rec.autos.simulators

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

Michael Barlo

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Michael Barlo » Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:00:00

        That's exactly what those settings are... Race distances.   The
differences between the F1, F2, F3 are not distances but (In GPL terms)
engine HP.  F1 is the GP car,  F2 is the advanced trainer car, F3 is the
basic trainer car.  GPL off line racing you can only race a GP car in a
race with the other AI cars.  You can only drive the F2 or F3 in
training mode which is with out any AI on the track.

        However, If you edit your player.ini file you can race against the AI
off line in any Fx car.

        Online using the GPL-GSB application, you can have it temporarily edit
your player.ini file for you and race any Fx car.

        For instructions on how to edit your ini files manually, go to
http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Go to the "F3 League" section and then to the link that says "How to get
set up for F3 (or F2) racing".  That will bring you to a page that
describes in detail how to do it.  It's really very easy and quick to do
:)

Mike


> A newbie question. I'm trying to figure out the relationship between F1, F2,
> F3 to the Novice,  Intermediate, Pro, GP settings in GPL. I've driven the
> different classes in GPL but don't notice the differences in HP in the cars,
> just the race length, damage settings, etc.

> Thanks,

> Gene



> > To sum this up... I think the new drivers to GPL should start out with
> > F3 racing and learn how to drive at speed and learn what racing is all
> > about.  Then make the transition to F2 racing.  The only true difference
> > between these types of cars would then be just the added HP.  Since you
> > already know a lot about driving, safety, and racing close, Driving the
> > F2 racing would be a whole lot better.  After getting used to the F2
> > power and getting back into the swing of racing side by side, and such,
> > then you should start F1.  The differences between F2 and F1 would then
> > be just the added power.

> > A driver that went this route (I sincerely believe) would be a true
> > Profesional driver.  Starting from the F1 cars and staying with the F1
> > cars, I don't think makes for a Pro or even mediocre driver.  I think
> > going the route of one type of class only makes for a fast hot lapper.
> > He'll gain experiance driving fast and gain experiance getting passed
> > and passing, but I don't think he'll learn much of anything out side of
> > that.

> > Just my opinion,
> > Mike
> > --
> > =========================================
> > Mike Barlow of Barlow Racing?
> > =========================================
> > Racing online with the help of......

> > Race Communications Association
> > http://www.racesimcentral.net/
> > Holodyne Engineering

> > Mystic Music

> > (have Your !!Name/Address!! placed here)

--
=========================================
Mike Barlow of Barlow Racing?
=========================================
Racing online with the help of......

Race Communications Association
http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Holodyne Engineering

Mystic Music

(have Your !!Name/Address!! placed here)

John Bodi

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by John Bodi » Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:00:00

GREAT advice, Bo -- and, ironically, my main problem when racing on-line is
because I probably spend TOO much time watching the mirrors.  Being acutely
aware of the fact that there are faster drivers on the track, I ALWAYS check
the mirrors as I approach a turn, and sometimes I find myself doing so at
the wrong moment, or missing a braking point because I was watching the
mirrors and not the road -- which is often the cause of my occasional
runoffs.

It sounds like "STAY" is the answer, though -- and thanks again for the
advice!

- JB


>On Sat, 4 Sep 1999 19:45:17 -0500, "John Bodin"

>>To stay, or not to stay -- that is the question.
>several months ago you letter could have been written by me -
>word-for-word. if not in word, in mental approach.

>so with all my months of experience, here is the answer you've been
>waiting for;

>DON'T LEAVE!!

>most of the drivers are very understanding and very helpful, and they
>have been there before.
>as another reply  said "hold your line, the faster guys will find the
>place to pass"

>like any real driving, the guy thats hits someone in the rear is AT
>FAULT! not you.
>once you overcome the fear of faster cars in your mirrors, your
>confidence builds and you lap times drop. just don't ignore your
>mirrors!
>Alison Hine told me she did over 500 laps at monza when the sim first
>came out. It takes time, dont force your learning curve, it will get
>better naturally. who said 'sometimes you must slow down to go
>faster'? its true!
>if you leave how will you improve? just relax, have fun, enjoy and
>DON'T LEAVE :)

>hope to see you on the track, and eventually on the podium!
>Bo Bruce
>>    Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
>>    http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/

John Bodi

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by John Bodi » Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:00:00




>> To stay, or not to stay -- that is the question.
>[s]
>> Am I wrong in feeling this way?  Should I go ahead and stay with it,
>> regardless of how ludicrous the situation is?  Should I go ahead and
>> overlook the fact that I would have trashed the hardware too badly to
>> continue the race and go ahead and use the "CTRL-R" option?  Do I go
ahead
>> and serve as an impediment to others when I'm too far off the pace, or
not
>> up to my usual levels of consistency?

>I think you should do what you feel like doing! Aim to stay, but if it's
>a totally rubbish experience after you feel you have given it your best
>shot, and you want to leave...

Seems like good, sound advice!

AMEN!  I agree wholeheartedly on this -- I've made more improvements since I
started racing on-line that I did with months of hotlapping and racing
against the AI.  THIS is VERY good advice, I think.

- Show quoted text -

This is definitely an issue -- the fast drivers need to realize that racing
and hotlapping are VERY different beasts.  Then again, real drivers have
problems with this in the real world, too -- Paul Tracy is one example of a
good, fast driver who often becomes just another bonehead hotlapper in the
heat of battle.  The point is, I think, that there are problems at both
extremes -- a poor, slow driver is no more of an impediment than a fast
driver who is a poor racer.

In other words, there ARE no absolutes! <G>

- Show quoted text -

Turbojo

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Turbojo » Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:00:00

It looks like a great number of racers agree with me about not leaving races
prematurely( Also see my post "VROC.... why bother") Unfortunately I just
haven't had the chance to hook up with them in my limited amount of online
races. Reading others posts about the experiences they have had makes me
think about maybe giving it another try. I just don't have a lot of time to
devote to this and it would be nice to get a full race sometime. Even if I
finish LAST

Joe
.

> On Sat, 4 Sep 1999 19:45:17 -0500, "John Bodin"

> >To stay, or not to stay -- that is the question.
> several months ago you letter could have been written by me -
> word-for-word. if not in word, in mental approach.

> so with all my months of experience, here is the answer you've been
> waiting for;

> DON'T LEAVE!!

> most of the drivers are very understanding and very helpful, and they
> have been there before.
> as another reply  said "hold your line, the faster guys will find the
> place to pass"

> like any real driving, the guy thats hits someone in the rear is AT
> FAULT! not you.
> once you overcome the fear of faster cars in your mirrors, your
> confidence builds and you lap times drop. just don't ignore your
> mirrors!
> Alison Hine told me she did over 500 laps at monza when the sim first
> came out. It takes time, dont force your learning curve, it will get
> better naturally. who said 'sometimes you must slow down to go
> faster'? its true!
> if you leave how will you improve? just relax, have fun, enjoy and
> DON'T LEAVE :)

> hope to see you on the track, and eventually on the podium!
> Bo Bruce
> >    Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
> >    http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/

John Bodi

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by John Bodi » Mon, 06 Sep 1999 04:00:00

That's where I finished last night, but it was a blast!

-- JB


>It looks like a great number of racers agree with me about not leaving
races
>prematurely( Also see my post "VROC.... why bother") Unfortunately I just
>haven't had the chance to hook up with them in my limited amount of online
>races. Reading others posts about the experiences they have had makes me
>think about maybe giving it another try. I just don't have a lot of time to
>devote to this and it would be nice to get a full race sometime. Even if I
>finish LAST

>Joe
>.


>> On Sat, 4 Sep 1999 19:45:17 -0500, "John Bodin"

>> >To stay, or not to stay -- that is the question.
>> several months ago you letter could have been written by me -
>> word-for-word. if not in word, in mental approach.

>> so with all my months of experience, here is the answer you've been
>> waiting for;

>> DON'T LEAVE!!

>> most of the drivers are very understanding and very helpful, and they
>> have been there before.
>> as another reply  said "hold your line, the faster guys will find the
>> place to pass"

>> like any real driving, the guy thats hits someone in the rear is AT
>> FAULT! not you.
>> once you overcome the fear of faster cars in your mirrors, your
>> confidence builds and you lap times drop. just don't ignore your
>> mirrors!
>> Alison Hine told me she did over 500 laps at monza when the sim first
>> came out. It takes time, dont force your learning curve, it will get
>> better naturally. who said 'sometimes you must slow down to go
>> faster'? its true!
>> if you leave how will you improve? just relax, have fun, enjoy and
>> DON'T LEAVE :)

>> hope to see you on the track, and eventually on the podium!
>> Bo Bruce
>> >    Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
>> >    http://irlinsider.adnetweb.com/

Liutger Franze

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Liutger Franze » Tue, 07 Sep 1999 04:00:00

good point, but here is an advice for the faster cars: watch the driver
in front of you, before you start a pass - be SURE that it will be a
successful pass! i got punted by a lotus at kyalami/crowthorne
yesterday, because he thought i got off the line - he didn't knew how to
take that turn in the brabham ;-) I back off normally when I am being
passed by someone and i feel that he will punt me if i don't do so. but
it really annoys me that a lot of hotlappers just turn their laps and
rely on all others backing off when being passed.

Lio

Michael E. Carve

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Michael E. Carve » Tue, 07 Sep 1999 04:00:00

Even if you have read it once before, go back and re-read Alison's
OnLine Driving tips at http://vroc.net/html/common/driving.htm


% > Just hold your racing line when being approached by a faster car.  They will get
% > around you at the appropriate time. It makes thing worse if you try and get off
% > line to let them them by.

% good point, but here is an advice for the faster cars: watch the driver
% in front of you, before you start a pass - be SURE that it will be a
% successful pass! i got punted by a lotus at kyalami/crowthorne
% yesterday, because he thought i got off the line - he didn't knew how to
% take that turn in the brabham ;-) I back off normally when I am being
% passed by someone and i feel that he will punt me if i don't do so. but
% it really annoys me that a lot of hotlappers just turn their laps and
% rely on all others backing off when being passed.

% Lio

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Joel Willstei

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Joel Willstei » Mon, 13 Sep 1999 04:00:00

     Finally,someone has made sense of the should I or shouldn't quit the
race thread. Enjoying it sure seems like a logical approach to take.

     As for holding your line or moving over and letting a faster car by,I'm
still convinced that it is the responsibility of the faster car to find a
clean way by. But it's our responsibility not to block. If there is more
than one racing line,then move to the slower one.

JA Willstein

Joel Willstei

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Joel Willstei » Mon, 13 Sep 1999 04:00:00


> I beg to differ.  For Monza, For me, F1 is too easy compared to F3.  I
>feel that F1 is so ease to drive at Monza that it doesn't take much
>skill at all to make fast laps.  Where as F3 you have to use every bit
>of skill that you have learned to be fast there.

> Probably the better statement would be...  F1, F2, and F3 are three
>different types of racing cars.
 And that
>goes side by side with learning what each change to the chassis does.
>Because of this, I think that the F3 drivers are much better drivers in
>F3 cars then F1 drivers are in F1 cars.  I also think that F3 drivers
>are better prepared to drive the F1 cars then the F1 drivers are
>prepared to drive F3 (or even F1 ;-)

Mike,

     We all know how much you enjoy racing F3 and F2 cars. But I can't agree
with your statements that F3 racing is better than F1 racing just because
the cars race closer together. The fact is that they're just that much
easier to drive.  I've been hooked up in F1 races where I battled a few cars
just  about all race long. True,that doesn't happen all that often,but as my
driving becomes more consistent,I'm able to race with more cars.

     Personally, I find F3 cars way to slow to enjoy racing them. I used
them for more than a month as a gpl learning tool.

JA Willstein

Remco Moe

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Remco Moe » Mon, 13 Sep 1999 04:00:00


>     As for holding your line or moving over and letting a faster car by,I'm
>still convinced that it is the responsibility of the faster car to find a
>clean way by. But it's our responsibility not to block. If there is more
>than one racing line,then move to the slower one.

Only problem is, that the slower drivers are a _lot_ slower (I assume
you're talking about backmarkers here). Mostly that is because they
crash about every corner. If that's the case, it is kinda difficult to
pass such a driver the normal way....

The people with the ability to handle the car so you can pass them
normally are rarely backmarkers, with the short distances used on
VROC.

Remco

Marko Viitane

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Marko Viitane » Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:00:00

To sum this up, in F3 you learn to be smooth and control slides more
precisely. I think you're mostly right, _MOST_ of the people who are driving
F1 cars don't have the skill in the F1 level and _they would_ learn a lot
with F3.


> I beg to differ.  For Monza, For me, F1 is too easy compared to F3.  I
>feel that F1 is so ease to drive at Monza that it doesn't take much
>skill at all to make fast laps.  Where as F3 you have to use every bit
>of skill that you have learned to be fast there.

> Probably the better statement would be...  F1, F2, and F3 are three
>different types of racing cars.  Each one needing a different style of
>driving and different degrease of environmental awareness.  Each one
>needing a lot of awareness but F1 needs less then F3 just because F3
>cars run so much closer to each other then F1.  I have learned more
>about the physics of driving a car with F3 then I did with F1. And that
>goes side by side with learning what each change to the chassis does.
>Because of this, I think that the F3 drivers are much better drivers in
>F3 cars then F1 drivers are in F1 cars.  I also think that F3 drivers
>are better prepared to drive the F1 cars then the F1 drivers are
>prepared to drive F3 (or even F1 ;-)

> As a side note,  The NASCAR fans would probably like F3 racing beter
>then F1 just because of how close the racing is in F3.

>Mike


>> Have you given F2's and F3's a try ? They are much easier to handle.

>> And stay ONLINE.  Its your game as much as anyone else's .

>> Cheers  =:-D

Marko Viitane

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Marko Viitane » Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:00:00

Now, if we have driver who brakes 50-100 meters before "the hotshoes", then
IMO he should use other
line than ideal raceline(when entering the turn), because there is no way
faster driver can expect him to brake _THAT_ early. When I'm lapping guys I
usually search for good overtaking place, but sometimes I just get shocked
how early someone brakes and there's nothing I can do to avoid collision.
This doesn't happen in every race, but every time to time and specially in
VROC, never in leagues. I understand if the guy isn't fast and sometimes
doesn't have a slightest clue where he should brake, but hey, we others
can't brake the laws of physics either!

What pisses me most in the VROC races is:

"HE JUST HAVE TO PUSH THAT NOSE INTO MY REARTIRE IN T1!!!"-syndroma

Conclution: Some of the people don't have _any_ respect towards other
drivers and the ones who are totally lost in brakingzones, should stay away
from onlineracing.


George M. Smile

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by George M. Smile » Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:00:00


> To sum this up, in F3 you learn to be smooth and control
> slides more precisely. I think you're mostly right, _MOST_
> of the people who are driving F1 cars don't have the skill
> in the F1 level and _they would_ learn a lot with F3.

This thread provoked me to enter in a couple of junior races
last night and I have to say I had a blast.  I jumped straight
into F1 when GPL came out and have never touched the
F2 & F3 cars so I was in for a bit of a suprise.  The F2 car
is quite nice and is probably good for mixed manufacturer
races since they seem to all be evenly matched.  I expected
the F3 cars to be quite a bore but after I finding the limit in
a few laps I realised you really have to really work on keeping
your speed up in order to go fast.  A single mistake can
drop you out of touch with another car in rather embarassing
fashion.

The only downside is the races take forever.  Ordinarily I like
that but it does increase ones chances of getting disconnected
from the server which combined with automatic servers makes
for a long wait until the next race.

I also discovered that the AI drivers are demon brakers in the
lower classes.  I got punted at Zandvoort not once but twice
on the first lap while taking my customary easy approach
to the first few corners when online.

What are the F3 leagues, if any?

 - George

Piers C. Structure

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Piers C. Structure » Tue, 14 Sep 1999 04:00:00



If you rear end someone it's all down to you. In a racing car when you
drive up behind someone you are also putting pressure on them, expect
them to make mistakes even if they are not new or inexperienced at the
track.

People make mistakes. Sometimes you will benefit from them, sometimes
not.

I can't cay I have seen many. One time someone was just sitting spinning
on the start/finish line in the middle of the race. I've heard about
people running the wrong way round a track etc, but that seems rare.

Harsh. GPL is difficult. I think you just have to expect mistakes and
try, yourself, to become a better online racing driver within the limits
of the 'experience'. That is, it's not just a matter of being fast, or
even being consistent but being able to survive the frequent first lap
pile ups and other peoples misc mistakes.

Anyone for giving rolling starts a try - droped flag would be start of
pace lap (Naaa, thought not)?

--
Suck The Goat

Doug Schneide

GPL on-line etiquette for slowpokes . . .

by Doug Schneide » Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:00:00

OK, now, this is a bit much.  If you're behind someone, it's your responsibilty
to stay out of his gearbox.  What you seem to be saying here is, I'm faster, I
brake later, so get out of my way because I'm coming through.  The slowest
driver in the world is not  problem if he stays on the race line.  You want to
out brake someone, go off-line to do it, don't expect him to.  All you have to
do to avoid collisions is think ahead and anticipate that he will brake
earlier.  You're lapping him for Christ's sake, he's obviously not a demon at
late braking.  Of course it won't happen in leagues, because there's not likely
to be a lot of less-serious racers there, they will be more predictable.  To
turn the tables, if you can't find a way to compensate for less experienced
drivers, maybe you should stick to leagues and forget pick up races on VROC.
You also seem to somehow have come to the conclusion that rear-ending someone
and then having him *** at you for it means he has no respect for you, but
you're perfectly justified in trashing his race.  Give your head a shake.  As
far as I'm concerned, anyone, regardless of skill or speed, can join any race
I'm in, as long as they're not a complete *** who runs laps backwards or
intentionally takes out other drivers.  Posts like yours go a long way towards
scaring off people who would love to give it a try but are afraid they won't
stack up with the competition.  Once more for the record:  learn how to deal
with slower drivers.  You're not out to set a record on every lap, you're out
to win, and whoever you're racing against has to deal with them as well.  I do
it, other drivers do it, and you can too.

Yeah, I know, *** *** ***.

            Zog


> Now, if we have driver who brakes 50-100 meters before "the hotshoes", then
> IMO he should use other
> line than ideal raceline(when entering the turn), because there is no way
> faster driver can expect him to brake _THAT_ early. When I'm lapping guys I
> usually search for good overtaking place, but sometimes I just get shocked
> how early someone brakes and there's nothing I can do to avoid collision.
> This doesn't happen in every race, but every time to time and specially in
> VROC, never in leagues. I understand if the guy isn't fast and sometimes
> doesn't have a slightest clue where he should brake, but hey, we others
> can't brake the laws of physics either!

> What pisses me most in the VROC races is:

> "HE JUST HAVE TO PUSH THAT NOSE INTO MY REARTIRE IN T1!!!"-syndroma

> Conclution: Some of the people don't have _any_ respect towards other
> drivers and the ones who are totally lost in brakingzones, should stay away
> from onlineracing.


> >DON'T LEAVE!!

> >most of the drivers are very understanding and very helpful, and they
> >have been there before.
> >as another reply  said "hold your line, the faster guys will find the
> >place to pass"

> >like any real driving, the guy thats hits someone in the rear is AT
> >FAULT! not you.


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