Larry
> > Eldred
> Yup..N2k2 just plain wouldn't work with some hardware and other drives
> died trying to load it...
> dave henrie
> Unrelated, but related, how about that copy protected music CD that was
> taking down Macintosh Hardware in droves before the word got out?
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels"
--Groucho Marx--
Larry
> > Unrelated, but related, how about that copy protected music CD that was
> > taking down Macintosh Hardware in droves before the word got out?
> Don't get me started on copy protected music CD's that won't play in car
> stereos or PC's, guess what, I use a PC as my home stereo
> Beers and cheers
> (uncle) Goy
> "goyl at nettx dot no"
> "The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/
> "A man is only as old as the woman he feels"
> --Groucho Marx--
Do we have any lawyers in the group? Perhaps we should be filing class
action suits against the RETAILERS. If I go to the music store to buy a cd
and it is copy protected...does that not mean I didn't actually buy a cd
but some sort of 'other' disc? If the retailer is selling these discs
under the pretense that they actually are cd's then I would think we would
have a pretty clear cut case.
BTW...after writing my diatribe about Sierra, I went back and examined
the box and cd and have not been able to find the official Phillips CD
insignia. Anyone seen it? By that I think Sierra admits the paticular
form of copy-protection they have purchased violates the Phillips
protocols.
dave henrie
http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/29619.html
--
__________
Steve
> Larry
> > > You obviously didn't see all the reports of CD drives dying when N2002
> > > came out...
> > > Eldred
> > Yup..N2k2 just plain wouldn't work with some hardware and other drives
> > died trying to load it...
> > dave henrie
> > Unrelated, but related, how about that copy protected music CD that was
> > taking down Macintosh Hardware in droves before the word got out?
> > Larry
> Do we have any lawyers in the group? Perhaps we should be filing class
> action suits against the RETAILERS. If I go to the music store to buy a cd
> and it is copy protected...does that not mean I didn't actually buy a cd
> but some sort of 'other' disc? If the retailer is selling these discs
> under the pretense that they actually are cd's then I would think we would
> have a pretty clear cut case.
> BTW...after writing my diatribe about Sierra, I went back and examined
> the box and cd and have not been able to find the official Phillips CD
> insignia. Anyone seen it? By that I think Sierra admits the paticular
> form of copy-protection they have purchased violates the Phillips
> protocols.
--
Olav Malmin
remove .spam when replying
> So you are ok then with companies like macrovision hiding files outside
> of your disk format area then? You could install a program like Turbo tax.
> Then uninstall it, delete the remaining folders, format your C:\ drive and
> they still would have active files running when you re-installed windows.
> Do you know that macrovision bought cdilla(Spyware) and use some form of it
> with their latest copy protection schemes?
I recently reinstalled Medieval: Total War on a newly formatted disk.
Funny thing is, the game never asked me to supply the CD-Key the
second time! Now my mind is whirling...
I've noticed this before with certain games. Are there any lists
which detail which drives to avoid?
I have a friend who bought a new audio CD(can't remember the artist). He
called me up and said that his CD drive in his computer stopped working after
he tried to play it. I had to replace the CD drive for him - the old one was
DEAD...
Eldred
--
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
GPLRank:-1.680
MonsterRank: +334.169
N2002 Rank:+17.59
Never argue with an idiot. He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.
> Note that with music cd's with the copy protection stuff is also not
> marked with anything reffering to it as a cd. Let's hereby call is
> round-aluminum-thingy-with-digital-music-on and not buy it :)
Beers and cheers
(uncle) Goy
"goyl at nettx dot no"
"The Pits" http://www.theuspits.com/
"A man is only as old as the woman he feels"
--Groucho Marx--
>> So you are ok then with companies like macrovision hiding files
>> outside
>> of your disk format area then? You could install a program like
>> Turbo tax. Then uninstall it, delete the remaining folders, format
>> your C:\ drive and they still would have active files running when
>> you re-installed windows. Do you know that macrovision bought
>> cdilla(Spyware) and use some form of it with their latest copy
>> protection schemes?
> How would one detect whether or not this was happening? Is there any
> way to get rid of it once and for all?
Nope not that I'm aware of....I guess read the forums at places like
Daemon-tools.com and you'll get a pretty good feeling for what programs are
more trouble than others.. Also you might want to check out the ad-aware
and spybot sites...those will clue you in on what programs are hiding stuff
on your hard drive.
dave henrie
ps
imagine if you went to Firestone to buy some tires...and left with
lugnuts that only a special firestone wrench could remove...or drove off
with a GPS tranmitter sending you every move....that stuff already happens
with computers...it should be just as unthinkable...but it ain't.
dh
I certainly understand the point of your "open letter"....and your right to
express your opinion about the copy protection programming used on the
NASCAR 2003 CD program. I also happen to agree with your conclusions, 120%.
However, Dave....I wonder how wise it was to use this public forum (a
popular sim racing newsgroup) to express your opinion to
Sierra/Papyrus/Vivendi. I would point out to you that "civil disobedience"
is an American concept, but it isn't applicable in civil law (not in this
country at least). You have expressly and directly admitted to personal
actions that violate multiple sections of the Papyrus/Sierra/Vivendi EULA
(End User License Agreement) and the Sierra.com "Terms of Use" agreement,
which you agreed to abide by.......through installation of the NASCAR 2003
CD on your computer. You are now subject to being sued (through the courts
of the State of California) for unspecified damages, and if you do not
prevail in your defense (not likely since you've admitted to these acts
publicly), the attorney fees not only for yourself, but for
Papyrus/Sierra/Vivendi to bring this action upon you. I can tell you
through direct experience, those fees will approach $40,000....just for
their side alone, plus your own attorney fees (and travel to California for
court appearances). At the very least, you can probably count on your CD
key and Sierra.com online racing account being cancelled (permanently).
I only hope Papyrus/Sierra/Vivendi legal department is as lenient with you
as they were with me two years ago.....when I pulled a similar (stupid)
stunt!
I consider you one of my best friends.....from the online racing
"***world".....I really hope you have not totally screwed yourself
here....just to make a point (no matter how valid). Geeeze, Dave....what
were you thinking?
Having "been there, done that"....my regards,
Tom
PS: To anyone asking Dave to help you do something similar.....you can
probably count on joining Dave's defense...as well as adding to the amount
of damages awarded if he loses. You are not doing yourself, or Dave any
good.......send him a private email if you are so inclined to ask for the
program(s) he used.
<sniippers>
Perhaps the use of EULA's need to be reigned in. I would guess the
only real course of action would be to ban my cd key. I haven't checked
that. :) The Courts can chase me but I'm not much of a catch. Thanks
for your words of caution. I would advise others to keep quiet...just in
case...
Veni, Vendi, Vivendi...latin for ??
dave henrie
Larry
> Do we have any lawyers in the group? Perhaps we should be filing
class
> action suits against the RETAILERS. If I go to the music store to buy a
cd
> and it is copy protected...does that not mean I didn't actually buy a cd
> but some sort of 'other' disc? If the retailer is selling these discs
> under the pretense that they actually are cd's then I would think we would
> have a pretty clear cut case.
> BTW...after writing my diatribe about Sierra, I went back and examined
> the box and cd and have not been able to find the official Phillips CD
> insignia. Anyone seen it? By that I think Sierra admits the paticular
> form of copy-protection they have purchased violates the Phillips
> protocols.
> dave henrie
And it isn't just me. When I went to CompUSA to buy the package, the
TurboTax end-caps and shelves were completely full and the TaxCut shelves
and end-caps were nearly bare. One of the sales clerks there said they had
cases and cases and cases of TurboTax stacked up in the back and that they
couldn't GIVE it away this year.
I guess Intuit has forgotten that anyone who is willing to tackle their own
Taxes on their computer are probably experienced enough to read the major
computing news stories online that reported what Intuit had done to it's
customers.
Oh, well. Their loss. I got my taxes done just as fast, and cheaper
TaxCut. Thanks Intuit for screwing up and forcing me to try the
competition!
Larry
> Well to use the Turbo Tax example...the users made such a stink about
it
> that microbrai..I mean Macrovision had to write a patch to remove the
> crap...which of course makes TT non-functional. I got my refund and one
of
> two rebate checks...as soon as the last one clears I'm sending them a big
> *** letter and removing it for good. I have already un-installed TT but
> the Cdilla folder is still there(SUPRISE!)
> Other than that... keeping up on sites like PCmag.com might give more
> info on what companies are really stepping over the line.
Every I could do it, but it is just not that big of a deal to switch out the
CD.
--
Brian Tate
DSTP Motorsports Public Relations
http://www.dstpmotorsports.com http://www.toyotaatlantic.com
