rec.autos.simulators

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

Paul Jage

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by Paul Jage » Fri, 09 Nov 2001 15:37:49

Just started to learn Phoenix and Bristol tracks in Nascar 4, and wondered
whether people use brakes before the turns, or just let off the gas earlier
and coast/throttle around the corners?

Thanks

PJ

MadDAW

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by MadDAW » Fri, 09 Nov 2001 19:07:00

Oh man I started messing with Bristol last night myself. I can't seam to use
the brakes in the corners because they lock up way to easy IMO. I'm using
the setups that were posted below in the N4-The driving line thread as being
'stable' setups, off course this could just be the fool behind the wheel
too.

MadDAWG

Mike Grand

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by Mike Grand » Fri, 09 Nov 2001 22:57:39

I apply the brakes before entering the turn just to set the car. If the cars
setup right it should steer through the turn pretty much by itself.


Dave Henri

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by Dave Henri » Fri, 09 Nov 2001 23:32:54

  Two things...like the man said...brake BEFORE the corner...and 2nd...if
your wheel/pedal combo has some calibration software, like the Thrustmapper
stuff for TM wheels, tweek the pedal settings to minimize your braking.  Or
try CTFJ to lower the inputs your pedals return.  Your car will still stop
and you won't lock up so much.
dave henrie

Gerald Moo

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by Gerald Moo » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 00:12:24

I think braking is very necessary at Phoennix, where you have
relatively little banking to help the car turn.  You'd never be able
to get up to full speed on the straights before you'd have to be off
the gas if you don't use the brake to help slow the car for turn in.

Bristol is much the same, but you can get by with a lot less brake
here, since the banking is steeper.  Even so, the lap times are so
short that even a tenth slower can get you lapped in about 180 laps.
So you do want to use some brake to sqeeze the last bits of speed out
of the car if you are in a league that runs long races.  More
importantly, braking can help stabilize the car, and it pays to be
used to braking so that you know how the car is going to respond when
you have to brake to avoid trouble, or when entering the pits.

That being said, I think you can learn a lot about driving the proper
line by not using the brakes at first.  Practice getting as fast as
possible without using them, and then start to let off a little later
and use a little brake to decelerate more quickly and arrive at the
turn in at the same speed.  Always concentrate on running the optimal
line (or whatever alternate line you happen to be practicing).
Continue to lift later and use more brake until you either arrive at
the turn-in going too fast or you are smoking the tires.  It's a lot
harder than it sounds, and it is why (some of) the pros get paid lots
of money.

All THAT being said, the real key to going fast is being able to get
back into full acceleration as early as possible.  This will make the
biggest difference on the track.

HTH,
Gerald Moore


> Just started to learn Phoenix and Bristol tracks in Nascar 4, and wondered
> whether people use brakes before the turns, or just let off the gas earlier
> and coast/throttle around the corners?

> Thanks

> PJ

MadDAW

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by MadDAW » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 00:41:30

I have the Logi FF wheel I think that has some settings for each axis so
I'll give that a try. I do brake before the corner because if I even so much
as touch the brake pedal in the corners I'm off for a slide. My left foot
hurts from holding up wile I'm pushing down, if that makes any sence. Come
to think about it I just redid my system and I couldn't find my old back cd
so I had to get the new Logi software ver 4.11. Up until now I had always
been using the 3.62, maybe there is the differance.

Thanks
MadDAWG

SimRace

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by SimRace » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 00:57:06


That LWFF is part of the deal DAWG. I had one for a long while and gave up
on the pedals because they are way to easy to lockup. Matter of fact I gave
up on the whole wheel, but that's beside the point. I hear that putting a
squash ball or raquet ball under the brake pedal will help with the lockups
since the pedal only travels about ?" max and had a soso spring in it. And
yes, holding your foot up while braking is understandable to those poor
souls of us who have had to try to run with that crappy pedal arrangement,
:)

Best of luck to you, you seem to understand where the problem lies. I fixed
mine with a TSW2, but I would try the "ball under the brake" thing if
upgrading wheels is a big deal, maybe you could just score some new
pedals...

nrvsrec

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by nrvsrec » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 02:34:28

At Bristol I brake *before* I start turning into the corner. I stab the
brakes quick then let it coast into the corner. I use the brakes constantly
at Phoenix. No particular style though. Not enough track time yet.

--
-------------------------------------------
Morgan Vincent Wooten
http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/~mvwooten
-------------------------------------------


David Ciemn

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by David Ciemn » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 09:50:57

Dave you use ctfj? I used it some time ago but have been messing with it of
late. What do you have your brake and other settings set to if I may ask.

Dave C.

>   Two things...like the man said...brake BEFORE the corner...and 2nd...if
> your wheel/pedal combo has some calibration software, like the
Thrustmapper
> stuff for TM wheels, tweek the pedal settings to minimize your braking.
Or
> try CTFJ to lower the inputs your pedals return.  Your car will still stop
> and you won't lock up so much.
> dave henrie


> > Oh man I started messing with Bristol last night myself. I can't seam to
> use
> > the brakes in the corners because they lock up way to easy IMO. I'm
using
> > the setups that were posted below in the N4-The driving line thread as
> being
> > 'stable' setups, off course this could just be the fool behind the wheel
> > too.

> > MadDAWG

Dave Henri

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by Dave Henri » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 10:11:45

  Sorry I haven't used it in awhile either.  The TM software with my pro
dig2 works just fine...I have a very soft brake input...only locks up when I
jam the pedal quickly and to the limit....
dave henrie

MadDAW

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by MadDAW » Sat, 10 Nov 2001 22:34:12

Well I think I found some of the problem anyway. The setups I downloaded to
try had the front to rear ratio set to 75% front. I think the default
setting in the fast setup is 60 or 65. I went back to the fast setup and it
was better, still not great, but better. I tried the squash ball trick but
didn't like it because it cut down even more the already limited travel. For
the most part I don't even use brakes when racing. i think its from years of
using the crappy Logi pedals. Oh well when the Logi brakes it will be time
to try something else.

Thanks
MadDAWG

SimRace

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by SimRace » Sun, 11 Nov 2001 03:08:40


True, changing the brake bias backwards will help with the front lockups,
but at the same time will introduce a little looseness in the rear when
braking. Its all preference and what you can get your particular setup to do
(setup being wheel/pedals and car setup). In all fairness to Logi, I hear
they have fixed they pedal issue a little better in their new Momo model.
The pedals appear the same (aside from cosmetics) but apparently have more
travel, a better spring feel, and the software apparently allows for more
adjustment now.

MadDAW

N4-Braking At Phoenix and Bristol

by MadDAW » Sun, 11 Nov 2001 03:42:08

I just got the latest 4.11 version of the wingman software, and your right
ther is alot more adjustment.  I took and set the travel down to 80% in the
Wingman profiler after calibrating the axis in N4. Over all this cuts down
on the max braking, but does make it a little easier to keep it from locking
up.

MadDAWG


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