rec.autos.simulators

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

Steve Ferguso

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Steve Ferguso » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

: How is that actually done?? Neutral - blip - gear?? I've tried it only  to
: be greeted by some serious protest from my gearbox. Also I've been told it's
: impossible to do on a synchronised gearbox... true or false?

Certainly not impossible.  I drove 400km home from a canoe trip with a
broken clutch cable.  Luckily it was rural Ontario (Canada) so I only had
to completely stop a handful or times (got going again on the starter
motor while in first gear - not a pretty sight).  anyway, one way it to
apply light pressure on the shifter while you play the throttle - when the
gearbox input and output shaft speeds match, the synchros will allow the
gear to slip in. This, however, is hell on the synchros.  My synchros were
already worn, so I just pulled it to neutral, matched engine revs with
road speed, then jammed it into the next gear.  you're right, though, it
works much better on a race box without synchros.

Stephen

Olav K. Malm

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Olav K. Malm » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00


> > But the worst thing is when driving my real car is that I always
> >  try to find the perfect line.

> This is quite dangerous isn't it? The priority should always to give
> yourself maximum visibility ahead.

Very true, but noone with the sanity intact (which exclude everyone on r.a.s.)
would only do that withing the limit of the lane you are in, and the variation
is only about one meter or so, so the visibility issue isn't that much. On a
very narrow road with a steep mountainside on one hand and a 300 metre drop
into the fjord on the other, a very common scenery of the western part of
Norway, you have to think visibilty, and traffic ahead. You generally have to
concentrate so much to keep the car on the road that semi-racing isn't even
thought of.

But of course, such driving would only be recommended on very flat terrain,
with good visibility and wide lanes.

--
Olav K. Malmin
remove spam when replying

John Walla

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by John Walla » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

On Thu, 19 Aug 1999 09:34:41 -0400, Michael Barlow


>    What would really say that you're driving like you would online is when
>you crash before you get to the end of the block ;-)

Is that just after the traffic lights change and you wipe out six
others cars in doing so? :-)

Cheers!
John

Jan Verschuere

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Jan Verschuere » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

When applying the slight pressure, should I hear a grinding noise or not?

Jan.
------


><snip>
>Certainly not impossible.  I drove 400km home from a canoe trip with a
>broken clutch cable.  Luckily it was rural Ontario (Canada) so I only had
>to completely stop a handful or times (got going again on the starter
>motor while in first gear - not a pretty sight).  anyway, one way it to
>apply light pressure on the shifter while you play the throttle - when the
>gearbox input and output shaft speeds match, the synchros will allow the
>gear to slip in. This, however, is hell on the synchros.  My synchros were
>already worn, so I just pulled it to neutral, matched engine revs with
>road speed, then jammed it into the next gear.  you're right, though, it
>works much better on a race box without synchros.

>Stephen

Andrew MacPhers

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Andrew MacPhers » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

Actually that's the perfect place... then you only damage yourself, not
anyone else on the road :-)

Andrew McP

Terry Welc

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Terry Welc » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

There should be no "significant" grinding noise at the point where you
match engine speed to the geartrain (tough to do for more than an
instant).  As long as you don't use more than slight pressure on the
shifter, you will not be damaging anything even with the gear clash
sound.  Of course that depends a lot, too, on the ***.  My old '68
Chevrolet truck could be shifted without clutching but it was very hard
to get it right.  My '87 Mazda truck simply will not go into gear
without clutching, though (so far).



not?

Sent via Deja.com http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.

Olav K. Malm

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Olav K. Malm » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00


> > On a very narrow road with a steep mountainside on one
> > hand and a 300 metre drop into the fjord on the other

> Actually that's the perfect place... then you only damage yourself, not
> anyone else on the road :-)

True and Not True :P

On a road like that it is extremely important to keep as much to the right of the
road as you can, because the locals use to drive ridiculously fast, because they
count on everyone keeping to the right, and not in the middle of the road :)

It is still safer to sway a bit left and right of your _lane_ on a wide open
road than on a narrow one.

The important thing is still to never ever try to hit the real apex of a left
hand corner, (that's the right one for those of you who haven't learned to drive
yet :P)

--
Olav K. Malmin
remove spam when replying

Mark Seer

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Mark Seer » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

False Jan. I do it all the time. It's just a question of getting the revs
right.

Mark

> How is that actually done?? Neutral - blip - gear?? I've tried it only  to
> be greeted by some serious protest from my gearbox. Also I've been told
it's
> impossible to do on a synchronised gearbox... true or false?

> Jan.
> ------





> ><snip>

Mark Seer

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Mark Seer » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

Aha. When I do this in future and when starting off in first gear, I can now
stop forcing the wife to frop the car off the jack with the wheels spinning
;-)

Mark  LOL


> : How is that actually done?? Neutral - blip - gear?? I've tried it only
to
> : be greeted by some serious protest from my gearbox. Also I've been told
it's
> : impossible to do on a synchronised gearbox... true or false?

> Certainly not impossible.  I drove 400km home from a canoe trip with a
> broken clutch cable.  Luckily it was rural Ontario (Canada) so I only had
> to completely stop a handful or times (got going again on the starter
> motor while in first gear - not a pretty sight).  anyway, one way it to
> apply light pressure on the shifter while you play the throttle - when the
> gearbox input and output shaft speeds match, the synchros will allow the
> gear to slip in. This, however, is hell on the synchros.  My synchros were
> already worn, so I just pulled it to neutral, matched engine revs with
> road speed, then jammed it into the next gear.  you're right, though, it
> works much better on a race box without synchros.

> Stephen

Wolfgang Prei

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Wolfgang Prei » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00


>There should be no "significant" grinding noise at the point where you
>match engine speed to the geartrain (tough to do for more than an
>instant).  As long as you don't use more than slight pressure on the
>shifter, you will not be damaging anything even with the gear clash
>sound.  Of course that depends a lot, too, on the ***.  My old '68
>Chevrolet truck could be shifted without clutching but it was very hard
>to get it right.  My '87 Mazda truck simply will not go into gear
>without clutching, though (so far).

It will get easier as soon as the synchromesh rings are worn. :)
For those of you who just want to test the principle of matching
speed, revs and pressure, without killing transmissions, try going
*out* of gear without the clutch. While coasting to a red light, apply
a bit of throttle and try to shift to neutral. You will find that
there's a sweet spot where it is very easy to get out of gear. As a
next step, you simply have to find that same spot when going *into*
gear. Easy, isn't it? :)

BTW, if I understood things correctly, one of the reasons why it is so
difficult to shift a standard gearbox without clutching is this: The
teeth of the gears in 'civilian' gearboxes are tilted (I don't know
what it's called in English - the german word is "schraegverzahnt", as
if that would help anyone... :)

They look like this when viewed from above:

///////

The benefit is that they can transmit more torque and, more
importantly for normal cars, the gears don't sing.

(Old) racing gears have straight teeth:

|||||||

They are more noisy (on some older normal gearboxes, the reverse gear
is built like this. When driving backwards, one hears this annoying
sound) but easier to shift without a clutch or synchromesh.



>> When applying the slight pressure, should I hear a grinding noise or
>not?

--
Wolfgang Preiss   \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.


Jan Verschuere

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Jan Verschuere » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

Show me sometime... ;-)

Jan.
------


>False Jan. I do it all the time. It's just a question of getting the revs
>right.

>Mark

><snip>

mark jeangerar

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by mark jeangerar » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

No doubt. I think it has for us all. The only thing is...

I can't get this frimmm frammin' frippy dipsnizzitz SHIFT+R to work in my
trooper.

--
Mark Jeangerard
www.soundchaserweb.com
New Mexico USA

Tony Jeste

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Tony Jeste » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00


>  (I don't know what it's called in English - the german word is "schraegverzahnt",
> as
> if that would help anyone... :)

> They look like this when viewed from above:

> ///////

In English they are know as "bevel cut" as opposed to "straight cut"
-Tony
Mark Seer

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Mark Seer » Sat, 21 Aug 1999 04:00:00

Sure will mate but BEFORE we hit that Irish bar :-)

Mark

> Show me sometime... ;-)

> Jan.
> ------

> >False Jan. I do it all the time. It's just a question of getting the revs
> >right.

> >Mark

> ><snip>

Wolfgang Prei

GPL & Voodoo 3 Promblems

by Wolfgang Prei » Sun, 22 Aug 1999 04:00:00



>>  (I don't know what it's called in English - the german word is "schraegverzahnt",
>> as
>> if that would help anyone... :)

>> They look like this when viewed from above:

>> ///////

>In English they are know as "bevel cut" as opposed to "straight cut"

Thanks, Tony. I thought the expression "bevel" was reserved for gears
which have a conical shape, like the ones in the differential.

--
Wolfgang Preiss   \ E-mail copies of replies to this posting are welcome.



rec.autos.simulators is a usenet newsgroup formed in December, 1993. As this group was always unmoderated there may be some spam or off topic articles included. Some links do point back to racesimcentral.net as we could not validate the original address. Please report any pages that you believe warrant deletion from this archive (include the link in your email). RaceSimCentral.net is in no way responsible and does not endorse any of the content herein.