rec.autos.simulators

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

David Butte

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by David Butte » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 09:47:42


<snip>

Hey, a question I can answer! Normally these things are of the order of
"why is it so easy to do 7:45 at the Ring in a BRM blindfolded?"...

Anyhow, I'd say that if you're unstable in an Eagle at Spa, you'll be
unstable in the other cars too. Building a rhythm is important for all
the tracks, but for Spa it's absolutely vital - you need to *flow* from
one corner into the next. Point and squirt won't work here.

Other people have mentioned Roland Ehnstr?m's setups, and I certainly
think they're easier to drive than Greger Huttu's - they're much more
stable, and can easily be used for a race and not just a hotlap. I use
a tweaked version of RE's setup myself - it used to be available from
my website, but the Spa page is down right now (must get it back up
sometime!). Email me if you want it.

Here's what I do at Spa, in briefest outline:

Take Eau Rouge in 3rd, slide around the l-h bend at the top, just
avoiding clipping the grass bank on the inside. Up to 5th. Down to 2nd,
and slide around the tight l-h. Flat out down the hill (including the
chicane). High 4th or medium 5th to taste round the long r-h, into
Malmedy.

Malmedy is incredibly difficult to get right, but if I'm flowing I do
it all in 3rd with not much change in throttle. Do *not* lift right off
here - you'll end up in the hedge. Slide out of the bottom of Malmedy
onto the long straight and thrash down in top gear - you should top
200mph. Don't change down for Masta, and steer early into the lower, r-
h part of the corner. Dash down the hill on the left.

Enter Stavelot in 5th and gradually scrub speed off around it, changing
down to 4th then 3rd. Go right out to the left as you start the uphill
section. Foot flat to the floor around a couple of gentle curves, then
take the right-hander in 4th. Go out wide to the left on the approach,
then clip the apex and *accelerate* round it - counterintuitive, but it
works. About 165mph will do.

Up the short straight into another r-h bend. This is a tricky one; I
take it in a very high 3rd, but a medium 4th might be better in a race
situation. Again, accelerate through the corner. Then up to a vicious
double-apex left. Brake just before the end of the dark groove, and
slide around into the very short straight. Up into 4th just before the
second corner. Stay in 4th around the r-h.

The next l-h needs a tiny lift from the top of 4th gear, which allows
you to slingshot around into the short straight leading up to La
Source. Brake just after the 200 board, but be careful - it's very easy
to spin here. La Source itself is a 40mph 1st-gear corner, which is
easy, but judging when to put the gas back on isn't. Then down the
hill, and over the line.

(The above came from watching a 3:19 I did. Not by any means perfect,
but it shows it can be done!)

--
David. (GPLRank handicap -6.57; Monsters of GPL +271.79)
The GPL Scrapyard: http://www.racesimcentral.net/
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,
really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.

Eldre

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Eldre » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 10:53:38



>This a great saying, Eldred!! :-) I like it!! :-)


>| It's not the arrow, it's the Indian...<g>
>| Eldred

Thanks, but I can't take credit for it.  I 'stole' it frome someone in a
bowling newsgroup... :-)

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +366.59...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Eldre

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Eldre » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 10:53:37



>The main problem I had was a right hander two turns after stavelot.
>Stavelot is the sweeping right with barriers both sides about 2/3rds of the
>way through the lap.  It's followed by a slight left kink, and then theres a
>bigger left kink which leads straight into the first of two right handers.
>I detest these two right-handers, but anyway, I was taking the first one
>*way* too slow.  Instead of braking, as you come round the left hand kink
>and see the turn just mostly release the throttle and get the car way over
>to the far left hand edge of the road, then pull the car hard across to the
>inside at the apex and you'll find you can take the corner a lot faster.

Hmm...my main problem *is* Stavelot.  In races(AI or Humans), I lose a TON of
time there to other cars.  I haven't figured it out yet.
I've been getting through Blanchimont and the right-hander you mentioned better
than before, but it hasn't made a big impact on my laptimes yet.  When I nail
THOSE, then I usually***up somewhere else... :(

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.racesimcentral.net/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +366.59...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
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Thom j

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Thom j » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 12:39:33

I dont care cuz I still like it!!! :-)

| Thanks, but I can't take credit for it.  I 'stole' it frome someone in a
| bowling newsgroup... :-)
|
| Eldred

| "Thom j."writes:
| >This a great saying, Eldred!! :-) I like it!! :-)
| >
| >| It's not the arrow, it's the Indian...<g>
| >| Eldred

Simon Brow

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Simon Brow » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 18:29:28

I know what you mean.  All those laps I did at Spa to get a new PB, I didn't
enjoy any of them really (apart from the last one).  The number of fast laps
I screwed up on the simplest of corners.  I'm always wondering why I hear so
many people say it's their favourite track, I find it extremely frustrating,
way worse than the ring.

Here's how I take Stavelot for what it's worth - Just before the car hits
the darker groove at the turn in point, lift off almost completely and shift
down two gears straight away.  Keep the car aimed well to the right of the
groove the whole time to avoid another close encounter with that hay bail!.
Keep the throttle quite low and let the revs keep dropping and dropping
until you get in between the two white brick walls on either side.  Roughly
half way between the start and end of the white brick wall, floor the
throttle and let the car drift wide on the exit.


simps

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by simps » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 22:02:01

I'm only down to 3:23, but my feeling is that exit speed is super
important.  Don't worry so much about braking points, but if you can
start a long straight with more speed, it will be a big help.  This is
true on most tracks, but more so at Spa.

Bob Simpson

Rafe McAulif

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Rafe McAulif » Fri, 06 Jul 2001 23:02:18

I always hated the second of those two right handers, the tighter 3rd
gear one. At least that dirt banking on the outside always prevented
me from losing more time :)

On Wed, 04 Jul 2001 22:46:36 GMT, "Simon Brown"


>Have you tried lots of practice?  Took me a lot of laps to get from 3:23 to
>3:20.  I also dislike how the eagle (and lotus) feels at spa, even though
>they're nice cars elsewhere, but they are the fastest.  I did my PB in the
>eagle with default setup (3:20.31).

>It was only about a week ago I did that PB so I can tell you which corner I
>had to improve to get the 3:20, maybe you're having problem in the same
>corners.

>The main problem I had was a right hander two turns after stavelot.
>Stavelot is the sweeping right with barriers both sides about 2/3rds of the
>way through the lap.  It's followed by a slight left kink, and then theres a
>bigger left kink which leads straight into the first of two right handers.
>I detest these two right-handers, but anyway, I was taking the first one
>*way* too slow.  Instead of braking, as you come round the left hand kink
>and see the turn just mostly release the throttle and get the car way over
>to the far left hand edge of the road, then pull the car hard across to the
>inside at the apex and you'll find you can take the corner a lot faster.

>The next corner I improved at was blanchimont.  After those two right hander
>I just described theres a great massive straight, and then a kink to the
>right.  The next corner, a 2nd or 3rd gear left hander is blanchimont.  You
>don't need to brake half as much as you'd think here.  Brake less, take the
>corner faster, and 'throw' the car over to the inside as you take the turn,
>and again you'll be able to take the turn quicker.

>Other bits to work on, get a good exit from Les Combes, and try not to lose
>any more speed than is necessary in Masta.

>Anyway, I'm going to edit my version of Spa and remove Malmedy ;)



>> Man I have d/l'd replays etc and seem right on the edge while hotlapping
>but
>> cannot get near a 3:20 at Spa...(picked that number as a goal)....looking
>> ahead of myself in GPLRank...it seems pretty easy to lots of people, and I
>> note the majority use the eagle..I assume for its BHP at high rpm's, but
>> that car is unstable to my style at that track.... anyone have ideas for
>> setups, techniques, tricks etc? I prefer the Lotus or Ferrari.........cmon
>> aliens reveal your secrets!
>> Thanks for any help
>> --
>> Greg31
>> +80.30

Jan Verschuere

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Jan Verschuere » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 00:43:18

The trouble with Spa is one has time to think about the next corner, unlike
a place like Zandvoort, where you "just do it". I try to drive the track
instinctively.

That said, I'm not close to doing 3m20's as a matter of course.

Jan.
=---

Per Thuli

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Per Thuli » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 01:35:00



Someone ought to rename that the "Shift R" corner :)

--
"Hamsters - more fun for less money"

Per Thulin

Spamblock in operation - remove the obvious to reply by mail.

Thom j

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Thom j » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 04:14:17

fwiw kiddz :-)
This is still one of my favorite tracks..lol I guess ever since Tim Wheatley
did a complete detailed "How To" on my old sloppy laps at Spa, my lap
times went from 3:23s to 3:20s in just a few days!! I hit a 3:18+ but that
was before the GPL upgrade and raised the minimum chassis height! :o(
I never got below 3:20 since but I keep trying :-)
Anywayz Thanx TimW, With your help my Spa times are always in the
low 3:20 range.. Cheers Thom_j.

| I know what you mean.  All those laps I did at Spa to get a new PB, I
didn't
| enjoy any of them really (apart from the last one).  The number of fast
laps
| I screwed up on the simplest of corners.  I'm always wondering why I hear
so
| many people say it's their favourite track, I find it extremely
frustrating,
| way worse than the ring.
|
| Here's how I take Stavelot for what it's worth - Just before the car hits
| the darker groove at the turn in point, lift off almost completely and
shift
| down two gears straight away.  Keep the car aimed well to the right of the
| groove the whole time to avoid another close encounter with that hay
bail!.
| Keep the throttle quite low and let the revs keep dropping and dropping
| until you get in between the two white brick walls on either side.
Roughly
| half way between the start and end of the white brick wall, floor the
| throttle and let the car drift wide on the exit.

---
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Peter Ive

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Peter Ive » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 04:45:00



Try dropping just 1 gear for the first part - the car will drift wide
but not too wide - and then another gear before the 2 walls.  Also keep
on the throttle all the time otherwise the car can oversteer off the
inside.

<snippy>
--
Peter Ives
Remove ALL_STRESS before replying
If you know what's good for you, don't listen to me
GPLRank Joystick -50.63 Wheel -17.06

Eldre

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Eldre » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 08:25:48



>Malmedy is incredibly difficult to get right, but if I'm flowing I do
>it all in 3rd with not much change in throttle. Do *not* lift right off
>here - you'll end up in the hedge. Slide out of the bottom of Malmedy
>onto the long straight and thrash down in top gear - you should top
>200mph. Don't change down for Masta, and steer early into the lower, r-
>h part of the corner. Dash down the hill on the left.

You should *top* 200?  I don't even GET to 200...even on my PB - I just
checked.

Why would 4th be better in a race?  Doesn't that make it hard to judge your
braking if you normally go by engine sound in a certain gear?  It does for me.

Eldred
--
Dale Earnhardt, Sr. R.I.P. 1951-2001
Homepage - http://www.umich.edu/~epickett
F1 hcp. +16.36...Monster +366.59...

Never argue with an idiot.  He brings you down to his level, then beats you
with experience...
Remove SPAM-OFF to reply.

Thom j

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by Thom j » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 08:56:18

Yea 200+mph? or kph? I never saw a 200+mph yet? close but not 200+
Enquiring minds would like to know!! :-)

From: "EldredP"
| You should *top* 200?  I don't even GET to 200...even on my PB - I just
| checked.

|
| >Malmedy is incredibly difficult to get right, but if I'm flowing I do
| >it all in 3rd with not much change in throttle. Do *not* lift right off
| >here - you'll end up in the hedge. Slide out of the bottom of Malmedy
| >onto the long straight and thrash down in top gear - you should top
| >200mph. Don't change down for Masta, and steer early into the lower, r-
| >h part of the corner. Dash down the hill on the left.
| >
<snipped>

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David Butte

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by David Butte » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 10:16:22


Mph. You can't do it with the default setup without a tow, but it's not
too hard with RE's setup (or mine, which is based on RE's).

--
David. (GPLRank handicap -6.57; Monsters of GPL +271.79)
The GPL Scrapyard: http://scrapyard.9ug.com
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,
really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.

David Butte

GPL: Spa...secret to getting near a 3:20?

by David Butte » Sat, 07 Jul 2001 10:18:22


<snip>

The clue is in my post: a "very high" 3rd - which strains the engine
more that you'd like in a long race. And I take your point about sound
- I wouldn't risk using a different gear at a really *** corner like
Malmedy, but this one I can usually get away with...

--
David. (GPLRank handicap -6.57; Monsters of GPL +271.79)
The GPL Scrapyard: http://www.racesimcentral.net/
"After all, a mere thousand yards - such a harmless little knoll,
really" - Raymond Mays on Shelsley Walsh.


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