rec.autos.simulators

by **Mike Donnelly J** » Mon, 26 Feb 2001 05:12:53

> On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 05:44:19 GMT, Mike Donnelly Jr

> >Safety effort in NASCAR has always lagged behind
> >safety needs. CART and F1 have had that one area which they tend to shine.

> I think the higher safety consciousness due to a driver (or fan)
> fatality or near-fatality (ie: reactive vs. proactive safety measures)
> is true in all series, it's just human nature. You can find many
> hypothetical safety problems, but until the results are right in front
> of you, you don't fully comprehend the consequences.

> Think of wheel tethers (C***te and Michigan fans) or soft
> barriers (Blundell in Rio) in CART, chicanes (Senna) and greater head
> protection (Senna/Wendlinger) in F1, throttle cutoffs (A. Petty and
> Irwin) in NASCAR.

Chicanes are not a safety feature. I've seen them cause more wrecks then they
could ever prevent. Throttle cutoffs was the proverbial 'knee-jerk' reaction
that NASCAR claims it wants to avoid. Asking the drivers, it's rather useless.
I'd say the first really usefull safety item that came about as a proactive
measure (sort of) was the roof-flaps in NASCAR. Even then, it was a problem
that NASCAR had encountered and 'fixed' by adding the restrictor plate. Now
that speeds were coming up, they added the roof flaps to prevent cars from
flying into the grandstands. NASCAR hasn't ever been pro-active. Initiative is
something that is left to individual crew chiefs. Once they cross over and
start carrying a NASCAR badge, it goes out the window seemingly.

Question is, how many drivers have to die before NASCAR clues into the idea that
something is wrong?

by **Eldre** » Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:10:26

>> > I am just wondering, did Dale's car whip back to the right by itself ,
>or
>> > was he trying to catch the spin?

>I was very suprised he tried to save it actaully, but being from the same
>town as Gordon Smiley its been kinda drummed into my head you never ever
>turn right at all on an oval. Gordon's Indy car did the same thing many
>years ago at Indy. The result was the same. The cars rear tires gripped
>and he turned straight into the wall.

I think it's just instinct to steer into the skid. I know *I've* done it in
sims...although with the same results. Haven't you?

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Davi** » Tue, 27 Feb 2001 14:02:34

Well yes I have, but I will say sims are vastly different the real life.
Even the little bit of Autocrossing I do beat the heck out of running GPL,
N3 or any other game.

I watched the Indy 500 last year just waiting for Montoya to end up in the
wall. Lap after lap I watched the rear end of his car twitch in turn one,
infact more then guys who ended up in the wall. Juan did catch it every
lap and it was amazing. At Daytona the one thing I remember distinctly was
why is he turning the wheel to the right. There was no tire smoke at all
so the car was really hooked up when it turned right.

I guess it did really show the world Dale was like everyone in the world
human. a Great Racer, but human none the less and well humans make
mistakes.

dave

by **Eldre** » Fri, 02 Mar 2001 09:24:22

>> I think it's just instinct to steer into the skid. I know *I've* done it
>in
>> sims...although with the same results. Haven't you?

>> Eldred
>> --

>Well yes I have, but I will say sims are vastly different the real life.
>Even the little bit of Autocrossing I do beat the heck out of running GPL,
>N3 or any other game.

I know(or imagine), and I'm jealous!<g> But what I'm saying is when you learn
to drive, you learn to steer into the skid. I even had to do it(once or
twice<g>) at Laguna Seca last year. I've never driven on an oval, though. I'm
not so sure it's an easy habit to break...

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73

Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Mike Donnelly J** » Fri, 02 Mar 2001 09:26:51

It's one of the things that they teach you in recovering from a spin. I'd
imagine if you look at Dale's front wheels when he hits the wall they're cranked
all the way to the left as he's trying to save the over-correction that was the
result of getting off the apron.

I *have* recovered from some loose conditions by turning into the spin. But,
only if you do it very early. For the most part, I have yet to catch a N4
Dodge... Haven't tried any other cars, but I suspect it's much the same.

> >> > I am just wondering, did Dale's car whip back to the right by itself ,
> >or
> >> > was he trying to catch the spin?

> >I was very suprised he tried to save it actaully, but being from the same
> >town as Gordon Smiley its been kinda drummed into my head you never ever
> >turn right at all on an oval. Gordon's Indy car did the same thing many
> >years ago at Indy. The result was the same. The cars rear tires gripped
> >and he turned straight into the wall.

> I think it's just instinct to steer into the skid. I know *I've* done it in
> sims...although with the same results. Haven't you?

> Eldred
> --
> Dale Earnhardt, Sr. 1951-2001
> Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
> GPL F1 hcp. +28.67...F2 +151.26...F3 hcp. +373.73

> Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
> with experience...
> Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

by **Davi** » Fri, 02 Mar 2001 10:38:00

I understand that and well its also very well known you do not turn right
on an oval. Reason being was viewed very graphically at Daytona. I am not
talking about road racing or road driving, but oval racing. And not in a
Sim either.

In a game or in real life on a high speed oval. there is a big difference.
The game cannot model everything.

Dave

rec.autos.simulators

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.

Dale Sr. didn't want H.A.N.S.