rec.autos.simulators

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

Ian Riche

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Ian Riche » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Dear All,

In an effort to improve my laptimes, I've been examining where I'm slower
compared to you hotshots out there.  No surprises - I'm earlier on the
brakes and later on the throttle.

I'm having some success at getting earlier on the throttle.  The
breakthrough came when I realised that the throttle is an analogue device,
and I don't have to go from throttle feathered to throttle full open in a
fraction of a nanosecond. Duh.

The braking is proving less easy to improve.  I'm using a thrustmaster
sprint wheel which cannot have the pedals in spit axis mode, so I cannot
follow any of the advice for trail braking.  At present braking technique is
to lose all the speed I need in a straight line, then turn into the corner,
then add power gradually as I pass the apex.  Looking at replays, people
seem to be able to lose speed consistently all the way to the apex.
Whenever I try this, I always lose the rear end of the car in uncontrollable
oversteer.

Any hints?

If it helps, I'm concentrating (still! - after having the full game over a
year) on the same tracks as were in the demo.  I've got down to 1:29.7 in
the Lotus at Monza and a best of 1:07.5 in the Ferrari at the Glen.

Thanks for any help!

Ian

Ian Riches
Bedford, UK

------


Steve Garrot

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Steve Garrot » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Just a thought, could you not get split axis by using the paddle for
braking and the accell pedal? Might be hard to train the body to do
so. . .

SLG


>Dear All,

>In an effort to improve my laptimes, I've been examining where I'm slower
>compared to you hotshots out there.  No surprises - I'm earlier on the
>brakes and later on the throttle.

>I'm having some success at getting earlier on the throttle.  The
>breakthrough came when I realised that the throttle is an analogue device,
>and I don't have to go from throttle feathered to throttle full open in a
>fraction of a nanosecond. Duh.

>The braking is proving less easy to improve.  I'm using a thrustmaster
>sprint wheel which cannot have the pedals in spit axis mode, so I cannot
>follow any of the advice for trail braking.  At present braking technique is
>to lose all the speed I need in a straight line, then turn into the corner,
>then add power gradually as I pass the apex.  Looking at replays, people
>seem to be able to lose speed consistently all the way to the apex.
>Whenever I try this, I always lose the rear end of the car in uncontrollable
>oversteer.

>Any hints?

>If it helps, I'm concentrating (still! - after having the full game over a
>year) on the same tracks as were in the demo.  I've got down to 1:29.7 in
>the Lotus at Monza and a best of 1:07.5 in the Ferrari at the Glen.

>Thanks for any help!

>Ian

>Ian Riches
>Bedford, UK

>------



(All spelling errors are intentional and are there to show new
and improved ways of spelling old words. Grammatical errors are
due to too many English classes/teachers)
Slic

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Slic » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Not really an answer to your question but :
1st try not to switch cars too often..
2nd read few things here : http://www.uio.no/~asgeirn/Racing/frames.html

Cheers,
--
Oli
BeoRocket Racing
http://www.beorocket.co.yu/


Ian Riche

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Ian Riche » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Steve,

I have thought of that and tried it.  Just can't get used to it - and it
ruins all sense of immersion for me.  I also find it had to steer accurately
(and GPL *needs* to be steered accurately) when operating the paddles.

Ian

Ian Riches
Bedford, UK

------


Andre Warrin

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Andre Warrin » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Here's the best tip you'll ever get: Buy a decent wheel with some
split-axis pedals :)

Andre

>Any hints?

>If it helps, I'm concentrating (still! - after having the full game over a
>year) on the same tracks as were in the demo.  I've got down to 1:29.7 in
>the Lotus at Monza and a best of 1:07.5 in the Ferrari at the Glen.

>Thanks for any help!

>Ian

>Ian Riches
>Bedford, UK

>------



Liutger Franze

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Liutger Franze » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

you are refering to trailbraking here. this is a technique which needs
quite some skill and a lot of practice to be done effectively. braking
goes like this: press the brake pedal at the braking point until you
hear a bit squeeling (a bit!!). make sure your wheels don't lock up! if
the squeeling gets too loud or your wheels lock up: release the brake
until the squeeling disappears and adjust the braking pressure this way.
when you reach the turn-in point, release the brakes a abit (not
completely), turn in and while you go for the apex, release the brakes
more and more while turning more. shortly before the apex start applying
throttle and aim for an soft, little squeeling exit.

monza is good to practice trailbraking, especially the 1st lesmo and the
parabolica.

Lio

Ian Riche

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Ian Riche » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Thanks, Oli, that's really helpful.

Ian

Ian Riches
Bedford, UK

------


Martin Portma

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Martin Portma » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00


> Here's the best tip you'll ever get: Buy a decent wheel with some
> split-axis pedals :)

i have the same wheel mentioned earlier (TM Formula Sprint over here
in the UK).  it was a fairly simple operation to hack the internal
wiring about a bit with a soldering iron to give me a three axis
wheel: steering, brakes, and the loud pedal.

so, you now know what to do when your guarantee runs out!

martin.

Ian Riche

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Ian Riche » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00



> > Here's the best tip you'll ever get: Buy a decent wheel with some
> > split-axis pedals :)

> i have the same wheel mentioned earlier (TM Formula Sprint over here
> in the UK).  it was a fairly simple operation to hack the internal
> wiring about a bit with a soldering iron to give me a three axis
> wheel: steering, brakes, and the loud pedal.

> so, you now know what to do when your guarantee runs out!

> martin.

Martin,

Care to share how you did this?  I haven't held a soldering iron since my
eletronics 'O'-level, but I can still probably work out which end is which.
I seem to remember one end gets very hot - that soon teaches me :-)

Thanks,

Ian

Ian Riches
Bedford, UK

------


bph..

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by bph.. » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

I'm certain this will be declared heresy.  IMO you CAN effectively
trail brake with single axis.  Just keep the brake applied as you turn
in.  Ease off gradually but not full off.  It takes a bit of practice
to get right but works a treat.  IMO the split axis (axes?) only adds
the ability to modulate the throttle while the brake is applied to
balance the car through the corner.  Probably also makes getting back
on power faster.






> > > Here's the best tip you'll ever get: Buy a decent wheel with some
> > > split-axis pedals :)

> > i have the same wheel mentioned earlier (TM Formula Sprint over here
> > in the UK).  it was a fairly simple operation to hack the internal
> > wiring about a bit with a soldering iron to give me a three axis
> > wheel: steering, brakes, and the loud pedal.

> > so, you now know what to do when your guarantee runs out!

> > martin.

> Martin,

> Care to share how you did this?  I haven't held a soldering iron
since my
> eletronics 'O'-level, but I can still probably work out which end is
which.
> I seem to remember one end gets very hot - that soon teaches me :-)

> Thanks,

> Ian

> Ian Riches
> Bedford, UK

> ------



Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
David Ewin

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by David Ewin » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00


> The braking is proving less easy to improve.  I'm using a thrustmaster
> sprint wheel which cannot have the pedals in spit axis mode, so I cannot
> follow any of the advice for trail braking.

One quick correction - you can trail brake using only your right foot.  Trail
braking just refers to turning in with the brakes still pressed and then
gradually coming off them in the turn.  Now doing this without swapping ends is
another story.

Dave Ewing

--
*****************************************************
David A. Ewing

*****************************************************

Rand

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Rand » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00

You don't have to have a split axis to trail brake. Trail braking is
just braking as you turn without losing the rear end.  Being able to
feather the throttle as you do it improves the transition from brake
to throttle but is not essential to being able to trail brake.

On Wed, 26 Jan 2000 15:14:17 -0000, "Ian Riches"




>> Just a thought, could you not get split axis by using the paddle for
>> braking and the accell pedal? Might be hard to train the body to do
>> so. . .

>> SLG

>Steve,

>I have thought of that and tried it.  Just can't get used to it - and it
>ruins all sense of immersion for me.  I also find it had to steer accurately
>(and GPL *needs* to be steered accurately) when operating the paddles.

>Ian

>Ian Riches
>Bedford, UK

>------



To email me remove the "u"s
David Ewin

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by David Ewin » Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:00:00


> I'm certain this will be declared heresy.  IMO you CAN effectively
> trail brake with single axis.  Just keep the brake applied as you turn
> in.  Ease off gradually but not full off.

Not heretical at all.  In fact, I believe this is how Jim Clark did it.

Dave Ewing

--
*****************************************************
David A. Ewing

*****************************************************

GTX_SlotCa

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by GTX_SlotCa » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Actually, trail braking doesn't mean you actually have to use the brake.

Slot



> > I'm certain this will be declared heresy.  IMO you CAN effectively
> > trail brake with single axis.  Just keep the brake applied as you turn
> > in.  Ease off gradually but not full off.

> Not heretical at all.  In fact, I believe this is how Jim Clark did it.

> Dave Ewing

> --
> *****************************************************
> David A. Ewing

> *****************************************************

Richard G Cleg

GPL: How to brake without split asix controler?

by Richard G Cleg » Fri, 28 Jan 2000 04:00:00

:> I'm certain this will be declared heresy.  IMO you CAN effectively
:> trail brake with single axis.  Just keep the brake applied as you turn
:> in.  Ease off gradually but not full off.

: Not heretical at all.  In fact, I believe this is how Jim Clark did it.

  Almost certainly true because Clark was so amazingly light on brakes.
Apparently Hill had to have his brakes replaces after every race, Clark
had them replaced half way through the season because the team were
embarrased he was still using the same ones.  

--
Richard G. Clegg       Only the mind is waving
    Networks and Non-Linear Dynamics Group
      Dept. of Mathematics, Uni. of York
    www:  http://manor.york.ac.uk/top.html


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