rec.autos.simulators

GPL: the groove

Michael E. Carve

GPL: the groove

by Michael E. Carve » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

Is it just my imagination?  Or is there "slightly" more traction in the
groove than outside the groove?

Speaking of imagination....  I haven't seen a product produce such much
poetry and prose as this "pre-alpha" demo from Papyrus.  I read some
wonderful first impressions and Papyrus should be proud to have worked
on such a product that received such wonderful first response.  And we
haven't seen nuttin' yet!

--
**************************** Michael E. Carver *************************
     Upside out, or inside down...False alarm the only game in town.

=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=<[ /./.  [-  < ]>=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

Nanker Phelg

GPL: the groove

by Nanker Phelg » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00


I agree with this.  I have also always felt that the other Papy sims
afforded more traction in the "groove" as well.

Yes, it is good to see Papy is back on track.  Then again, it sure helps
that Dave K. is at the heart of this baby.  N2 had me worried about
Papy, GPL has redeemed them.

What kind of times are people getting?  I am stuck at a best of
1:12.46.  I know there's gotta be more there, but that last turn gets me
every time.  Lost more than a few good laps there.

Byron Forbe

GPL: the groove

by Byron Forbe » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00



> > Is it just my imagination?  Or is there "slightly" more traction in the
> > groove than outside the groove?

> I agree with this.  I have also always felt that the other Papy sims
> afforded more traction in the "groove" as well.

   Exactly. I found in ICR2 that there is the best line and then there
is the VERY slow line.
John Walla

GPL: the groove

by John Walla » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

On Thu, 09 Apr 1998 02:40:47 GMT, "Michael E. Carver"


>Is it just my imagination?  Or is there "slightly" more traction in the
>groove than outside the groove?

The groove on a real track shows where the cars have been driving, and
there are reasons other than purely apexing why they follow those
lines. GPL models bumps etc, but in this case remember that the roads
at the Glen are fairly heavily cambered. If you get off line you'll
have wheels on or over the crown, and then the camber starts working
against you.

Cheers!
John

Jo

GPL: the groove

by Jo » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>What kind of times are people getting?  I am stuck at a best of
>1:12.46.  

How do you get this fast? I can't seem to get muchg lower than 1:25
without spinning out.

Maybe someone can point out where I'm making my mistakes:

- first 3-way S-turn I take in 2nd gear, accelerating into 3rd into
the straight at the end of the S
- end of straight, near crest of hill go down to 2nd gear for the
corner (by the bails of hay), then back up to 5th gear in the straight
- down to 4th for an easy left
- down to 2nd for the right, maybe  3rd for the easy left, then right
down to 1st for the hairpin on the last curve

Any suggestions?

Joe

John Walla

GPL: the groove

by John Walla » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>- first 3-way S-turn I take in 2nd gear, accelerating into 3rd into
>the straight at the end of the S

I take that in third, or second if my line is bad out of T1 and I need
to flick the car around quickly into the esses - that is a slow lap
though. I accelerate all the way through the esses, in fourth on the
exit and fifth by half way along the following straight.

Same.

Should be absolutely foot to the floor in fith with no lift at all.

Second for the right, then stay tight to the inside of the next left
hander, accelerating as much as possible. Finally brake and down to
second for the final corner. Take first before the apex and accelerate
out, using the width of the road.

One other small tip - the finish line is funny in that you need to
brake slightly before the S/F line to get a good line into T1. On a
fast lap, DON'T brake and just accept the next lap will be screwed.
This can save a tenth or two from your laptime.

Cheers!
John

Darin Genere

GPL: the groove

by Darin Genere » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00



>>What kind of times are people getting?  I am stuck at a best of
>>1:12.46.  

>How do you get this fast? I can't seem to get muchg lower than 1:25
>without spinning out.

>Maybe someone can point out where I'm making my mistakes:

I have yet to break the 12s mark (1:12:04), but maybe that's just due
to my joystick?  Anyway, here's how I take the curves with a Lotus:

Start in 3rd, shift to 4th after first curve, then if taken correctly,
into fifth right on the straight.

only go down to 3rd

Stay in 5th, I can usually maintain full throttle will little
squealing...

3rd for the right, then 2nd for the hairpin.  That last one is a
timekiller, and has ruined many a fast laps for me. :)

Keep practicing!

Darin

John

GPL: the groove

by John » Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:00:00

+AD4-
+AD4APg-What kind of times are people getting?  I am stuck at a best of
+AD4APg-1:12.46.
+AD4-
+AD4-How do you get this fast? I can't seem to get muchg lower than 1:25
+AD4-without spinning out.
+AD4-
+AD4-Maybe someone can point out where I'm making my mistakes:
+AD4-
+AD4-- first 3-way S-turn I take in 2nd gear, accelerating into 3rd into

3rd for right hander in S then up to 4th for left hander and 2nd right
hander onto straight. At end of Armco I shift to 5th

+AD4-the straight at the end of the S
+AD4-- end of straight, near crest of hill go down to 2nd gear for the

I go down to 3rd but Doug Arnao goes to 2nd

+AD4-corner (by the bails of hay), then back up to 5th gear in the straight

same

+AD4-- down to 4th for an easy left

Stay in 5th gear and turn a litlle earlier

+AD4-- down to 2nd for the right, maybe  3rd for the easy left, then right

Down to 3rd for right hander and left hander.

+AD4-down to 1st for the hairpin on the last curve

Down to 2nd for tight right hander (hairpin... you will know what a true
hairpin is when you drive at Mexico +ADw-g+AD4-)
+AD4-
+AD4-Any suggestions?

Hope that helps. Download some fast lap replay's from
http://gpl.gamestats.com and watch the drivers and how they take the lines.
I learned allot by watching Doug Arnao's lap.

Thanks
John

Matthew Knutse

GPL: the groove

by Matthew Knutse » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00



> >- first 3-way S-turn I take in 2nd gear, accelerating into 3rd into
> >the straight at the end of the S

> I take that in third, or second if my line is bad out of T1 and I need

> to flick the car around quickly into the esses - that is a slow lap
> though. I accelerate all the way through the esses, in fourth on the
> exit and fifth by half way along the following straight.

I use 2nd for the hairpin before s/f, 3rd into and through right part of
S, 4th through left/right, fifth on top (just after armco ends)

My best is a 1.09.52, constant doing 1,09s

Keep going!Matt

--

Matthew Birger Knutsen
Cheek Racing Cars (http://home.sn.no/~kareknut)

"Racing cars is like dancing with a chainsaw"
       -Cale Yarborough

magefir

GPL: the groove

by magefir » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00


> Maybe someone can point out where I'm making my mistakes:

first impression: you need to practice pushing the car and getting
it a bit loose:) if you're not accelerating around most of the corners
without hearing the wheels fractionally squealing and feeling the
tail*** out marginally, you're too slow.

this seems to be fairly personal. some people change earlier, some
later. i think i'm one of hte slightly earlier changing people.
I go through Turn 1 in mid-3rd, lining hte car up before i reach the
apex and totally blasting from that point, having hte car on the
right side of the track in the little straight after, changing to
4th just as i enter Turn 2. i ease off here to line up the
corner then nail it again the instant i know i'm lined up, and have
the car entering Turn 3 right against the right hand railing, full
accelerator, tail*** loose (not too loose or i get no
increase in speed at all) and as the car is drifting out to the left
side of the track on the corner exit i'm changing up into 5th for
the straight.
That's on a good lap:) sometimes i get alittle loose in Turn 2 and
end up stuck to the left railing in turn 3 :) oops.

you want to hit the brakes exactly as the big sign on the left
vanishes from view to be sure you won't fly off into the hay (a
favorite trick of mine), and try hard not to lock the brakes. if you
get good at braking you can brake a little later here i think.
I go through this turn in 3rd, double apexing. don't like to use
2nd here since that involves a gear change while in the middle of
accelerating out. if i am lucky and don't get the rear too loose and
spin, i can exit the turn and be at about 8500 rpm as the car finally
straightens, normally only 8000rpm though.

noooooooo bad bad bad:) full speed! this, i think, is the fastest
point on the track. leading up to the braking point for turn 6 I
am certain i am going even quicker than down the front straight.

hit the brakes in the little patch where the best-line is lighter
for a moment just before the fence on the right disappears, I use
3rd for this right hander (some use 2nd), then blast out of here,
full accelerator (or nearly full)*** the car real wide around
turn 7 (the left hander), to stand on the brakes for the ***
right Turn 8, which i do in 2nd. I don't use first here bceause that
always spins me out because the high torque locks up my rear wheels.
Using 2nd i only spin 50% of hte time instead :)
This corner is evil. the number of times i've ruined a really really
good lap by spinning into the home stretch and vainly seeing the
finish line in the distnace is just too often to count.

This gets me around the 1:09.0 mark, or down to 1:08.5 if i did
a particularly smooth lap. but, i only complete a good lap about
20% of the time - I'm still pretty fond of all the very closeup
views of fences, spectators, hay bails, grass, etc:)

This is only my particular style of driving. i think it's a bit
loose, and probably not as fast as it could be, but it's fun:)

good luck:)
Grant.

Jo

GPL: the groove

by Jo » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>I take that in third, or second if my line is bad out of T1 ...

Thanks for the tips, John, I'll get back at it! (Haven't had this much
fun with a demo since Moto Racer a year ago.)

Joe

Jo

GPL: the groove

by Jo » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>Keep practicing!

With a sim this fun to drive, that part's easy! ;-)

Joe

Peter Gag

GPL: the groove

by Peter Gag » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00



> - first 3-way S-turn I take in 2nd gear,

I take this in third, and go up into fourth mid way round, as even in
third if you are accelerating hard, the back end can get twitchy. In
fourth the car accelerates a bit slower, but is much more stable.

I change into fifth almost as soon as I hit the straight.

I brake hard, and change down twice to third gear, as again third
gear is more stable through the corner, if you accelerate hard
through/out of the corner in second the back end can fight you.

You can take this left hander flat out in fifth, but turn in early
and hold a steady line through it.

Once again, I take this corner in third.

Apart from starting a race, you should usually never go back down to
first gear as it's far to easy to spin the car. I brake hard as
late as possible and take this corner in second gear and change up to
third as I exit.

BTW, my best time so far in the GP car is *only* a 1:15, but I
haven't had much practice yet, and feel as though I could probably
get near the 1:10's after a while?

*Peter*  8-)

John Walla

GPL: the groove

by John Walla » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00


>Thanks for the tips, John, I'll get back at it! (Haven't had this much
>fun with a demo since Moto Racer a year ago.)

Good luck! Moto Racer ate up quite a few hours of my time as well when
I got my hands on the demo, and I really like the Castrol World Honda
Superbike thingy as well. I'll certainly get that when it appears, but
GPL is undoubtedly in a class of it's own.

Cheers!
John

Nanker Phelg

GPL: the groove

by Nanker Phelg » Sat, 11 Apr 1998 04:00:00




> > then back up to 5th gear in the straight down to 4th for an easy
> > left

> You can take this left hander flat out in fifth, but turn in early
> and hold a steady line through it.

Yes, this is a place to pick up some time if someone is not taking it
flat out through here.  As you note, turn in and hold the line, near the
inner guardrail.  Like the title of this thread, the groove here is the
way to go.

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