rec.autos.simulators

    OK, here it is:

    I've been playing ICR2 for years.  I love it.  It's great.  I do not
have the newer version with 3D support.  I get the very strong impression
that the 3D support is ONLY for Rendition-based cards.  Is this correct, or
does the newer CART Racing version have support for other 3D cards?

    Second, I don't have a Rendition card.  I have a TNT (which also rocks).
However, I just bought a new 19" Hitachi monitor to replace my older 17" Mag
Innovision monitor.  Now that I have an extra monitor, I'm considering
buying a second display adapter and running it on the older monitor using
Win98's multi-monitor feature.  Has anyone tried this in conjuntion with
CART/ICR2?  Does it work well?

    Thirdly, if I do get another display adapter, I would like to get one
that will allow me to run a 3D-enhanced version of ICR2.  This (probably)
means a Rendition card.  The consensus here (from what I've seen) is that
the Hercules Thriller 3D 8meg PCI is the best option for a V2200 card (my
TNT already uses my AGP slot).  Am I mistaken here?

    Finally, if all of this comes to pass, is there any legal way (patch or
otherwise) to get the 3D-enhanced version of CART/ICR2 without having to go
out and buy the game again?

    So once again, my questions are:

    Does CART/ICR2 (3D version) only support Rendition cards?
    Does CART/ICR2 (3D version) work OK with Win98's multi-monitor feature?
    Is the Herc Thriller 3D 8meg PCI the best option for running CART/ICR2
in 3D mode?
    Is there a patch or upgrade program from original ICR2 to the 3D
enhanced CART/ICR2?

    Thanks for any help you can give me, feel free to email any replies.

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yes no 3dfx, or open GL, just rendition

I have no clue

From what ive heard, yes it is teh best rendition card out there and runs
great (especially in GPL)

I think there is, you might want to check out the pits (www.theuspits.com)
or the sim project (www.simracing.com/simproject)  I think there may be a
rendition patch at one of them

Jesse

    I'm pretty sure that I've patched this version as far as it goes.
However, I've got the Win95 install.  Maybe I missed one because it was for
the DOS version only.

    Thanks for the tip...I'll have to check that out.

    At this point, I'm wondering if it's worth it to get the 8meg Thriller.
Since I already have a 16meg TNT, it wouldn't necessarily give me any
capability other than running the Rendition version of CART/ICR2.  BUYCOMP
has the 4meg card for ~$35 while the 8meg card is listed at over $100.  As
long as I can get truecolor at 1024x768, then I'm not really hurting on the
desktop end of it.  Has anyone seen a definitive advantage in the 8meg card
over the 4meg when running CART/ICR2?

This is an excellent point.

While there is a fix for the mirrors problem, you have to sacrifice anti-
aliasing to use the V2x00 with ICR2-3D (or suffer with a weird, blocky
horizon). In other words, ICR2-3D would look like NASCAR2-3D. IMHO that
would be a terrible choice for an ICR2 enthusiast. If the only Rendition
game to be played is ICR2-3D then a V1000 is the right choice for this
special case. ICR2-3D with the enhanced tracks and a V1000 is still one
the best views in racing simulations.  

The best V1000 card was the one Canopus sold under their own label --
latest V1000 chip and fastest memory speed. I got one at Buy.Comp for $21
bucks about three months ago.

ICR2-3D has assumed a permanent spot on my harddrive. It is dated and the
physics lacking, but the view with anti-aliasing is top-notch.

Later, Troy ...

Wayne Hutchison

What about the distorted horizon? I could never get rid of that with the
Stealth II 220 except by turning off the anti-aliasing.

Later, Troy ...

The Rendition version is a DOS-based program.  Some people can run it
in a DOS box under Windows, some can't.  (I can't- I have to boot
boot Win95 to DOS mode.)  Does Win98's monitor splittling  work for
DOS boxes?

Yes.  Also very good for Grand Prix Legends.

Yes and no.  There are patches for the executable, but you won't
have the enhanced tracks.  I have no first hand experience, but I
know that some people have tried and failed to enhance the rest
of the tracks using the patches at
http://www.simracing.com/simproject.  But CART Racing is only
about $15.  It's worth it to get the tracks.  It's also worth it if
you can find a copy that includes the strategy guide.  I don't know
if the newest boxes do or not.

BTW, there are also "issues" with running the program at all on
V2x00 cards.  http://www.bjorn3d.com has some solutions, which
worked for me (with a 4MB Thriller 3D).

Jonathan Bishop

   Don't know, but note that ICR-3D runs only in DOS mode, which may
foul up such a Win98 feature.

   Yes and no.  The AGP and PCI versions are equivalent and they are
the best Rendition board.  (The Genoa Raptor is similar, with fewer
bells and whistles, I believe.)  8 meg is preferred, particularly for
GPL.

   However, ICR-3D has a graphical incompatability with V2x00 chips.
Your mirrors are messed up.  No fix available.  (Not a problem if you
use arcade view.)  If ICR-3D is your sole reason for buying a
Rendition card, you might be best served by looking for an old V1000
card.  If you want to use it for other Papyrus racing sims (GPL,
N2/NR1999, SODA), the V2x00 is preferred.

   Look for a "Cyrix patch" to ICR-3D.  It contains the executable for
ICR-3d (with enhancements for Cyrix chips, which you won't be using).
Some of the ICR sites have Rendition *enhanced* track patches, to
convert your existing tracks (the Rendition executable gives you 3D on
*all* tracks, while some tracks are specially *enhanced* for 3D).  You
will have to buy the retail package to get the five Papyrus-enhanced
tracks.  Of course, ICR-3D (CART Racing) is only selling for about $10
nowadays.

   For more info on Rendition cards and ICR-3D patches see Bjorn's 3D
site, http://www.bjorn3d.com/

"But in a way, fear is a big part of racing, because if there was
nothing to be frightened of, and no limit, any fool could get into
a motor car and racing would not exist as a sport." -- Jim Clark

Jonathan Bishop

    Yeah...I might one day purchase Nascar 3, but I would think that by now
Sierra/Papyrus has learned to support a more current 3D API that Rendition's
Redline.  As long as they do that, then my TNT will kick but all over a
V2200.