the idea of quitting never crossed my
mind, on the whole i find rascar races a great deal of fun, and the quality
of the races is getting better.

For the record i dont think either Mitch, John or myself should consider
quitting.

Cheers Ginger

BowtNetterToD

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by BowtNetterToD » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 06:17:46


John, though i doubt there is anyway i could influence you to change your
mind i have to say i dont think its neccessary for you to quit or leave
Rascar.

I havnt said so in the past so its only right and proper to convey my thanks
for all your time and effort you have put into Rascar, many Thanks John.

Amen to that brother, i couldnt agree more, and i feel exactly the same way
with regards to character assassination, especialy in such a public forum.

Cheers Ginger

BowtNetterToD

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by BowtNetterToD » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 07:40:11


Hehe, i thought we all done that in another thread.

I know this is Rascar we are talking about, but i dont think RAS is the best
place to examine root causes etc etc simply because it is so public. I
normaly make the effort to apologise for any incident i feel the slightest
bit responsible for, and sometimes for incidents where i think i am
completely blameless, and i think most of us do that. I also think most of
us review the replay of the race and look at our incidents from different
view points to get the bigger picture on what really happened, and learn
what we can from that second viewing. I think you are a bit brash and dare i
say rude at times, which i'm sure wards off most who would dare to challenge
you, and for those reasons i dont think you are the best person to conduct a
recap of the races ( if indeed a recap is neccessary )

Well, people in glasshouses.......

That much is clear, i dont think anyone is asking that from you.

I hear you, though at a subconscious level i think you were.

Thats a shame, and again i dont think that is neccessary, i would like to
think that whatever our disagreements we can still enjoy a race together,
after all, there is much more to rascar than just me and you.
Or were you talking about the recap, in which case i applaud your decision
:-)

Cheers Ginger

John Simmon

RASCAR: It's all yours guys

by John Simmon » Fri, 05 Jul 2002 09:49:37



You were also the first one to plow through the tire barriers too... :)

You were catching me though.  Didn't you finish 2nd in that race?

The way I recall, as long as none of us wrecked or got booted, Graeme
and you were often 1st or 2nd, and I was third at the end.

That's why we all agreed to change chassis for season 2.

--
=========================================================
DeMONS/1 for Nascar Racing 3 & Nascar Legends
  http://www.paddedwall.org/demons
DeMONS/2 for Nascar Racing 4 and 2002 Season (in development)
  http://www.paddedwall.org/demons2
RASCAR Roster
  http://www.paddedwall.org/rascar
Redneck Techno-Biker & "programming deity"
  http://www.paddedwall.org/john
Barbarian Diecast Collector (460+ cars and counting)
  http://www.paddedwall.org/diecast

If you want to send me email, go to the first URL shown
above & click "Send Me Mail" in the contents frame.
=========================================================


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