Sometimes you have to gamble, he did even if his chances were pretty low, it
did not work. Simple as that. I mean, it's the same as every ***y people
who take a chance at the lottery, no? ;)
--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- http://www.racesimcentral.net/
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...
Daryl said it best. He got talked into something he knew in his heart
wasn't right.
I don't think it will happen again...
-Larry
Michael's car was as fast, if not a tad faster, than Dale's. Dale KNEW that
Rusty would never go with him when he made the attempt.
Dale KNEW that he was the second place car, under these circumstances.
But, where he should have followed his head and his heart, he let his crew
chief talk him into something he knew he should not do, and he paid dearly
for it.
I don't ever see this happening again. He was really upset with himself in
the after-race interview.
-Larry
> Dave
> > I know its easy to "Monday morning quarterback" somebody's move in a
race.
> > But I really was perplexed at the decision Dale, Jr. made tonight to try
> > Michael "high" with only a couple laps left in the Pepsi 400.
> > I am hoping somebody talked him into that (like a crew chief???), but if
> it
> > was his own decision then it shows he has some more "experience" to
gather
> > up at the SS tracks. What was he trying to gain? Other than the
obvious
> > lead? He had everything to loose....and virtually nothing to gain
unless
> > his car was just that much stronger than Dale's.....and the previous 5
or
> 6
> > laps should have told him it wasn't! Unless Dale, Jr. thought he could
go
> > high on his own....and just drive around Michael with no help (not
> > likely).....then he should have known that Rusty would have to follow
> > him....or he'd be "toast" and going straight to the back (which is what
> did
> > happen)!
> > But even worse! What if Rusty did go high with him? Now he forces
> Michael
> > (his friend and teammate) into a blocking move that would require him to
> > pinch Dale to the outside wall. A dangerous block....but one,
> > IMHO......Michael was obligated to make to attempt to protect his lead
> > position. But, what if Michael decided not to put Dale in danger....and
> > just let him go around? That would have been a bad thing for Dale to
> > do......to put Michael in that position of having to decide between
doing
> > what the racer in him said was correct......and doing what the friend
and
> > teammate in him said was "safe" for Dale. Bad deal....IMHO. I think
Dale
> > owes Michael a personal "apology" for almost putting Michael in a really
> bad
> > place! That's just my opinion.......post-race as it is. But, what do
you
> > guys think?
> > Regards,
> > Tom
Dale KNEW he was the second place car given the circumstances of the moment.
Sometimes going for the win is not the smart thing to do, and this was one
of them. He just let himself get talked out of what he knew was the right
thing to do.
-Larry
> His crew chief was not sitting in the car with Dale. Its likely he didn't
> even know the situation except as it appeared the last time the group
passed
> the pit lane. And when did it ever be such that the crew chief makes the
> definitive call on the move a driver makes on the track? And, this was
not
> a "no points, run for the money shoot out." It was a season points
> race....not a 20-lap pickup race! And, in all the years I've been
following
> racing....or racing myself......I've never seen a "win at all costs"
driver
> have any long term success in racing. Can anyone? C'mon guys!
> TP
> > You're analyzing waaay to much. He was trying to win the race. It
> didn't
> > work. Simple as that :)
> > John
> > > I know its easy to "Monday morning quarterback" somebody's move in a
> race.
> > > But I really was perplexed at the decision Dale, Jr. made tonight to
try
> > > Michael "high" with only a couple laps left in the Pepsi 400.
> > > I am hoping somebody talked him into that (like a crew chief???), but
if
> > it
> > > was his own decision then it shows he has some more "experience" to
> gather
> > > up at the SS tracks. What was he trying to gain? Other than the
> obvious
> > > lead? He had everything to loose....and virtually nothing to gain
> unless
> > > his car was just that much stronger than Dale's.....and the previous 5
> or
> > 6
> > > laps should have told him it wasn't! Unless Dale, Jr. thought he
could
> go
> > > high on his own....and just drive around Michael with no help (not
> > > likely).....then he should have known that Rusty would have to follow
> > > him....or he'd be "toast" and going straight to the back (which is
what
> > did
> > > happen)!
> > > But even worse! What if Rusty did go high with him? Now he forces
> > Michael
> > > (his friend and teammate) into a blocking move that would require him
to
> > > pinch Dale to the outside wall. A dangerous block....but one,
> > > IMHO......Michael was obligated to make to attempt to protect his lead
> > > position. But, what if Michael decided not to put Dale in
danger....and
> > > just let him go around? That would have been a bad thing for Dale to
> > > do......to put Michael in that position of having to decide between
> doing
> > > what the racer in him said was correct......and doing what the friend
> and
> > > teammate in him said was "safe" for Dale. Bad deal....IMHO. I think
> Dale
> > > owes Michael a personal "apology" for almost putting Michael in a
really
> > bad
> > > place! That's just my opinion.......post-race as it is. But, what do
> you
> > > guys think?
> > > Regards,
> > > Tom
-Larry
> Dale Earnhardt lost his life doing just the opposite......and I'm pretty
> sure that would be a "world opinion"......not just mine. Dale may have
been
> an aggressive driver in his early years....but he learned from his
mistakes
> on the track and became a great driver because he made good decisions in
the
> race car....and his record proves that he did. He didn't win all those
> races by deliberately choosing "no percentage" moves during any race.
> Of course had Jr. gotten "help" that would have at least made his attempt
a
> reasonable one. But, I doubt there's a NASCAR fan on this planet....or
> anyone in racing.....that would have thought Rusty would move out of the
low
> line to help him. How come Jr. thought he would?
> "Not quite sure what the big deal is; this kind of move/results happen
every
> plate race, every year."
> I disagree with you......that kind of stupid move doesn't happen with
> somebody as good as Jr. is on the SS....and with the *** DEI has
> displayed on the SS over the last two years......and a DEI stablemate in
the
> lead......Jr. making such a rookie decision....makes it a big deal.
> "His chief told him to go for the win; he didn't tell him how to do it."
> My point exactly.
> TP
> > > Guys...I'm not analyzing anything too much........and I'm not saying
> that
> > > Dale shouldn't have at least "tried" for a win. But choosing a move
> that
> > > had zero percentage of success.....isn't smart....isn't what a racer
> > should
> > > do. It was stupid...and I didn't expect Dale to be stupid in those
> kinds
> > of
> > > situations. That is what perplexes me. Not the fact that he wanted
to
> > win
> > > or wanted to try some opportunity if it presented itself. There was
no
> > > "opportunity" to win.....at the time he tried Michael on the high
side.
> > > And, I think he knows that and that's why he didn't seem very happy
with
> > > himself at the post race.
> > > His crew chief was not sitting in the car with Dale. Its likely he
> didn't
> > > even know the situation except as it appeared the last time the group
> > passed
> > > the pit lane. And when did it ever be such that the crew chief makes
> the
> > > definitive call on the move a driver makes on the track? And, this
was
> > not
> > > a "no points, run for the money shoot out." It was a season points
> > > race....not a 20-lap pickup race! And, in all the years I've been
> > following
> > > racing....or racing myself......I've never seen a "win at all costs"
> > driver
> > > have any long term success in racing. Can anyone? C'mon guys!
> > > TP
> > Oh, I don't know; Dale Earnhardt was a "win at all costs" driver, and
he
> > did alright :) Fwiw, if Jr. had had help, he had a very good
opportunity
> of
> > winning on the outside IMO.
> > Bet he would have blown right by Waltrip, with help. But that's not
> what
> > happened. Not quite sure what the big deal is; this kind of
move/results
> > happen every plate race, every year.
> > His chief told him to go for the win; he didn't tell him how to do it.
> > Guess I just don't understand what the big deal is.
> > John
> > > > You're analyzing waaay to much. He was trying to win the race.
It
> > > didn't
> > > > work. Simple as that :)
> > > > John
> > > > > I know its easy to "Monday morning quarterback" somebody's move in
a
> > > race.
> > > > > But I really was perplexed at the decision Dale, Jr. made tonight
to
> > try
> > > > > Michael "high" with only a couple laps left in the Pepsi 400.
> > > > > I am hoping somebody talked him into that (like a crew chief???),
> but
> > if
> > > > it
> > > > > was his own decision then it shows he has some more "experience"
to
> > > gather
> > > > > up at the SS tracks. What was he trying to gain? Other than the
> > > obvious
> > > > > lead? He had everything to loose....and virtually nothing to gain
> > > unless
> > > > > his car was just that much stronger than Dale's.....and the
previous
> 5
> > > or
> > > > 6
> > > > > laps should have told him it wasn't! Unless Dale, Jr. thought he
> > could
> > > go
> > > > > high on his own....and just drive around Michael with no help (not
> > > > > likely).....then he should have known that Rusty would have to
> follow
> > > > > him....or he'd be "toast" and going straight to the back (which is
> > what
> > > > did
> > > > > happen)!
> > > > > But even worse! What if Rusty did go high with him? Now he
forces
> > > > Michael
> > > > > (his friend and teammate) into a blocking move that would require
> him
> > to
> > > > > pinch Dale to the outside wall. A dangerous block....but one,
> > > > > IMHO......Michael was obligated to make to attempt to protect his
> lead
> > > > > position. But, what if Michael decided not to put Dale in
> > danger....and
> > > > > just let him go around? That would have been a bad thing for Dale
> to
> > > > > do......to put Michael in that position of having to decide
between
> > > doing
> > > > > what the racer in him said was correct......and doing what the
> friend
> > > and
> > > > > teammate in him said was "safe" for Dale. Bad deal....IMHO. I
> think
> > > Dale
> > > > > owes Michael a personal "apology" for almost putting Michael in a
> > really
> > > > bad
> > > > > place! That's just my opinion.......post-race as it is. But,
what
> do
> > > you
> > > > > guys think?
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > > Tom
--
Fester
I have a feeling that he was influenced by the recent F1 team orders
controversy. You know "no last minute challanges of a teammate." etc.
After the race I thought I heard him say something like "well at least we
can't be accused of using team orders."
Sort of trying to uphold the "honor" of NACAR vs. F1.
But he should have take 2nd and the points.
Just a thought.
Elrikk
> After the race I thought I heard him say something like "well at least we
> can't be accused of using team orders."
> Sort of trying to uphold the "honor" of NACAR vs. F1.
> But he should have take 2nd and the points.
--
Fester
> > I have a feeling that he was influenced by the recent F1 team orders
> > controversy. You know "no last minute challanges of a teammate." etc.
> > After the race I thought I heard him say something like "well at least
we
> > can't be accused of using team orders."
> > Sort of trying to uphold the "honor" of NACAR vs. F1.
> > But he should have take 2nd and the points.
> Except if they'd have done it like in F1, MW would have been ordered to
> pull over & let Jr. win.
> --
> Fester
Would they . . . . could they . . . . . Nah. Great stuff.
But I'm glad that Michael won. He had the better car and drive on the
night.
Elrikk
Jason
> >You don't "get" opportunities, you create them.
> Man. If I cared I'd go find the Schumacher threads from a month ago
> to see how many people argued that Schumacher did the wrong thing by
> letting Rubens win at the Mickey Mouse Ring but are now arguing that
> Jr should have sat behind his teammate last night...
> Jason
He should have taken 2nd instead of 6th (or whatever).
Elrikk
Dale knew what was going to happen if he tried that, and he was right. But,
he did it anyway because he was talked into it.
Dale had the 2nd place car. No amount of magic can over-come that. Mikey
was just a tad faster, and Dale knew damned well that Rusty Wallace would
never, ever have assisted him on the high side.
In short, he was destined to finish second, not first, and he knew it.
That's not team orders. That's the reality of racing.
The only chance Jr had of winning that race was if Mike screwed up.
-Larry
> >You don't "get" opportunities, you create them.
> Man. If I cared I'd go find the Schumacher threads from a month ago
> to see how many people argued that Schumacher did the wrong thing by
> letting Rubens win at the Mickey Mouse Ring but are now arguing that
> Jr should have sat behind his teammate last night...
> Jason
I'm sorry I just can't agree with that.
dave henrie
:)
> Would they . . . . could they . . . . . Nah. Great stuff.
> But I'm glad that Michael won. He had the better car and drive on the
> night.
--
Fester
> > Shrug. Guess we'll agree to disagree on just about every point then
:)
> > No big deal.
> > John
> I'm sorry I just can't agree with that.
> dave henrie
> :)
:)
John
p.s. depends on what your definition of is, is.
