rec.autos.simulators

Quite a while back someone posted about replacing the pedals on his LWFF
with a unit of his own choosing and got the standard "sure, just re-wire
them" answer. At the time I cautioned that, IMO, if not an actual resistance
value, the LWFF control unit would expect a certain "range" of potentiometer
travel and was instantly chargrilled for the suggestion. Posters were
adamant: "just change the wirering to conform to the LWFF harness and
enjoy".

I backed off because I had neither the time to experiment myself, nor to
argue, but this episode left me feeling quite miffed at being talked down
upon in an area which I consider an expertise. I am an electronics engineer,
now having 12 years of experience in embedded control circuit design, so
while I don't know exactly how an LWFF (or any other digital game
controller) works, I have pretty good idea how I would go about building one
and therefore think I would make the same assumptions as its designers. That
said, I had also read about many success stories, so there was the
possibility the "WingMan Team" had a couple nifty tricks up their sleeve.

To cut a long story short, last X-Mas time I attempted to wire my TM NasPro
pedals to the LWFF, didn't get good results and fixed it. It's taken 'till
now to find the time to put up a page and make some drawings to share my
findings for the benefit of others cursed with "LWWF-incompatible" pedals
they happen to like. The story continues here:

http://www.racesimcentral.net/

I know the link looks weird, but it does work.

Jan.
=---
PS. : and in case you're trying to play amateur psychologist, yes, I do
consider this page public vindication. Make of that what you will. ;-)

Wayne Bradley

Try firering up the LWFF control panel. Do the indicators correspond
*exactly* to the pedal travel or is there some residual indication or dead
travel present? Do the pedals work correctly in games that take their
calibration from Win95/98/ME? -I'd be most surprised if it were an exact
match.

I have tested this thoroughly and unless the potentiometer (through its
mechanical configuration) has the required 1/3rd to full range travel it
does not work. I'd be very amazed if all pedal sets I've heard about being
connected (TSW, CH Pro, F1 Sim, etc...) provide exactly that kind of range
and my TM NasPro pedal set is the exception (wouldn't have worked with
original pots either).

So in closing, if your set works to your satisfaction for the games you use
it in when wired one-to-one then great, suits you Sir, but it's NOT ALWAYS
the case. Therefore I expect my reservations and now this page to be taken
seriously.

Got that?? -Good. ;-))

BTW: you've just given me an idea for a sig... check it out! ;-)

Jan.
=---
"Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn.

<snip>

Jan,

I too am one of the "lucky ones", my MSFF pedals work OK and the travel
matches the graphic in in the LWFF control panel.

I like the new sig. I ALWAYS pay attention to anything you say about the
LWFF. I'd particularly like to thank you for the advice about loose wheels,
mine is much better since I took a wrench to it.

--
Tony Whitley
GPLRank +7.83
"What, I say what, is going on there, boy?" ibid.

Take a look at my web pages for some LWFF tips (addy in sig) oh and I
just got another batch of steering pots done if anyone still needs one.

Cheers.

MikeT.

--

http://website.lineone.net/~mikebay/MTIndex.htm

Just to add to the database; when I plugged my LWF's wiring into the pots on
my CH pedals, everything worked fine, with apparently correct calibration
and action on the Logitech control panel.  But then looking at it in
DXTweak, the extreme ends of the travel were being ignored.  A small error,
probably not noticeable to most, but in any case easily fixable with
DXTweak.  And as the same held true for the oem-equipment steering values, I
don't think it was the CH pots so much as the Logitech calibration routine.
As noted in another post, I'd think DXTweak should be able to sort out the
ranges, no matter what pedals you use.  Look at the values your controller
is reporting, plug them into the calibration settings and you should be set.

Cheers,

Steve B.

<snip>

TSW, CH, MSFF... it *is* just me and my TM pedals, isn't it? ;-)

Oh well, at least the working principle is out there now, so anyone who
manages to find another set of pedals that doesn't work at all knows what to
do...

Jan.
=----
"Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn.

Mark

<SNIP>

Don't get defensive guy. I just said it worked by simply connecting it to my
TSW pedals. I have the FULL range in all calibration utilities.  Matter of
fact back when I made this change , GPL and N3 had almost the same number
range.

Either way I was NOT discrediting what you wrote. I think it is absolutely
great that you take the time to post this info and I also think that the
info on the page is exactly the solution to most people problems regarding
this.

And your sig has to do with me how? I read your post, went to your WEB page
and read the ENTIRE thing and THOUGHT this is the solution to the exact
problem you mentioned.

I just didn't see the problem and yes it does work completely. I have tried
both sets of pedals by just slipping it off the TSW's and putting it back in
the LWFF pedals.

Viola... Smoke Puck

peace,
Wayne

probably wrong but I think he has some info regarding this.

Wayne

Thanks,
Wayne

Apart from the pedalmod page I have nothing "in writing", so to speak.
Sorry.

Jan.
=----
"Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn.

<snip>

Well, maybe I did overreact a bit... I apologise for the tone of my post.

Look at it from my point of view though. I'd taken great care to explain
that one shouldn't take for granted the ability of a given pedal set to work
with the LWFF, wetn as far as explaining some basic electronics theory and
going into detail as to why certain cases don't work. Maybe I made the wrong
assumption that posters here would be mindfull of one of the basics of
scientific theory, i.e. it only takes one repeatable experiment to disprove
a theory, but imagine my exasperation when the first response I got was of
the "but it worked for me!!"-variety.

Thank you.

Bit of a misunderstanding here... maybe I worded that one wrong. I'd been
looking for something to put as a sig for a long time and suddenly it just
clicked. Foghorn Leghorn is possibily my favorite WB toon character and I
have a tendency to use the same style of argumentation (i.e. the steamroller
approach). So it's got everything: I like the quote, it says something about
my character and it's a deliciously tongue in cheek hint at some of my
history on this group. So, nothing to do with you, everything to do with the
reaction you sparked from me.

Does seem like me and my modified TM NasPro pedals (wouldn't work with
original pots either, IMO) are the odd ones out, doesn't it? -Who'd have
guessed, I certainly wouldn't have bet on it.

Cheers,

Jan.
=----
"Pay attention when I'm talking to you boy!" -Foghorn Leghorn.

There's really not much to it; DXTweak reports the values from your
controller on the left side of its interface.  Look at the raw values in the
directinput section as you move your controller through its full range of
motion for each axis.  Then set the calibration min/max values for those
axes on the right side to match.  Presto; full use of your controller's
travel.  If you want to get tricky, you can also set the end values to make
your controller more/less sensitive.  With steering, for example, setting
the calibration end values higher than the raw values will make it less
sensitive.  This trick made the ridiculously twitchy steering in the Rally
Championship demo work fine.  And doing the opposite makes the steering very
sensitive for motorbike sims like SBK or GP500.  Playing with the end
numbers, you can match the wheel tilt to bike tilt almost exactly.

Very handy little tool, DXTweak; much quicker than hex-editing the values
used to be.  Thanks to the Wingmanteam guys for handing it over!

Cheers,

Steve B.