rec.autos.simulators

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

The Drive

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by The Drive » Thu, 27 Sep 2001 17:05:29

I hope a lot of you watched this program about the crash in May 94, haven
been into F1 since 84, and even more so a Fan of Senna i found it
interesting about the way they translated the data from the logging system
to explain what happened. I think most people come to understand that the
steering colum hadn`t broking but because of the fact the suspension pecied
his helmet made a bad accident 100x worse....
What was odd was though... that employes of the TV station at the time said
they had the footage going all the way into the wall..... but when it went
to court they said they didn`t...?
I won`t feel any better if i did see the footage, but the computer
simulation of the Williams car looked good.....
The film thats being wrote at the min..seems that it will be realeased in
2004 which makes it good for tens years on.. and i hope it reflects more on
his desire to win at all costs.. even from a young boy racing down his
street in brazil on his go cart...
When i was about 4 years old.. i used to race down a road near where i lived
called " cowlane " it was about1/2 a mile long... and had an incline of
about 60feet.. so it was very step and very fast... many a time i crashed my
go-kart or rolled or a wheel feel off or i would fly over a friend, but many
a times i would win... and thoses 1 min runs... gave me a little taste of
speed..something which i have never lost, but also only a fraction of what
senna had and gave back to the world...
I loved him as a racer, and miss him still to this day, i will never ever
forget !
Thank you forever !
Andy Laurenc

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Andy Laurenc » Thu, 27 Sep 2001 17:16:55

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Not much I can add to that, his desire was what captured me.  It's a pity
you didn't post yesterday so I knew it was on :-(

Andy
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MP

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by MP » Thu, 27 Sep 2001 22:18:59



People keep publishing this myth. Senna died when the wheel struck his
helmet and inflicted severe brain injury. There was no penetration by
any suspension parts.

- MichaelJP

SimRace

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by SimRace » Fri, 28 Sep 2001 02:00:39

That was always my understanding of the cause of his untimely death MP.
(tire, not parts)




> > I think most people come to understand that the
> > steering colum hadn`t broking but because of the fact the suspension
pecied
> > his helmet made a bad accident 100x worse....

> People keep publishing this myth. Senna died when the wheel struck his
> helmet and inflicted severe brain injury. There was no penetration by
> any suspension parts.

> - MichaelJP

Rick Baumhaue

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Rick Baumhaue » Fri, 28 Sep 2001 12:20:53

Then I guess you guys haven't seen the pictures of his helmet with the hole
in it?  How about the *** on the side of the car?  Senna *did not* die of
blunt force trauma (ie, tire), he died because a suspension arm, still
attached to the wheel, penetrated his helmet (and his skull) above the right
eye.  This is stated in so many different sources, I can't believe you're
calling it a myth............


> That was always my understanding of the cause of his untimely death MP.
> (tire, not parts)





> > > I think most people come to understand that the
> > > steering colum hadn`t broking but because of the fact the suspension
> pecied
> > > his helmet made a bad accident 100x worse....

> > People keep publishing this myth. Senna died when the wheel struck his
> > helmet and inflicted severe brain injury. There was no penetration by
> > any suspension parts.

> > - MichaelJP

Stuart Becktel

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Stuart Becktel » Fri, 28 Sep 2001 12:50:28

Hence him being listed as brain dead when they pulled the plug on him...it
is a fact, horrible, but it is a fact.
-Stuart Becktell

> Then I guess you guys haven't seen the pictures of his helmet with the
hole
> in it?  How about the *** on the side of the car?  Senna *did not* die
of
> blunt force trauma (ie, tire), he died because a suspension arm, still
> attached to the wheel, penetrated his helmet (and his skull) above the
right
> eye.  This is stated in so many different sources, I can't believe you're
> calling it a myth............



> > That was always my understanding of the cause of his untimely death MP.
> > (tire, not parts)





> > > > I think most people come to understand that the
> > > > steering colum hadn`t broking but because of the fact the suspension
> > pecied
> > > > his helmet made a bad accident 100x worse....

> > > People keep publishing this myth. Senna died when the wheel struck his
> > > helmet and inflicted severe brain injury. There was no penetration by
> > > any suspension parts.

> > > - MichaelJP

Tony Whitle

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Tony Whitle » Sun, 30 Sep 2001 02:53:34

On the program they explicitly said that it was the tyre that killed him.
I've always understood that it was the suspension arm. Doesn't anyone have a
URL for the autopsy photos so we can settle this...


> Hence him being listed as brain dead when they pulled the plug on him...it
> is a fact, horrible, but it is a fact.
> -Stuart Becktell


> > Then I guess you guys haven't seen the pictures of his helmet with the
> hole
> > in it?  How about the *** on the side of the car?  Senna *did not* die
> of
> > blunt force trauma (ie, tire), he died because a suspension arm, still
> > attached to the wheel, penetrated his helmet (and his skull) above the
> right
> > eye.  This is stated in so many different sources, I can't believe
you're
> > calling it a myth............



> > > That was always my understanding of the cause of his untimely death
MP.
> > > (tire, not parts)





> > > > > I think most people come to understand that the
> > > > > steering colum hadn`t broking but because of the fact the
suspension
> > > pecied
> > > > > his helmet made a bad accident 100x worse....

> > > > People keep publishing this myth. Senna died when the wheel struck
his
> > > > helmet and inflicted severe brain injury. There was no penetration
by
> > > > any suspension parts.

> > > > - MichaelJP

Eldre

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Eldre » Tue, 02 Oct 2001 08:06:40



This is the first time I've even SEEN someone say the tire killed him.  I
didn't know the program was on either... :(

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +360.54...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Rick Baumhaue

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by Rick Baumhaue » Tue, 02 Oct 2001 21:27:50

Eldred,

It was a bit outside our viewing area - UK only :^)

And as I've explained elsewhere, the confusion stems from a seeming
contradiction between "the tire hit him in the head" and "a piece of
suspension penentrated his helmet".  However, there is no contradiction when
you realize that both things happened - the tire did hit him, and a piece of
suspension *attached to the tire/wheel/hub assembly* penetrated his helmet,
with all of that weight and force behind it.

Whether the tire (by itself, without the helmet penetration) would have
killed him anyways, I don't know, but I have seen a number of references to
his skull being crushed above the right eyebrow, corresponding to the
location of the hole in his helmet.

Rick




> >On the program they explicitly said that it was the tyre that killed him.
> >I've always understood that it was the suspension arm. Doesn't anyone
have a
> >URL for the autopsy photos so we can settle this...

> This is the first time I've even SEEN someone say the tire killed him.  I
> didn't know the program was on either... :(

> Eldred

paulo_paul

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by paulo_paul » Wed, 03 Oct 2001 05:33:22

http://www.a-senna.com/Death/


> Eldred,

> It was a bit outside our viewing area - UK only :^)

> And as I've explained elsewhere, the confusion stems from a seeming
> contradiction between "the tire hit him in the head" and "a piece of
> suspension penentrated his helmet".  However, there is no contradiction
when
> you realize that both things happened - the tire did hit him, and a piece
of
> suspension *attached to the tire/wheel/hub assembly* penetrated his
helmet,
> with all of that weight and force behind it.

> Whether the tire (by itself, without the helmet penetration) would have
> killed him anyways, I don't know, but I have seen a number of references
to
> his skull being crushed above the right eyebrow, corresponding to the
> location of the hole in his helmet.

> Rick





> > >On the program they explicitly said that it was the tyre that killed
him.
> > >I've always understood that it was the suspension arm. Doesn't anyone
> have a
> > >URL for the autopsy photos so we can settle this...

> > This is the first time I've even SEEN someone say the tire killed him.
I
> > didn't know the program was on either... :(

> > Eldred

paulo_paul

Lat nights Senna Ch4 program

by paulo_paul » Wed, 03 Oct 2001 05:48:56

Ayrton Senna Dies After Crash;
Peerless Racing King Was 34

By JOSEPH SIANO

THE NEW YORK TIMES NEWSPAPER, MONDAY, MAY 2, 1994

Ayrton Senna, a Brazilian whose laser-like focus on driving race cars made
him a three-time Formula One world champion, died yesterday after a crash
during the Sam Marino Grand Prix in Imola, Italy.

Senna, 34 years old, died of multiple skull fractures in a hospital in a
Bologna, Italy, hours after his race car veered off the Ferrari Autodrome at
almost 200 miles an hour and struck a concrete wall almost head on. The
cause of the accident was not immediately known.

Ayrton Senna da Silva was born in S?o Paulo, Brazil, on March 21, 1960, and
divided his time between homes there and in Monte Carlo, Monaco. He began
his career in kart racing as a youth, eventually rising to auto racing's
highest level, the international Grand Prix circuit, in 1984. He won the
circuit's world championship in 1988, 1990 and 1991.

He was considered the world's best driver at the time of his death.

Possibly the Greatest

He started 65 Formula One races on the pole position, the coveted spot at
the head of the field reserved for the driver who had the fastest qualifying
times for the race. His total was a record, and his 41 Grand Prix victories
was second only to the 51 victories of Alain Prost of France.

"He might have been the greatest driver of all time," said Michael Andretti,
who was Senna's Formula One teammate last year. "There was not a weakness in
Ayrton Senna."

Michael Kranefuss, the head of Ford Motor Company's international racing
activities, recalled yesterday watching Senna during a Monaco Grand Prix
practice a few years ago, going against such great rivals and fellow world
champions as Nelson Piquet, Niki Lauda and Prost.

"It was like you were watching photographers," Mr. Kranefuss said of Senna's
rivals, "and then you were watching a painting done by Michelangelo."

His success, built on an uncompromising approach in which he demanded
everything of his self and those who designed and built his race cars, made
him one of the highest-paid athletes in the world. His annual salary the
past few years was generally thought to be above $10 million, with
commercial endor***t deals adding much more.

In his native Brazil, he was a hero of the same stature as the soccer star
Pel.

"I think that just about everything can be improved," Senna said in an
article in The New York Times in March 1991. "I think as the time goes by
you have to exploit your own limits and the machine's limits."

Even when he thought he was at his limits, he said, "Perhaps if I try again,
if I concentrate even more, focus on that single thing, I might be able to
go further."

Preferred No Publicity

But success and wealth - combined with the *** politics of the Formula One
circuit and the oppressive news media focus it received - eventually made
Senna more reclusive and less revealing.

"I think he was a more relaxed person than he became after his success,"
said Raul Boesel, a fellow Brazilian now racing in the United States.

Besides being the target of an unsuccessful *** plot in Brazil a few
years ago, Senna shut himself off from the news media and other non-racing
outsiders because of intense conflicts with other drivers, most notably
Prost.

In 1989 and 1990, they took turns edging one another for the world
championship - Prost won in '89 and Senna in '90 - and had a collision with
each other in the final race each year.

"He was very intimidating," Mr. Kranefuss said of Senna's driving style. "On
the race track, he was not always a nice guy."

A Study in Concentretion

The worldwide news media attention surrounding Senna's encounters with
Prost - along with run-ins with Piquet - made him keep to himself on race
weekends so he would not loose the concentration that lifted him into a
near-translucent state when he got behind the wheel.

"Ayrton was the most misunderstood person out there because he got such a
bad rap in the media," Andretti said yesterday. "I can assure you he was a
good person. He was very supportive of me last year."

Mr. Kranefuss said, "He was very loyal to people who helped him early in his
career."

Senna was aware of his image as being difficult (he did speak to reporters
more often than Prost), but was willing to accept it in order to win

"In our activity, unfortunately, there is a lot of ego and confrontation,"
he told The Times. "That is not good for making friends."

His response to bad press was always the same: focus on driving.

"My choice is simply to do what I believe is right according to my mind and
heart," he said. "Choosing that, you are bound to make some difficult
relationships."

Senna is survived by his parents, of Tatui, Brazil, 70 miles away from S?o
Paulo.


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