rec.autos.simulators

by **Michael Bruyninc** » Thu, 01 Aug 1996 04:00:00

Dear Chris,

I 100% agree with your post... it's a great game but but but :)...
especially point 9... I can drive with Heinz Harald Frentzen Black
Sauber car and indeed win a race... Until now he hasn't done that
yet... I was also major disapointed that there is absolutely no
difference between minor and top teams, not even the Williams' are a
bit better then the rest, althought THEY (=microprose) are sponsering
Williams.

A paintkit and somthing like an disigning room (so you can design your
own F1 car, MS has even something to make your own planes so why not
make your own F1 car) would be really great. As you might know Ferrari
does everything to get their car more streamlined, so it's nothing
irreal I'm asking.
Anyway I somewhere picked up that there will be an update arround
Xmas, supporting a lot off bugfixes, like the damage bug, and also a
paintkit and the weather will then work too.

Indeed, the parade lap just may not be left out, even driving your car
into 'parc ferme' just would finish it off.

The Rails really suck, especially if you accidently forget to turn off
the pitrequest, last time I got a damn good time if I just did not got
sucked into the walls of the pit :(.

Oh monaco is great ! and its a pain in the ass that nothing changes if
you drive through the tunnel, no lighteffects or no soundchanges. Try
this, change the graphics settings to automatic, then drive on
monace... do you see the tunnel ??? I didn't, if that isn't a bug then
I really don't know, imagine, driving somewhere for the first time
(like I did) and expeting a tunnel but you just can't find it :).

Another request from me is that the 1996 rules should be included. I
really like the 1994 rules, and I'm even wrestingling with the
car-setups, but though I think it's a bit a pain in the ass that you
can't drive with the 1996 rules. The game did come out in 1996 and
not in 1994.
The car almost completely changed in comaprison of 1994. And there is
also a 107% rule to get slowies from the race.

There is only one track that I'm missing, and that is the current
Europe Track, Nurnburgring... maybe it would be great to add or remove
tracks, maybe even create your own tracks.

by **JEB** » Thu, 01 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> The steering help option is greyed out on my setup screen when I have
> the keyboard selected. It only un-greys when I select a joystick/mouse,
> and driving with one of these is almost impossible.

> > Otherwise a good list, a bit
> > childish in parts, I mean who gives a shit if there is a shadow over
> > the***pit in the tunnel at Monaco. We need a patch for that???
> > I think not.

> I'm just pointing out that considering so much hype was put into the
> "realism factor" and we had to wait so long, that this is a bit of an
> obvious oversight..... :-)

> --
> *** Pass or Pull Over! ** NO AD BREAKS IN TELEVISED F1 RACES ***

> http://www.racesimcentral.net/~chrisl/
> ---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------
> Standard disclaimer: The views expressed here are entirely my own.
> ---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------

Well, then I would suggest that you should have identified the fact
that on "your" setup there is a problem with steering. It is hardly
fair, or factual, to be critical of the sim on this point when it is
clearly not valid. I use a T2 steering wheel and there is no noticeable
problem in the steering area that I can see. Frankly I'd love to have
a CPU nudge in the right direction in some of the curves at Brazil and
Pacific.
On the shadow issue, someone has pointed out the fact that there are
lights in the tunnel, and sure enough there are. I did not really
notice them until after I read that post. Loading up Monaco and
drving through the tunnel and looking up revealed the lights.

Again, good list overall. I just don't think it's fair to be
unrealistically demanding of a $49.00 piece of game software as
though it really mattered in the larger scheme of things.

JEB in Vegas

by **JEB** » Thu, 01 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> By your logic that it's only software and "only" costs $49.00, I guess
> you're willing to put up with whatever comes out of the box and think that
> it's okay... after all, it's only software. If everyone had that attitude,
> I hate to think how hard the current games would be to install and
> configure and how crappy they would be to play. Everyone would still be
> playing the original Indy 500 sim if people didn't want more.

> Have fun, lighten up.

> Scott

> --

> I have seen the enemy, and it
> is my registry...

Damn your right Scott, you are always right.
Thanks for putting me straight.

JEB in Vegas

by **JEB** » Thu, 01 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> Go to your control method menu. From there, highlight an unused setting (call
> it anything you want). Now you can manipulate things and you can turn steering
> help off.

> Hope this helps.

> Ashraf

Darn, Ashraf...why did ya have to go and tell 'em that.
I was starting to really enjoy all of 'em making ***s
out of themselves cuz they had not discovered that they
can turn off the steering help, even with their keyboard
thingies there. And I was NOT gonna tell 'em...hehehehe

JEB in Vegas

PS ruined all our fun....(Grin)

by **JEB** » Thu, 01 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> Well, if you drive with the keyboard what do you expect? It is the most
> unrealistic method of controlling a car possible. A joystick is not a
> patch on a wheel, but it's a damn sight better than keys.

> Julian

> _____________________________________________________________________

> University of Oxford

Thank you Julian. My sentiments EXACTLY.
If one doesn't have the equipment to run the sim
the way the designers intended, one should not
make claims that the product is defective.
That was my only point in the first place.

And, further, I'd not lift a finger to help a
person who was trying to fly a complex flight
sim with a keyboard either. It simply isn't
worth it. If one is serious about his or her
"games", one finds a way to get the "serious"
equipment, or one doesn't go around claiming
that the "game" is defective.

JEB in Vegas

by **Julian Lov** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> Ok, Jeb. would you please tell me (as you are obviously so smart) how is streering
> help turned off ? I am driving with keyboard so think before you answer. If you
> know the right answer, I thank you and apologize my tone of voice, but if you
> don't - in future think very hard before commenting somebodys message. Chris
> doesn't tell what device he uses to drive his GP2 but maybe your answer will help
> him too.

> And by the way Jeb, I found your reply childish too. Maybe somebody does care
> about some of his views so give him a chance. And for all: give everybody else a
> chance too, every possible patch for GP2 would be good news and only chance to get
> them is to keep noice about bugs etc.

Well, if you drive with the keyboard what do you expect? It is the most
unrealistic method of controlling a car possible. A joystick is not a
patch on a wheel, but it's a damn sight better than keys.

Julian

_____________________________________________________________________

University of Oxford

by **Barry Leek-Bran** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

<<other posts snipped>>

>I still find that they drive into me if I happen to be in their way on
>the line they want to take. I tried again last night, out-braking one of
>the cars and taking the inside line. Once I was clearly ahead of him, I
>turned into the corner and was rammed from the left side-pod as he
>followed the "computer-preffered" line in the corner. When we both
>stopped on the side of the track, all the other cars piled up behind
>without making any effort to steer around the problem or overtake.
>--
> *** Pass or Pull Over! ** NO AD BREAKS IN TELEVISED F1 RACES ***

>http://www.division.co.uk/~chrisl/
>---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------
> Standard disclaimer: The views expressed here are entirely my own.
>---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------

Are you sure you weren't playing ICR2. The opponents in ICR2 think
nothing of ramming you off the road if your anywhere near their
preferred line. In GP2 I quite often use the tactic of outbraking my
opponent, whereby he changes his approach and I go through (maybe
you've been unlucky).

As for ICR2 realsim, well, ever had the back-end start to slide
out.... the game goes into a "all user response ignored, I'm going to
spin" mode. And how about the speed of the graphics? ICR2 runs
beautifully on my P150, but where's the detail. All the tracks are
like paddocks!!

However, I do enjoy both GP2 and ICR2. I like the fact they have
differences (otherwise I would only ever race one of them).

Bazza

by **JEB** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> Ive seen this posted a couple of times and just thought it about time
> to respond. From the perspective of a driver who has a hard time
> getting under a 10minute time around MONZA.<VBG> If you block the
> leaders long enough , half a lap or so they WILL boot you off. Not
> that I mind the flaw but it is a flaw. Yes there are some famous
> incidents of drivers knocking each other off the track but lets say if
> it happened as much as its happening to me then FISA would require
> bumpers.<VBG>

> Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand

Obviously those CC drivers don't know WHO you are...hehe
The swine, upstarts, they do it to me too...why the nerve
of those silicon slimeballs....

JEB in Vegas (Grin)

by **'John' Joao Sil** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

>> Otherwise a good list, a bit
>> childish in parts, I mean who gives a shit if there is a shadow over
>> the***pit in the tunnel at Monaco. We need a patch for that???
>> I think not.

>I'm just pointing out that considering so much hype was put into the
>"realism factor" and we had to wait so long, that this is a bit of an
>obvious oversight..... :-)

As long as we're talking realism, I want a couple of nice
buxom grid girls wearing nothing but the Scuderia Ferrari flag!

;)

Well maybe the flag part is not so realistic.

Cheers.

--John
--
-------------------
John (Joao) Silva
http://www.racesimcentral.net/~jsilva
Seattle, Washington USA.

by **Chris Longhurs** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

> It would appear that if you use the keyboard you can NOT turn off
> steering help.
> I don't know, I DO NOT USE A KEYBOARD for driving sims. I use a wheel,
> because
> when I go and look into a car, any car, or truck for that matter, I see
> a
> wheel, and not a keyboard.

Do you not feel a bit daft sitting in front of a PC with a steering
wheel in your hands? :-)

I'd still argue this. Why is the game designed to interfere with the
keyboard steering. I'm referring to the 'analog' setting on Nascar
Racing, where the longer you held the steering key down, the more it
turned the steering. Why couldn't this be replicated in GP2? I still
classify this as a bug. Anyway, as I've heard, even if you do turn the
steering help completely off, and even if you do have a steering wheel,
the car will still turn into a corner on it's own and exit at the apex
if you leave it unchecked. Perhaps you could confirm or deny this?
Travel into a corner at about 80kmh or so without touching the steering
and let us know what happens.......

Except a mouse or a joystick......In other words you can only turn off
steering help if you've forked out for a steering wheel.

......Plus however much you paid for the steering wheel........

Like I keep posting - the game was delayed on ground of technical
excellency - and that has turned out to be a bit of a misleading
statement as the final game has so many niggly little flaws in it.

--
*** Pass or Pull Over! ** NO AD BREAKS IN TELEVISED F1 RACES ***

http://www.division.co.uk/~chrisl/
---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------
Standard disclaimer: The views expressed here are entirely my own.
---------------------------..oooOOOooo..----------------------------

by **Scott Willse** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

Well, tell me, JEB, do F1 drivers peer into a computer screen and sit
indoors during an f1 race? No?? Then I guess you still aren't as close to
the real thing as you think you are. Don't be a dweeb. Not everyone can
afford steering devices. Some people either have joysticks, so they can
use them with NON-driving sims (imagine that!) or they are using a keyboard
until they can afford something else. Is that difficult to comprehend?

Wrong. I have a joystick and the option to turn off steering help is also
grayed out. Once again you don't have a clue what you are babbling about
but are more than willing to slam someone with your made up "facts" anyway.
I have no idea if everyone with joysticks has this problem, or just me,
but at least one non-keyboard user has the same thing happening.

Simulations are supposed to mimic reality as closely as is reasonable.
Since the original World Circuit included rain, and real f1 racing cars
also drive in the rain (using steering wheels, not keyboards, as I learned
today) I don't think it's either a technically difficult or unreasonable
request.

By your logic that it's only software and "only" costs $49.00, I guess
you're willing to put up with whatever comes out of the box and think that
it's okay... after all, it's only software. If everyone had that attitude,
I hate to think how hard the current games would be to install and
configure and how crappy they would be to play. Everyone would still be
playing the original Indy 500 sim if people didn't want more.

Have fun, lighten up.

Scott

--

I have seen the enemy, and it
is my registry...

by **Ashraf Ghebranio** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

>Subject: Re: *F1GP2 - Moans list and a question.
>Date: 31 Jul 1996 01:41:44 GMT

>[list of complaints deleted]
>>An excellent assessment of the situation, if one chooses to focus
>>on these matters, however, I'm afraid that you have not discovered
>>how to turn off the steering help if you are reporting that the CPU
>>fights you for control of the car. With the steering help off you
>>have to fight with the CPU to get into a curve, not the other way
>>around. You can turn completely in reverse and drive the wrong
>>direction on the track if the steering help is off. I'd check that
>>in the setup menus if I were you. Otherwise a good list, a bit
>>childish in parts, I mean who gives a shit if there is a shadow over
>>the***pit in the tunnel at Monaco. We need a patch for that???
>>I think not.
>I must agree that the CPU still tries to steer you into a corner even
>when you're not steering at all. Try to approach a turn and do not
>steer into this turn. Every single time your car will go into the turn
>and exit it halfway instead of completely missing it. Annoying to say
>the least.
>Marco
>--
>"Reality is for people who can't handle Star Trek."

Go to your control method menu. From there, highlight an unused setting (call
it anything you want). Now you can manipulate things and you can turn steering
help off.

Hope this helps.

Ashraf

---
DISCLAIMER: My comments are my own and not necessarily those of my employer
OR my service provider.

**************************************************************************
Ashraf Ghebranious

"If it takes only one person to suppress your religion, then it cant be
much of a religion then can it?" - me

To find out more about the cult that is Scientology, subscribe to
ALT.RELIGION.SCIENTOLOGY. Dont get me wrong, these people are dangerous!

"Jesus woman! I dont give a ***!" Rhett Butler, slightly paraphrased
**************************************************************************

by **papa..** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

Yes the manual is rather dull on this issue isnt it. Just select other
device in the controller section and make your choices. I puzzled this
one out in 3 hours of wondering if I had made a mistake getting this
sim. Glad I stuck to it. Just wish there was more of an effort to BETA
TEST manuals. Not a slame against the current Beta Testors but just an
observation that maybe inexperienced users (like me<G>) should be
included in the test. If I can understand a manual anyone can.

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand

>--

>I have seen the enemy, and it
>is my registry...

by **papa..** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

Ive seen this posted a couple of times and just thought it about time
to respond. From the perspective of a driver who has a hard time
getting under a 10minute time around MONZA.<VBG> If you block the
leaders long enough , half a lap or so they WILL boot you off. Not
that I mind the flaw but it is a flaw. Yes there are some famous
incidents of drivers knocking each other off the track but lets say if
it happened as much as its happening to me then FISA would require
bumpers.<VBG>

Pierre PAPA DOC Legrand

by **Ian Barl** » Fri, 02 Aug 1996 04:00:00

>> > 3. Speaking of Monaco - why does the engine sound not change in the
>> > tunnel?

>> Surely it is much more important to be able to hear you opponents?
>> Changing sounds in the tunnel - while nice - is just ear candy.

FYI, I have seen many compliants about CPU occupancy.... more sounds
take up CPU time which means even less eye candy!!.

I too would like to see changes in weather and wet races etc. But can
my P100 handle the extra computation? No!. Time to compromise I
guess :-(

I had a similar problem with my T1 and by altering the dead zone
setting in the control method menu I was able to get a better
response. (Okay... so I use Steering Assistance!!! my T1 pots have
seen better days ok?<gg>.)

Wishfull thinking!!<bg>. Are you listening Eurosport?

Regards,

Ian.