rec.autos.simulators

I loved how realistic GT3 looked but the gameplay never really e***d me
much.  I preferred games like F355 Challenge, Vanishing Point, Project
Gotham etc where the cars were a real handful to drive and you could develop
some serious skills.  I haven't played GT4 yet but it'll be cool if it's as
challenging as those games.

I do certainly miss damage, and even a rudimentary***pit would have
been nice--even if it would mean giving up an AI car for processing
power, I find it sometimes difficult to judge the virtual dimensions of
my car.  Plus, my Lister looks exactly like that mini van on the inside
:)  But, there are so many items displayed in the 'front ahead view (no
idea what to call it)' that you do get a sense of being in something.

I also did a 2 lap B-Spec event at the Nurburgring (I LOVE THE CHALK
MARKS!!) coaching the Lister Storm to a 3rd place finish--watching that
race unfold was very enjoyable, and is a nice addtion for when you want
to check out some racing action, but do not feel like driving :)

I was very happy with GT3, and even happier with GT4, but I am a bit
disappointed as I had heard early owners of the game had a 200+ page
document of some sort jammed into the box, but that may have been the
Japanese version only.

I actually prefer the XBOX for most of my console *** needs, but
when it comes to driving, the PS2 has no equal.  I am very disappointed
in the lack of FFB with XBOX, and of the two wheels I so far have
tried--the Pelican EVO GT, and the MadCatz something or other were both
very lacking--The madcatz reminded me of the old Thrustmaster
T1....without the quality part.  The EVO is a simple wheel that uses
friction to simulate the road.  Both wheels when coupled with the XBOX
provide some of the worst driving experience around.  It's not so much
the game--but the interface of human and game is just not so well done
on the XBOX.  And it's a shame really--I really like PGR2, IndyCar
2005, CMR05, Chase for the Cup, Thunder 2004, and Rallisport
challenge--but I am getting better 'response' using the gamepad, and
that just isn't easy for me to drive that way.

I really need to quit buying those damn XBOX driving games :)  I have
not tried the Logitech NASCAR wheel yet, and don't think I will unless
I hear some raving reviews on it for the XBOX.

http://www.ctd-racing.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1680&page=1&pp=30

I do really like GT4.  But I'm also disappointed with it. It has
all been said before, so no need to rehash.

Just wanted to say: don't give up on the XBOX, not with Forza
around the corner! (well, if you consider 2-3 months, plus
inevitable additional delays to be "real soon now")

I am looking forward to Forza....but the steering control issue is a
big letdown for me and the XBOX so far.  The Rally sims are the best to
drive as 'random steering inputs' sometimes get the job done in Rally
racing :)

Forza certainly seems to have some great potential, I have been reading
much about it...but I will definitely be trying that one out before I
buy it.  If they could just somehow come up with more convincing
steering control and feedback, it would be much better.

Understood, Bob.  Some just gotta have FF wheels.  Me, I've tried
wheels (FF and not) a number of times and just never liked them.
To this day, I use a stick for PC sims and the stock controllers
for the XBOX and PS2.  Well, till today.  I decided to give my old
Logitech Driving Force another try before I get too
used to  the DS2 in GT4.  And for some reason, I'm more
comfortable with it this time.  I'm still not convinced that FF is
that much more a realistic experience...

What are all these bangings around when I'm on a straightaway?  If
I let go of the wheel, it'll go wildly off the road in a couple of
seconds.  That isn't my real world driving experience.  And I
don't really feel the effort lighten up until I'm way out of
control.   Shouldn't the wheel lighten when I just start sliding?  

I need a primer in what proper FF is and how to set it up
appropriately (not that you have many setup FF options in GT4).

Not sure about your FFB going all over the road, I havent noticed that
one before...  I will do some digging around in the GT4 game with my
wheel--what car were you driving when that happened?  I imagine one of
the controller setup options is dedicated to this particular wheel....?
 I saw the DFP at a quick glance, and even more when scrolling the
options page down, maybe this wheel has a special setup...??  Just
guessing here.

Actually, I don't mind a non-FFB wheel/sim at all--The T1 for the PC
was a great wheel.  If the XBOX had such a wheel (and maybe the
Logitech is it), then it would be different.  But the Madcatz,
literally, felt like a 5 dollar toy.  The EVO is better, but adjusting
the sensitivity is time consuming, to say the least, and every game so
far requires a different amount of adjustment here. And the way it
models 'road friction' is not smooth, or consistent.  The type of feel
a decent return spring would give is just not there, for example.

Of course, now that one does it they all will ...  :)

--
Andre
----------------------------------------

For someone who started on PC sims and bought a PS2 just to play GT3,
I've found the game pad amazingly good for driving...once I discovered
the gas and brake buttons were pressure sensitive.

It takes some practice but often I'm smoother in the replays than the AI.

Anyone know if a Logitech Momo FF for PC will work on a PS2?

I think it is either just trying to create some self-centering, or
it is simulating bumps in the road?  It seems worse at higher
speeds, so maybe it is the latter.  Basically, if it gets a few
degrees off-center, there's a strong kick to re-center.  If I'm
not holding on firmly, it'll over-correct, kick harder back, then
again, then I'd be off the road.  In reality, this would only be
the case if I let go of the wheel since after a kick or two, I'm
grabbing tight.  It just feels way overdone, but not a big deal.  
I'll experiment more.  

Thanks for the feedback.

Make that the Momo Racing wheel. Anyone know if it's compatible with the
PS2?

Exceptional physics... hmm only for it's balance of arcade and realism.
Nothing more.

--
-- Fran?ois Mnard <ymenard>
-- This announcement is brought to you by the Shimago-Dominguez
Corporation - helping America into the New World...

2/27/05  - $37.99 at COMPUSA