rec.autos.simulators

GT4 - A First Look

Steve Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by Steve Smit » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:45:13

Sony's Gran Turismo 4 - A First Look

It's finally out!  Was it worth the wait?  Yes!  Is it better than GT3?
Yes!  Are Sony's sachems mugwumps for having squidded out on online play?
You betcha!

In truth, it's not that much different from GT3...which is to say, it's
still the best console racer...ever...and can still give all but the best PC
sims a run for their money.  It's just bigger: 500 (or whatever) cars, a
seemingly inexhaustable supply of tracks (altho only a handful of real-world
tracks, albeit including a totally believable Nordschleife), a sound track
that a lot of MP3 players would die for, and better graphics than anything
powered by a dinky little CPU like the PS3's has any right to be.

GT4 has a credible--if not totally convincing--physics model (and a gorgeous
photorealistic look; when you stomp on the brakes hard, for example, the
discs glow red).  Driving most of GT4's stable of *** cars--including a
perfectly rendered Ford GT40, AC Cobra, Bentley Speed 8, Mazda 787B, McLaren
F1 GT, Chaparral 2J, Cizeta V16, Pagani Zonda C12, Gillet Vertigo (my
favorite car in GTR), Jaguar XJR9 (my favorite car from N2003's GTP mod),
Mercedes CLK, Toyota GT1, and Jay Leno's "Tank" car--feel almost like
driving cars in the real world...and subtle enough that you can clearly feel
the difference between front-, rear-, and 4-wheel drive.

GT4's greatest strength, however, is in its gameplay.  It hooks you right
away with how much fun it is in the Arcade mode to jump in a little, er,
shoe box and go blasting around like your butt's on fire, then entices you
with the risks and rewards, carrots and sticks of the Gran Turismo (full-on
simulation mode), where you work your way up the ladder from a lowly Amuse
Carbon (I kid you not) to a one-of-a-kind Le Mans GT prototype.  What GT4's
developers have nailed better than anybody else--PC or console--is that
elusive quality known as "play balance."  That is, it's easy enough to suck
you in, challenging enough to get you motivated, and rewarding enough to
keep you coming back for more.

The AI is still clueless...or is it?  I think Kaz (Yamauchi, the "godfather
of the Gran Turismo franchise) and his krew are making your opponents down
n' dirty on purpose.  In my first few entry-level races, I saw some big
bully in a Hemi-powered Dodge pickup deliberately sideswiping the little
Toyota Voltz, Daihatsu Midget, Hyundai Clix, Nissan Micra, and Suzuki
Cappucino rice burners.  ***.

There are improvements over GT3, some significant (you can output to
HDTV--480p or 1080i--and there's support for Dolby Pro Logic II surround
sound) and some not (you can take shapshots during replays...and what?
Submit them to your local newspaper?).

I siezed the opportunity to try out Logitech's new-ish Driving Force Pro
wheel,which was allegedly developed specifically for GT4 (a USB device, it
also works fine with PCs).  It's a little gritty (gears, not wires &
pulleys) and the rim is a little thin, but I was able to place the cars
accurately and the pedals worked well.

Sony has sold 38 million copies of the first 3 iterations of Gran Turismo
(which, if it was a movie series would be the most successful of all time),
and GT4 looks to keep the ball rolling...all the way to the bank.

But it ain't no GPL.

--Steve Smith

Trinit

GT4 - A First Look

by Trinit » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 18:05:39

On Fri, 25 Feb 2005 04:45:13 GMT, "Steve Smith"


>.and can still give all but the best PC
>sims a run for their money.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha....'nuff said.
Alan Gauto

GT4 - A First Look

by Alan Gauto » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:24:21



Care to clarify that - it's not out over here yet (UK). (-:

Release date over here is March 9th according to Amazon.

--
AG

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-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Never for me the lowered banner, never the last endeavour!
                                            (Damon Hill - 16th June 1999)

Steve Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by Steve Smit » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 20:18:23

Jeez, I thought you guys had it already.  How abt. GTR?




> > Sony's Gran Turismo 4 - A First Look

> > It's finally out!

> Care to clarify that - it's not out over here yet (UK). (-:

> Release date over here is March 9th according to Amazon.

> --
> AG

> Remove removes from address to remove anti-spam measures.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------

> Never for me the lowered banner, never the last endeavour!
>     (Damon Hill - 16th June 1999)

the.internet.u..

GT4 - A First Look

by the.internet.u.. » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:31:29


> Sony's Gran Turismo 4 - A First Look
> The AI is still clueless...or is it?  I think Kaz (Yamauchi, the
"godfather
> of the Gran Turismo franchise) and his krew are making your opponents
down
> n' dirty on purpose.  In my first few entry-level races, I saw some
big
> bully in a Hemi-powered Dodge pickup deliberately sideswiping the
little
> Toyota Voltz, Daihatsu Midget, Hyundai Clix, Nissan Micra, and Suzuki
> Cappucino rice burners.  ***.

I must have a bad copy of the game because mine has NO AI.  Just like
GT, GT2, GT3, GT4 Prologue and GT4.  There is no AI.  Zero, zip, nada.
This is the, what, the third time that Yamauchi has reneged on his
promise to add AI to the GT series?  This game can't hold a candle to
Test Drive Lemans or Ferrari F355 as far as AI goes.  And those games
are Dreamcast titles and 4.  Of course, those games didn't feature that
fancy photo mode that allows you to photograph your vehicles in cities
all over the world.  AI?  We don't need no stinking AI.  It's worthless
photo's that we need.  I love the driving model of GT4.  It's light
years ahead of GT3 and actually forces you to use your breaks
efficiently on the track.  Unless there's a car next to you, then you
can simply use them to make the corner.

Yamauchi may be a car fanatic, but he's obviously never been to any
type of automobile race.  Yes, Mr. Yamauchi there is a racing line.
And yes you want to stick to it as much as possible.  But you see that
car to the left and right of you?  You can't plow the f*ck into it!
That's not how things work in real life.  You would think with as many
copies that GT has sold, that Polyphony would be able to dip into the
budget and purchase a few conditional logic statetements for their
developers.  How much can an "if", "if-else", "switch", or a "while"
loop cost?

Bring on Enthusia Racing, maybe we'll finally get working AI
implemented on the PS2.

the.internet.u..

GT4 - A First Look

by the.internet.u.. » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:38:59

God lord.  Why can't I write a comprehensible reply?   Another post
with forgotten sentences, spelling errors, bad grammar.   Somebody buy
me an education!   :-)
Alan Gauto

GT4 - A First Look

by Alan Gauto » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:47:53



Game (UK replacement for EB) have it listed for March 11th.

--
AG

Remove removes from address to remove anti-spam measures.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Never for me the lowered banner, never the last endeavour!
                                            (Damon Hill - 16th June 1999)

Andy

GT4 - A First Look

by Andy » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:06:38


Read OK for me...

Not really too fussed about the AI in GT4 funnily enough (perhaps I'm the
target audience!) as I do a lot of  test miles in GT3. Basically I spend
hours trying to shave a few tenths off a particular track record.
And yes, I'm aware how sad that makes me sound ;o)

But then that might be because I know exactly how the race will pan out if I
race the AI, based solely on the spec of the cars (although occasionally I'm
sure there're tuned skylines lurking around).
Guess I'm saying there's no "random" element to the AI...

Andy

Todd Walke

GT4 - A First Look

by Todd Walke » Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:45:04


I'm not that impressed with GT4. I got it Wednesday and I've been
playing it a bit but I'm not totally engrossed like I was with GT3 (I
guess the newness got me,) and PGR2 on the Xbox. Yes GT4 is pretty and
the physics are pretty good but it's just missing something. Maybe I was
expecting too much.

I'm looking forward to Enthusia and Forza Motorsport. I hope I'm not
disappointed again.

--
_________________________
Todd Walker
http://www.toddwalker.net
_________________________

John Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by John Smit » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:06:18

How much fun is it with a regular game pad?
the.internet.u..

GT4 - A First Look

by the.internet.u.. » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 03:07:54

I agree with your assessment.  GT4 is better in almost every regard
compared to GT3, but I'm just not feeling it.  It will be interesting
to see how Forza and Enthusia stack up.  Although I'm not buying
another wheel, so Forza will be gamepad only for me.

Does anyone else find it odd that Microsoft will be releasiing Forza
within days of making their XBox2 announcement?  That's got to hurt
sales for the game and probably kill sales for that 'ForceShock" wheel
that was 'developed' for Forza.  I'm surely not sinking $150 into a
wheel that's not real FF for a console that has another 6 months of
life in it.

Todd Walke

GT4 - A First Look

by Todd Walke » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 03:38:29



It SUCKS. The left thumbstick (steering) is WAY too sensitive. If I
liked the game more I'd buy a wheel but it's not worth dishing out the
cash. I'll buy an Xbox wheel if Forza is worth it.

--
_________________________
Todd Walker
http://www.toddwalker.net
_________________________

Steve Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by Steve Smit » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:09:59

Euthanasia racing...yes!!!



> > Sony's Gran Turismo 4 - A First Look

> > The AI is still clueless...or is it?  I think Kaz (Yamauchi, the
> "godfather
> > of the Gran Turismo franchise) and his krew are making your opponents
> down
> > n' dirty on purpose.  In my first few entry-level races, I saw some
> big
> > bully in a Hemi-powered Dodge pickup deliberately sideswiping the
> little
> > Toyota Voltz, Daihatsu Midget, Hyundai Clix, Nissan Micra, and Suzuki
> > Cappucino rice burners.  ***.

> I must have a bad copy of the game because mine has NO AI.  Just like
> GT, GT2, GT3, GT4 Prologue and GT4.  There is no AI.  Zero, zip, nada.
> This is the, what, the third time that Yamauchi has reneged on his
> promise to add AI to the GT series?  This game can't hold a candle to
> Test Drive Lemans or Ferrari F355 as far as AI goes.  And those games
> are Dreamcast titles and 4.  Of course, those games didn't feature that
> fancy photo mode that allows you to photograph your vehicles in cities
> all over the world.  AI?  We don't need no stinking AI.  It's worthless
> photo's that we need.  I love the driving model of GT4.  It's light
> years ahead of GT3 and actually forces you to use your breaks
> efficiently on the track.  Unless there's a car next to you, then you
> can simply use them to make the corner.

> Yamauchi may be a car fanatic, but he's obviously never been to any
> type of automobile race.  Yes, Mr. Yamauchi there is a racing line.
> And yes you want to stick to it as much as possible.  But you see that
> car to the left and right of you?  You can't plow the f*ck into it!
> That's not how things work in real life.  You would think with as many
> copies that GT has sold, that Polyphony would be able to dip into the
> budget and purchase a few conditional logic statetements for their
> developers.  How much can an "if", "if-else", "switch", or a "while"
> loop cost?

> Bring on Enthusia Racing, maybe we'll finally get working AI
> implemented on the PS2.

Steve Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by Steve Smit » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:11:37

Real racers don't use gamepads.  (P.S. I'm not a real racer...but I play one
on the Internet.)


Steve Smit

GT4 - A First Look

by Steve Smit » Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:13:50

Joke's on you.  There is no decent wheel for the Xbox...and won't be until
the Xbox 360 (aka II) 'cuz MS never bothered to implement FF, so no decent
wheel mfr. will build a decent wheel for it, FF or not.  This isn't
speculation, that's what a major wheel manufacturer told me.




> > How much fun is it with a regular game pad?

> It SUCKS. The left thumbstick (steering) is WAY too sensitive. If I
> liked the game more I'd buy a wheel but it's not worth dishing out the
> cash. I'll buy an Xbox wheel if Forza is worth it.

> --
> _________________________
> Todd Walker
> http://www.toddwalker.net
> _________________________


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