rec.autos.simulators

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

John Bodi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by John Bodi » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00

I finally got to sample the beta version of DTR, and I've got to tell you
that I think this is going to be an awesome game!  It may not out-do GPL in
terms of realism, but it easily falls into the same range as SCGT and Viper
Racing.  Early reports indicated some online glitchiness in the alpha and
early beta versions, but I was able to conduct several one-on-one online
races with folks here in the US and also people as far away as Australia
with NO lag.

This is pretty awesome for short ovals (some as short as 1/4 mile) where you
can see the entire track all the way around.  The Speedway oval in
Powerslide showed a LOT of lag even with only 2 people online, so DTR's
online functions seem much improved over what Ratbag did with Powerslide
(which was pretty darn good already).

The late models in DTR are the BEST!  I managed to catch some live
Hav-A-Tampa late model action on Speedvision Friday night, and thanks to my
recent exposure to DTR, I found myself VERY interested in the on-track
action.  What I saw from the in-car camera views pretty much matched what I
saw happening in DTR, and the late models in DTR look much more realistic to
me now that I've had a chance to really watch similar late models in
action -- Ratbag obviously did their homework for DTR!

As for doing one's homework, I heard that a few of the beta testers feel
that DTR's physics are too arcade-like because it feels too "disconnected"
to be realistic.  In response to that, I would like to share with you the
following post from the rec.autos.sport.indy newsgroup.  Someone made the
post below stating that they feel that racing in a dirt bowl doesn't require
as much skill as driving on a road or street course, and Allan Pagan,
co-owner of the Indy Racing League's Pagan Racing Team, posted a reply
describing the sensations you get while executing a four-wheel slide all the
way around a dirt oval:

=====SNIP=====

Its obvious that you have never felt the true wonder of a full four wheel
slide all the way around a dirt oval, where you are seemingly not hooked to
the surface at all, but skimming above it, in what should be a completely
out of control situation (since you don't feel connected to the surface),
but yet you feel completely in control.  doing this in a crowd is even more,
shall we say, stimulating ...

===END SNIP===

That last paragraph is Allan Pagan's response describing the dirt track
racing experience, which I think pretty much sums up the Dirt Track Racing
experience.  I've never driven a race car on dirt before, but after testing
DTR, I immediately identifed with Allan Pagan's comments, and if that's the
way it is in real life, then it seems to me that DTR does indeed qualify as
a dirt track SIMULATION, and a darn good one at that, based on feedback
from real dirt track racers like Justin Belfiore.

The issue of arcade versus simulation will undoubtedly be a hotly debated
aspect of the DTR title -- it's pretty obvious that cars sliding on dirt are
going to handle MUCH differently than a car in a similar situation on
pavement.  The track wetness in DTR can be varied from dry to wet, and
eveything in between.  "Wet" means wet, sloppy, traction-free mudhole, and
"dry" is equally slick for different reasons.  The physics modeling in DTR
feels "right" to me as far as what it takes to correct the slide, what it
takes to hold it through a turn (TONS of opposite-lock), and how the car
handles under power (you CAN steer with the throttle!).  All in all, I think
that DTR feels like a realistic simulation of a dirt track racer in much the
same way that Viper Racing feels like a good simulation of a front-engine,
rear-drive, ***, testerone-drenched sports car, and also in the same way
that GPL feels lke a good simulation of 1967-era Grand Prix machines.

Based on my limited exposure, I have to say that while DTR may not be the
be-all and end-all of dirt track racing simulations, it's definitely a great
start.  Papyrus started their empire with their groundbreaking Indy 500
simulation, then they went on to make ICR1, ICR2, NASCAR Racing, N2, GPL,
N3, etc..  Their empire started with the Indy Racing simulation and the
original ICR title, though, so if you think of Powerslide as Ratbag's "Indy
500" simulation, and DTR as their "ICR" title, it seems like a pretty good
starting point -- and that would mean that the best is yet to come!  At any
rate, kudos to Ratbag -- I think they've come pretty close to hitting the
nail on the head with DTR!

I'll be posting a full preview on The IRL Insider site in the next week or
so.  Stay tuned!

-- John Bodin
    Publisher, The IRL Insider Magazine
    http://www.racesimcentral.net/

The_Mocke

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by The_Mocke » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00


Now I am even more e***d about this game, if possible. I just need to work
less at night so I can get back into the night time online racing that this
game will bring.

The Mocker

Mtb70

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Mtb70 » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Maybe a few people will remember SODA from Sierra a couple years ago. This is a
great sim/game, way too much fun imo.
This is one you should pick out of the bargain bin.
John Moore
Tim A. Deatherag

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Tim A. Deatherag » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Anyone know what the latest revised release date for DTR
?????????????????????????

--
Tim A. Deatherage

"Admitted Sim ***"


John Bodi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by John Bodi » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00

It went GOLD on Friday -- it should be shipping within a couple of weeks, I
believe.

-- JB


>Anyone know what the latest revised release date for DTR
>?????????????????????????

>--
>Tim A. Deatherage

>"Admitted Sim ***"



>> Maybe a few people will remember SODA from Sierra a couple years ago.
This
>is a
>> great sim/game, way too much fun imo.
>> This is one you should pick out of the bargain bin.
>> John Moore

John Bodi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by John Bodi » Mon, 11 Oct 1999 04:00:00


>On Sun, 10 Oct 1999 15:51:55 GMT,




>>> I finally got to sample the beta version of DTR, and I've got to tell
you
>>> that I think this is going to be an awesome game.

>>Now I am even more e***d about this game, if possible. I just need to
work
>>less at night so I can get back into the night time online racing that
this
>>game will bring.

>>The Mocker

>Me too!! I can hardly wait. Thanks John!

You're welcome, Ed! <G>  Thankfully, the wait will be short.  You guys are
gonna LOVE DTR!

-- JB

Christopher Rossi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Christopher Rossi » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

John, great report on DTR. I had to reply to the anonymous
person that made that remark about racing on dirt. I think
it is safe to say that the aforementioned critic never saw
the Indy Champ dirt cars on the old Langhorne Mile - a circle
of dirt that was called the "widow maker" by the racing fraternity.
I would hope that someday Ratbag would make a sim of those cars/tracks
for the old Championship Trail - Langhorne, Springfield,
Duquoin, Syracuse and Indianapolis Fairgrounds miles. 100 mile races on
those dirt tracks in the fifties were the best races ever IMHO.
chris r
John Bodin found this quote from someone:

p.s. I hope this person never says this within ear shot of
A.J. or one of his fans!

friendly pysc

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by friendly pysc » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

any word on a demo yet? can hardly wait!

--
the friendly pysco

I know it's spelled wrong
but I'm not a psycho ;-)


Keith Ackerknech

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Keith Ackerknech » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Demo is currently in the works. Latest word is that it may include 3 tracks
and possibly multi-player capabilities.

Keith


> any word on a demo yet? can hardly wait!

> --
> the friendly pysco

> I know it's spelled wrong
> but I'm not a psycho ;-)



> > It went GOLD on Friday -- it should be shipping within a couple of
weeks,
> I
> > believe.

> > -- JB

Jeffrey Ha

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Jeffrey Ha » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

On Sun, 10 Oct 1999 10:33:58 -0500, "John Bodin"


>The late models in DTR are the BEST!  I managed to catch some live
>Hav-A-Tampa late model action on Speedvision Friday night, and thanks to my
>recent exposure to DTR, I found myself VERY interested in the on-track
>action.

If they were going to do dirt, why the heck didn't they model real
race cars rather than more stock car pieces of crap?  All the talk
about dirt cars got me e***d until I saw the cars themselves.  What?
They are doing a dirt racing game and they don't model open wheelers?
No sprint/midget/WOO models? Sorry but the last thing I want to do is
run around in circles in some junk stock car. Ratbag needs to up their
physics model to handle open wheel interactions...

Maybe the next product...

Jeff

Jeffrey Ha

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Jeffrey Ha » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00



>Then don't buy it, dude....

I thought that I made that point :)  I was just
surprised there was no question about  dirt
racing without sprinters.  Perhaps this was covered
in earlier threads that I ignored...
mark8..

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by mark8.. » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Actually, I am glad they are using the "stock car pieces of crap".
Sprints would have been nice but I would rather race the latemodels and
beaters because thats what I go and see at the track every weekend. I
have always wanted to race a latemodel and now Ill get the chance.
(kind of).
I heard that sprints might be in DTR2 if there is going to be one.

Mark Coglan
http://www.racesimcentral.net/



> If they were going to do dirt, why the heck didn't they model real
> race cars rather than more stock car pieces of crap?  All the talk
> about dirt cars got me e***d until I saw the cars themselves.  What?
> They are doing a dirt racing game and they don't model open wheelers?
> No sprint/midget/WOO models? Sorry but the last thing I want to do is
> run around in circles in some junk stock car. Ratbag needs to up their
> physics model to handle open wheel interactions...

> Maybe the next product...

> Jeff

Sent via Deja.com http://www.racesimcentral.net/
Before you buy.
Rick Sweene

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by Rick Sweene » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Agree!

> On Sun, 10 Oct 1999 10:33:58 -0500, "John Bodin"

> >The late models in DTR are the BEST!  I managed to catch some live
> >Hav-A-Tampa late model action on Speedvision Friday night, and thanks to my
> >recent exposure to DTR, I found myself VERY interested in the on-track
> >action.

> If they were going to do dirt, why the heck didn't they model real
> race cars rather than more stock car pieces of crap?  All the talk
> about dirt cars got me e***d until I saw the cars themselves.  What?
> They are doing a dirt racing game and they don't model open wheelers?
> No sprint/midget/WOO models? Sorry but the last thing I want to do is
> run around in circles in some junk stock car. Ratbag needs to up their
> physics model to handle open wheel interactions...

> Maybe the next product...

> Jeff

John Bodi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by John Bodi » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Wizard Works has deals in place with Wal-Mart stores, I think -- Deer Hunter
(also by Wizard Works) is Wal-Mart's #1 selling software title, FWIW.
You'll be seeing DTR at Wal-Marts for $19.99 very soon, I think.

-- JB


>On Mon, 11 Oct 1999 08:20:48 -0700,


>>any word on a demo yet? can hardly wait!

>No demo and apparently no retail stores that so far are
>planning to carry it. I just posted this to another thread:

>I just made a tour of all the retail sites I usually visit to buy my games.
>I could find no mention of Dirt Track Racing. Electronics Boutique,
>http://www.ebworld.com , is usually a great source of info on upcoming
>games, ship dates, etc., but has no mention of Dirt Track Racing.

>Even AVault, http://www.avault.com , has no mention of
>it in their upcoming releases list..

>Wizard Works has a press announcement from Sepetember which says:

>http://www.wizardworks.com/press/pr_dtr.htm
>" Dirt Track Racing will be available at retail outlets nationwide in
>November for a suggested retail price of $19.99 or through secure
>online transactions at www.gtstore.com."

>But on WizardWorks (pathetic) product site there is not a word about it:

>http://www.wizardworks.com/wwnprod.htm

>--
>* rrevved at mindspring dot com

John Bodi

DTR -- random thoughts & a brief first impressions

by John Bodi » Tue, 12 Oct 1999 04:00:00

Chill out, Jeffrey -- the Late Models ROCK, and they're almost good enough
to make you forget all about Sprint Cars.  The stocks are great fun, and the
Pro Stocks (a.k.a. "hobby stocks" or "bombers") are just a notch below the
Late Models in my book.

Trust me on this -- I'm a big Midget/Sprint Car fan, and I've only seen Late
Models in person a couple of times, but thanks to DTR, I'm a Late Model fan
now.

The sequel to DTR should include Sprint Cars, FWIW, but for $19.99, I
wouldn't wait that long if I were you -- you'll just be depriving yourself
if you do.

-- JB


>On Sun, 10 Oct 1999 10:33:58 -0500, "John Bodin"

>>The late models in DTR are the BEST!  I managed to catch some live
>>Hav-A-Tampa late model action on Speedvision Friday night, and thanks to
my
>>recent exposure to DTR, I found myself VERY interested in the on-track
>>action.

>If they were going to do dirt, why the heck didn't they model real
>race cars rather than more stock car pieces of crap?  All the talk
>about dirt cars got me e***d until I saw the cars themselves.  What?
>They are doing a dirt racing game and they don't model open wheelers?
>No sprint/midget/WOO models? Sorry but the last thing I want to do is
>run around in circles in some junk stock car. Ratbag needs to up their
>physics model to handle open wheel interactions...

>Maybe the next product...

>Jeff


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