rec.autos.simulators

Well, I don't know how you're doing it. I'm running a 200MHz AMD K6 on a

turn off is the sky, and excepting when there's smoke around, GP2 runs like
a dream in SVGA.

Psycho

Pretty much the same here with my 233 mmx.
--
Don Burnette
I-65 Racing
Dburn on Ten

snip

I thought I'd try a little experiment the other day...

A friend has just got a Dell PII-300 with 64Mb SDRAM, 8Mb Millennium 2
and 3Dfx card.
He's no sim fan but I took what are probably the three most popular sims
around for a peek an a monster piece of kit.
All tests run under Win95 with IE4.

F1RS:
Simply flawless.  Runs totally maxxed out, with replays and no tweaks,
and there's not even a hint at a stutter.  That start line slowdown?
Nothing.  Not at Monaco, not at Spa, nowhere.
I want to upgrade my P200.

N2:
Once again, a joy to behold.  I have a Rendition (V1000) card in my PC
along with the Righteous, so the image quality was not as good on the
PII, but it stomped all over mine as regards framerate.  Once again,
Maxxed out graphic detail, 39 cars (that's all of 'em) displayed in
front, 5 behind, and everything was smooth as you like (apart from those
non-accellerator enhanced textures).  Even full screen replays didn't
cause it headaches.
I'd love to see this with the 3Dfx patch.  Not for the framerates (they
can't be improved), but for the image quality.
Who do I sell to further line Intel's pockets?

GP2:
Well, after the success of the previous 2 we went on to the oldest kid
on this particular block.  Let's bung it into 640x480 with full detail,
set to 21.n fps, at Monaco...
I didn't take notes so forgive my approximate percentages and non-exact
framerate settings.
Sitting on the back of the grid before the start, about 166% processor
occupancy (po).  It only gets worse when things start to move, with
smoke being drawn, cars getting close.  Way over 200% po at times.
ON A PII-300!!
OK, OK, we all know that smoke and sky kill GP2, so switch them off.
And most everything in the mirrors.  And track textures.  And verges and
kerbs.  And lower the (recommended >25.n) framerates to 19.n.  So WAY
below max detail, then.  I refuse to switch off entire chunks of
scenery.
Start again at the back at Monaco.  Race underway, huge slowdown.
Almost constantly over 150% po when close to other cars.

How did this game get the reviews it did, when, almost two years down
the line there -still- is no PC the can run it comfortably at high
detail settings?
F1RS and Psygnosis F1 (bad game, I know) have been marked down for their
system requirements, but they run better, at higher detail levels, on
kit that is AVAILABLE TODAY.  It looks to me like GP2 will always have
to be compromised.

This isn't a knock on GP2, and I'm not after "well it must be your
setup, because I get 472 fps on my P133" flames, it just scares me to
think what kind of ultra-horrific monster of a ninja PC GP3 will eat.
Thought you guys might find it interesting.

Cheers

Mark
Reading, UK

Hmmmm.....

Reminds me a little of NASCAR 1, only now after all tihs time do i finally
have the kit to run it full detail (SVGA), and it doesnt matter anymore cos
nascar 2 is out. Perhaps microprose will manage the same as papyrus did and
get GP3 to look better and run faster than GP2.

p.s. i know u weren't looking for this, but on my 233 MMX GP2 runs fine most
of time (except the start at monaco) with all detail minus sky and 1 level
of trackside objects.

Thought you might be interested to note  the following things:

1)  Try turning on 39 opponents in mirrors and see if you still get the
same frame rates in N2.  Your machine should handle it, I'm just curious.

2)  I have a P2 266 with a Riva 128 graphic board AND a Monster 3d.  In
GP2, with all details on, 640X480, I get about 110-120 occupancy from the
back of the grid.    If I shut off hills, I get 90 throughout the whole
race.  The only time it goes up, (the max is 150) is if I personally spin
and can see the smoke off my own tires in front of me.  Any one else's
smoke does not effect occupancy.  Personally I would have though a P2 300
would finally handle this game once and for all.  Maybe the Matrox isn't
all it is cracked up to be.  By the way, try running this game in pure dos
mode, I bet your occupancy goes down ALOT!

This is not to say "nyah, nyah" my system's better than yours.
Instead, it points out something I've seen over and over again with
GP2 -- it seems to like certain systems better than others, apparently
with no rhyme or reason. Maybe it's really the first cousin of Windows
95!  ;-)

Jack

Even Monaco? He's talking about the start at Monaco so I can see this
being true. GP2 runs smooth on my P200 83mhz bus machine with some
details off (smoke, clouds, medium detail), but not Monaco. Actually I
think there is a graphics conversion available somewhere that removes
the buildings at Monaco just for this reason.
--
Nos


http://www.cris.com/~nosfer/index.html                

The desription of GP2 running poorly on a pII300 system sounds as
though the set-up may not be optimised for games? All the good GP2
websites have comparisons of GP2's performance on different systems,
and it should fly on a 300 MHz pc, with no probs at all?

Check them out to see what sort of performance is being achieved, and
compare to those, rather than just saying it runs crap, so I don't
like it, which is not very constructive IMO!

8?)

* Peter *  8-)   Please remove asterix from address to email.

Jeez, just goes to show how good GP2 is/was, as people are still
commenting on it, even after it has supposedly been superceded by all
the other F1 games/sims? (Remember some of them? Power F1, Formula
One, etc)

I don't know why people cannot just say hey, look, I don't like GP2,
simple. Instead they have to whine and moan and whinge, If you don't
like it, don't drive it, simple isn't it? No-one holds a gun at your
backs forcing you to use a program you don't like or appreciate?

I've come across plenty of games/sims I don't like, I tried them,
decided they were not for me, stopped using them and that was it, end
of story. If someone has a query about one of those programs, I leave
it up to the people that use the program to make comments, as they
generally know far more about them than I do. Whats the point of
whining for your whole life?

GP2, was, and still is, *THE* benchmark that all other similar
games/sims are compared to. And despite having F1RS since it was
released, and playing it to death, I'm still not convinced that GP2
has lost the top spot? F1RS has it's faults too, as does *every* game
and sim on the market, there is no such thing as the *perfect*
game/sim, and probably never will be.

8?)

* Peter *  8-)   Please remove asterix from address to email.

I just bought GP2 yesterday and I'm having a blast with it! The thing runs
great on my 233mmx, milleniumII and 64 ram. I run in svga  with all graphics on
except sky, turn off everything in the mirrors and then turn on the items I
want until it effects frame rate.
I'm afraid I've replaced my ol' favorite,icr2..I haven't  seen F1RS yet, but I
may wait a bit longer before I buy it now!
PS. Yeah, the first turn at Monaco is a bit strange, but I'm not nearly good
enough to really notice it yet<g>. It's probebly the only reason I make it
through there with my front wings intact!

don

says...

Agreed, I know most of the people who complain about the framerate on r.a.s
still love the game.  They'd just love it a whole lot more...

Oh, and as for 'decent' machine, give the guy a break.  'Decent' machines are
different every month.

Brian

I heard rumours that Intel managed to get GP2 running with everything

year. ;-)

Regards

Andrew

Pete, listen to yourself,

My system is "Decent".  I have 3 different CPU's that I swap around, K6-233,
Cx-233-M2, and Right Now a Pentium 233MMX.  128MB SDRAM, ATX-TX chipset
Motherboard (SOYO), Canopus Total 3D 128v and Pure 3D, maybe a half a dozen
sound cards, right now using a SIIG Sound Pro PCI Ensoniq card, A 21"
Mitsubshi monitor (91txm) Adaptec 2490UW and 2 7200rpm USCSI Seagate hard
disks.  Now, when I buy a game with my HARD EARNED money, and my system
won't run it adequately, that makes it a peice of shit.

Well, at least when I use F1rs and theres another car on the screen, the
action doesn't stop.

Because I spent MY MONEY for it and it didn't live up to what it was
supposed to be.

So if you buy a game and it doesn't do what it is supposed to, you just
think that's OK and go buy something else???  Like GP2 not running
adequately on any system made today??

Pete, this is the trouble with games like this.  They get used as a
benchmark rather than a simulator.

"Want to test your system.  Get GP2, if it runs AT ALL, you must have a real
nice system."  Kind of like early Quake.  When a game is considered a
benchmark program more than a game, it's not much of a game.  I like to use
driving sims that don't slow down in the turns.  Kinda defeats the purpose.
And the deal of not having the game drop frames when the detail is too much
for the machine to handle and going into a time warp is entirely too much
for me to deal with.

My $50.00 gives me the right to "Whine and ***"  Perhaps someone else
won't spend their money on the game then.

----------------------------------------------------------
If it weren't for Lawyers, we wouldn't need em.  And, did
you know that, in the United States, they're Un-Constitutional!.
George, Adam, John and the rest of the gang saw something comming!

RR #3 Box 96
Williamsport, Pa. 17701
(717) 745-7697

On Mon, 26 Jan 1998 15:46:36 -0500, "Phil Bower"